Resonator/Dobro

[bbshriver]

Recently, my fiance got the urge to try learning to play dobro/resonator type guitar (I honestly don't know what the most general term for this instrument is). She really has no musical background at all, I've tried teaching her some bass, but she just hasn't been interested enough to really work on it. She seems really excited about the resonator and wants to get one to learn on.
Anyone have some suggestions on what is the cheapest way to get one "functional" enough to learn on? Musicians Friend has one
http://folk-instruments.musiciansfri...tor?sku=519190
The reviews seem good, and it's about as cheap as anything I've found on Ebay.
Any other ideas? What about some sort of book to learn it (again starting from minimal musical experience)?

Thanks!

[BudgetRacing]

I am a closet resonator/dobro player and like you are contimplating I bought a in-expensive resonator (Fender). I like more of the bluegrass dobro sound so I converted it to a dobro using a metal nut (made for converting resonators to dobros) and bought a Stevens bar (right hand slide). I think it is a great way to start, just as most of us guitar players don't start on Martins I wouldn't spend a lot on a resonator. Personally I haven't converted from guitar player to dobro player but it is fun to jam with others (especially a bunch of guitar strummers). On the resonator side there are some really cool Ry Cooder/ Keb Mo (More recent artists) stuff to learn with open D tuning...delta slide blues are awesome!

Greg

[bbshriver]

Where can I get an education on the variations of "resonator" versus "dobro" etc?

[MarkC]

Originally Posted by bbshriver

Where can I get an education on the variations of "resonator" versus "dobro" etc?

Check out the folks at http://www.resohangout.com. Lots of good info over there, makes for a good starting point.

This link gives a nice summary as well. http://www.michaelmesser.co.uk/RESON...TRODUCTION.htm

Resonators are really a different beast, and a whole lotta fun if you ask me. Enjoy.

Mark

[MRBABAR]

Technically "Dobro" is a brand of resonator guitar but it is often used synonomously with "resonator." Also - from my experience the term dobro is more often associated with bluegrass and resonator is more often associated with blues and other types of music.

I got the itch to start playing slide a few years ago and my wife bought me a Paul Beard Gold Tone resonator - round neck. I absolutely love it and have compared it to National guitars that are 3 or 4 times as expensive and I liked my Gold Tone better.

Good luck.

[marvin gardens]

For dobro, find some old Josh Graves music...probably on many Flatt and Scruggs albums. Listen to Jerry Douglas, Keb Mo, etc. Johnny Winter is also a great inovator of the delta/Texas resonator sound. Look at guitar teachers in your area, they may teach or know folks who teach this style of playing.


Jim

[Neal]

Originally Posted by bbshriver

Where can I get an education on the variations of "resonator" versus "dobro" etc?

Dobro is a trademark name, but used generically for anything with a resonator cone in it apparently. The Dobro uses a spider cone, a National type uses a biscuit cone. On the biscuit cone, think a cone shaped like this ^ with the bridge being on a "biscuit" on the center of the point, a spider cone is placed like this -v- and the bridge has legs that go out to the ends, with the bridge in the center of that. Simplified, but basically that's it.

The spider cone has a more nasally sound, country and bluegrass guys seem to prefer that sound, the biscuit cone does not have a nasal sound, and blues guys seem to prefer that, but it's not a law.

Then there is the tricone, basically 3 smaller biscuit cones with one bridge connecting each of the "points", these tend to sustain longer and have a nice sound as well.

So, spider, biscuit and tricone are the three types.

National also makes a D model with a spider, but is known for their biscuit models and tricones. Sound is subjective, and I've gone thru many Dobro-type instruments, including a few older Dobros and found that the biscuit cone is the sound I prefer, so now just 2 Nationals, an Estralita and an M-1 tricone 12 string are the keepers. The one you point to is a spider cone, or true Dobro-type, and is it worth it? Heck, maybe, it's cheap so there's not a whole lot invested. Sometimes these can be a good intro into this type of sound for someone, as long as you're not expecting perfect set-up, etc.

Then there are the round neck and square neck models...

Spider cone:

Biscuit cone

Biscuit

Spider bridge

tricone- smaller

tricone bridge

[Neal]

Continued
Tricone

Biscuit cone

Dobro spider cone

[Allman_Fan]

Then there are the round neck and square neck models...

This is something VERY important to you.

How is she planning on playing it? Like a regular guitar or horizontal on the lap?
Regular guitar style - round neck definitely.
On the lap - get a square neck.

You CAN play a round neck on your lap, but I don't don't think many (if ANY) play a square neck using the standard guitar playing style.

I will also add that using a metal, glass, etc. slide when playing a resonator is very common, but not necessary. You can play "regular guitar" (using your left hand fingers) when playing a round neck.

[Aaron Smith]

Lots of great knowledge above. The general rule (by no means rigid) is square-neck dobro for bluegrass playing, round-neck biscuit bridge for blues. A lot of Hawaiian slack-key players preferred the tricones back in the day. There are plenty of exceptions to these rules.
Any round-neck can be set up with standard action for fretted or slide playing, or with higher action for slide only. There are a lot of exotic tunings that only a square-neck can handle, but the typical round neck with be fine in the usual slide tuning schemes; generally open D and open G spanish.

I have a Rogue biscuit-bridge triolian from Musicians Friend, and I can recommend it with some reservations. With a few upgrades and a little setup work, they can be great instruments and an excellent value.
Out of the box, mine played acceptably well with slide. The intonation was quite a bit off when fretted; turns out the factory biscuit bridge was not well made, and developed a lean under string tension. After upgrading to a genuine National cone and biscuit, cleaning up some glue and debris from the sound well, replacing the tuners, adding a strap button and giving it a good setup with new bone nut, it is an excellent instrument. I am very handy with guitars; most people would want a guitar tech to do that work. I put about $150 into parts; if you had to pay for labor, it may be another $100 on top of that.
So I think it is a nice enough beginner instrument, with major upgrade potential. After upgrading I can say that the tone and playability are every bit as good as a genuine National, although the fit and finish are obviously not as nice. Even after upgrading, it cost less than 1/4 of the equivalent National model. It is also a surprisingly nice-looking guitar.

[bbshriver]

Thanks, sounds like the round-neck version from Rogue will be a good choice for a starter.

Neither she nor I know enough to get into which type of cone, what type of music etc (I play mostly older country, and Johnny Cash, strumming/flatpicking on a dreadnaught), so just something to learn on is good enough.

I think she's expecting to play on the lap, as that's what she's seen and been attracted to, and probably slide only, which would indicate square neck, but I think the idea of better flexibility is good for the beginner version, and probably not too many exotic tunings will be used for at least a few years (I've been playing guitar for about 10 years and have yet to find a need for anything other than standard tuning).

Thanks for the replies!

Any recommendations on a good learner book?

[Mountain Fever]

I have been contemplating a resonator for awhile now, and have tried out many in an attempt to not make a mistake.

At one time, Dobro (an acronym for Dopeyra Brothers...sold to Gibson later) was one of the top two or three makers of resophonic guitars. That is far from the case these days IMHO. National seems to be the top of the heap and others share the rest of the pie.

If you want to inspire your wife, get an Allison Krauss DVD with Jerry Douglas playing the resonator...he is really good.

I have tried maybe 15 resonators accross all price points, up to about $3,500.00. I think for someone who wants to give it a solid attempt without mortgaging the farm, The Beard Goldtone Series is hard to beat. Somewhere around $600.00 street price most places for their entry level model.

Interestingly, resonator sounds are sort of origined from really inexpensive intruments that were built/modified to play mostly blues style music. So, in a way, paying $3,500.00 to get some maker's high quality signature model is counter-intuitive. I have read stories about how some of those first instruments were as crude as a washtub turned upside down with broom handle attached to it with a single piece of wire running from the edge of the tub to the end of the broom handle. The 'string'would be plucked and the tone changed by pushing down on the handle to change the pitch of the wire. Lots of similar things in those days like playing the spoons or washboard for percussion.

For someone who does not know how to play a regular guitar, I think that the squareneck (strings are about 1/2" above the neck) played with a slide is a good way to go. there are lots of tunings and the instrument can be used as an accent to the overall song.

[Neal]

Originally Posted by Aaron Smith

So I think it is a nice enough beginner instrument, with major upgrade potential. After upgrading I can say that the tone and playability are every bit as good as a genuine National, although the fit and finish are obviously not as nice. Even after upgrading, it cost less than 1/4 of the equivalent National model. It is also a surprisingly nice-looking guitar.

Let's not get carried away now...

Yeah, National is expensive, but I have yet to play a modified, set up Asian resonator that is equal. Close or close enough? Yep, which is why a lot of Republics get sold lately, and Michael Messer Resos in the UK, great instruments, and not just "for the money" either. Some of these can make you wonder why one would spend 2K on a Nat. Then you play a National, and it starts to make sense. To some, anyway.

While these under 3 Franklins resonators are great starter kits, no amount of modification will get them to that exalted and desired place. They are what they are, good starter kits.

Bob, they were developed before amplification so the guitar could be heard above the other orchestra members, and those professionals wanted quality instruments. But yeah, a lot of the old blues guys played homemade instruments, and you can hear it in some of those old recordings, just terrible sound. You'd think some of those guys didn't know how to tune, but it was mainly the instruments and I suppose strings were expensive..

[Aaron Smith]

Originally Posted by Neal

Let's not get carried away now...

Yeah, National is expensive, but I have yet to play a modified, set up Asian resonator that is equal. Close or close enough? Yep, which is why a lot of Republics get sold lately, and Michael Messer Resos in the UK, great instruments, and not just "for the money" either. Some of these can make you wonder why one would spend 2K on a Nat. Then you play a National, and it starts to make sense. To some, anyway.

While these under 3 Franklins resonators are great starter kits, no amount of modification will get them to that exalted and desired place. They are what they are, good starter kits.

Bob, they were developed before amplification so the guitar could be heard above the other orchestra members, and those professionals wanted quality instruments. But yeah, a lot of the old blues guys played homemade instruments, and you can hear it in some of those old recordings, just terrible sound. You'd think some of those guys didn't know how to tune, but it was mainly the instruments and I suppose strings were expensive..

I think this is a fair comment- the National guitars that are being built today are really superb instruments. Maybe a more accurate comment is that with resonators, a well-set-up cheapie will get you much closer to the good stuff than with a flattop acoustic. My good friend has an Estralita, and I've played the Rogue along side it a bunch of times. I would obviously rather have the Estralita, but I honestly never felt like the Rogue was leaving a lot on the table. The main difference in my hands is that the Estralita has more comfortable string spacing; a 1 11/16 nut can be pretty narrow for slide. To most people's ears, the two would sound a little "different"; I don't know that one or the other would sound subjectively better.

[brian a.]

Originally Posted by bbshriver

Recently, my fiance got the urge to try learning to play dobro/resonator .......
Any other ideas? What about some sort of book to learn it (again starting from minimal musical experience)?
Thanks!

Resonator guitars include models made by companies such as National, Dobro, Regal etc etc. The term dobro is like kleenex. Dobro is to resonators as Kleenex is to facial tissues.

Questions to be answered:
lap style or spanish (bottle neck) style?
square neck or round neck?
metal body or wood body?

Typically, resonators are played in open tunings and with a slide. Open tunings are a whole different concept than standard tuning. Slides come in two types: bars for lap style and finger slides for bottle neck. Finger slides come in a variety of materials -- metal, ceramic and glass -- and sizes depending on which finger one is to use as well as finger sizes.

Do a google search for instruction material. One source would be Paul Beard's site. Beard Guitars has instructional aids.