Any Grand Pacific Owners Around Here???

[Shades of Blue]

As ornery as I’ve been about Taylor’s V Bracing, I feel like the kid who throws a tantrum until he’s exhausted and is finally ready to cooperate.

I haven’t tried V Bracing yet, but I can’t really expect to like it. I mean come on, I LOVE low end and I hear that V Bracing is definitely lacking in lows. But, something I do love is harmonics and intonation.

I’ll be honest, the 717 looks stunning, and I’m really interested in what owners think. I still don’t quite get the whole V thing, but I know that I really like the recorded sounds of the 717 specifically.

Just curious...

[brencat]

I played a 717 builders edition (Sunburst torrefied Sitka over EIR) at the NYC Sam Ash a few weeks back. It was a nice guitar! I loved the medium-fat C neck, which was noticeably fuller than the standard Taylor neck (which I like). The semi-matte finish and overall aesthetic reminded me of a less glossy Lowden (which are also semi-matte finished).

Playability was great but the tone was 'okay,' certainly nothing to make me want to sell any of my boutiques to buy one. I wouldn't call it lightly built either. Not heavy, but could be made a lot lighter.

Nice guitar and I'm sure it will sell very well for them.

[Shades of Blue]

Originally Posted by brencat

I played a 717 builders edition (Sunburst torrefied Sitka over EIR) at the NYC Sam Ash a few weeks back. It was a nice guitar! I loved the medium-fat C neck, which was noticeably fuller than the standard Taylor neck (which I like). The semi-matte finish and overall aesthetic reminded me of a less glossy Lowden (which are also semi-matte finished).

Playability was great but the tone was 'okay,' certainly nothing to make me want to sell any of my boutiques to buy one. I wouldn't call it lightly built either. Not heavy, but could be made a lot lighter.

Nice guitar and I'm sure it will sell very well for them.

The look and the obvious player comfort is what is seducing me somewhat. That rounded edge and the neck carve. I need to snap out of it.

[MChild62]

I have a Grand Pacific 517, which has a torrefied spruce top on mahogany back & sides. I've only had it for a couple of weeks and posted a NGD a couple days ago about comparing it with a D18 in the shop. (I like the D18 so I also like a good low end!)

One thing was clear to me: the YouTube comparisons that I've since watched are helpful but only hint at the full range of what you hear with an in-person comparison. I was fortunate to have the spare time and a shop willing to let me spend hours comparing, and the 517's tone grew on me the more time spent with it. I'd forget all the talk about bracing and just spend some time trying a 717 with another good spruce/rosewood guitar, like a D28. The GP may or may not be for you, but you'll definitely have some fun. (I went to try a D18 and walked out with a 517. If you reverse this and go to try a GP 717, maybe you'll walk out with a D28 instead!)

Also, I've been in touch with another AGF'er who says his 517 has opened up a lot in the couple of months since he bought it, and is now considerably louder and fuller sounding.

[MrYelnats]

Played my first v-class Taylor's and they were the 517 and 717 Grand Pacific BE's. The 517 was ok finger picked and sweet enough flat picked/strummed. But...the 717 was amazing on all counts! It was louder finger styled or strummed, and the overtones were spectacular. Plenty of bass and sounded like it had natural reverb built in. The neck was different than I'm used to, but only took 5 minutes to adjust. I am going to think seriously about acquiring one of these. Truthfully a great sounding and playing guitar from Taylor.

[BluesKing777]

I have played my new 717e BE for exactly 2 weeks today!

Can’t put it down....still honeymoon period so I won’t gush, but.....full bare finger fingerpicker here and the new V braced “balance” is just perfect for me to get an even but big, full sound. I generally own OM/00 strung with 12s Elixirs, but this came with Elixir 13s PBs and I just restrung with the same....tuned down a bit! To do this fingerpicking needs good setup and everything...it has. The attention to detail is Lowdenesque. So put Andy Powers in the genius category with George Lowden. (Imagine if they both collaborated!). But a new design with an old shape updated for the future, with a pickup that works to boot and all in tune! Wow. Put Andy on to designing spaceships for Mars.

I will let others compare, but I will find it difficult to go back to X braced sharp edges and did I say 50 times I love the neck?


BluesKing777.

[archerscreek]

Regarding the "I still don't quite get the whole V thing," comment, I'll offer my simple explanation because I've never read it and maybe it will help.

You know how strings tend to ring out and color the tone/sound when you strike a different one? Strike an open G and the other stings ring a bit too, for example? The difference to me is that the V class bracing limits this coloring of the intended sound.

[Shades of Blue]

Originally Posted by archerscreek

Regarding the "I still don't quite get the whole V thing," comment, I'll offer my simple explanation because I've never read it and maybe it will help.



You know how strings tend to ring out and color the tone/sound when you strike a different one? Strike an open G and the other stings ring a bit too, for example? The difference to me is that the V class bracing limits this coloring of the intended sound.

Good explanation!

I think what I mean is that while V Bracing is trying to influence one portion of a guitar’s tonal spectrum, I don’t understand why this one attribute is what Taylor is hanging their hat on.

To me, V Bracing limits the top movement in the lower bout, which in turn reduces low end and while we as guitar players put so much emphasis on the type of scalloping for maximum top responsiveness, V Bracing seems to me to eliminate that aspect.

It’s like when automotive companies hang their hats on fuel economy. Well, that is great and all, but some of us want power, luxury, or size. The aim is the sum of all parts, like adding low end, highs, intonation and volume. So the addition by subtraction I don’t really understand.

It’s like when a new 1.5 ton truck comes out and they promote the fuel economy over power. Why even own a truck?

And then I realize...the goal of all companies is to constantly innovate, but lower costs and increase profit margin. Taylor is no different.

[erhino41]

I've played the 717 517 and 317 size by side.

The 717 I played was an excellent fingerstyle instrument. It had clear and deep bass response, didn't rumble or thump but it was well defined and very useable. It was slightly different in the highs than I usually hear in Taylor's but definitely still sound like a Taylor. I didn't like this one with a pick, although I didn't take the time to adjust to it.

The 517 I played was a bluegrass machine. Didn't like it with the fingers at all. I didn't spend a lot of time with this one but I could see flat pickers loving this guitar.

The 317 was an all around great guitar. It was balanced and warm with more of the typical Taylor shimmer. It was lacking the lushness of the 717 but seemed to have a more pleasing balance when strummed with a pick. It also seemed more versatile than the 517 at least on first impressions. If I were to purchase one these guitars it would have been the 317.

The x17 body shape is a winner in my experience. It brings back some of the bottom end that is clearly missing on the smaller v guitars. I did play these side by side with several other v class models. It is not a typical dread and one shouldn't expect a Martin type sound but these were all great guitars in their own right.

[Goodallboy]

Originally Posted by Shades of Blue

Good explanation!

I think what I mean is that while V Bracing is trying to influence one portion of a guitar’s tonal spectrum, I don’t understand why this one attribute is what Taylor is hanging their hat on.

To me, V Bracing limits the top movement in the lower bout, which in turn reduces low end and while we as guitar players put so much emphasis on the type of scalloping for maximum top responsiveness, V Bracing seems to me to eliminate that aspect.

It’s like when automotive companies hang their hats on fuel economy. Well, that is great and all, but some of us want power, luxury, or size. The aim is the sum of all parts, like adding low end, highs, intonation and volume. So the addition by subtraction I don’t really understand.

It’s like when a new 1.5 ton truck comes out and they promote the fuel economy over power. Why even own a truck?

And then I realize...the goal of all companies is to constantly innovate, but lower costs and increase profit margin. Taylor is no different.

A couple of questions about your posts.

First, the look and player comfort is what's appealing to you? Why no mention of tone when that seems to be the big win for this guitar.

Second, you mention that in your opinion the bass is lessened by the V-bracing, when most say the bass has been increased substantially.

I know it's just your opinion but I'm interested.

[martingitdave]

I’ve played close to 10 of them. I’ve been very hopeful that they would fit my ear because they fit my eye and hands very well. Also they have my favorite pickup ES2. Alas, as a Martin fan, the tone is not for me. I was surprised by how much the tone was not for me.

[Shades of Blue]

Originally Posted by Goodallboy

A couple of questions about your posts.



First, the look and player comfort is what's appealing to you? Why no mention of tone when that seems to be the big win for this guitar.



Second, you mention that in your opinion the bass is lessened by the V-bracing, when most say the bass has been increased substantially.



I know it's just your opinion but I'm interested.

Never played one, just going off assumption, YouTube, and hearsay. The look and construction is what is drawing my interest, but the videos don’t do the low end any favors.

All preconceived notions at this point.

[martingitdave]

Originally Posted by Shades of Blue

Never played one, just going off assumption, YouTube, and hearsay. The look and construction is what is drawing my interest, but the videos don’t do the low end any favors.

All preconceived notions at this point.

In my experience, the low end was more anemic in person than the videos. In my experience, Mics tend to add bass in recordings. It’s why so many people seem to prefer to record with mahogany versus rosewood.

[seannx]

Out of the V class Taylors I've played, the builders editions were all very nice sounding and looked fantastic, but at their price point they should be. Out of the other models, the only ones I've really liked were 314s. If I didn't have my Sitka/Walnut Taylor, I'd probably get a new 314 V class. There's something about the V-bracing and Sitka/Sapele combination that just works for my style of playing, and very balanced from bass through treble. Haven't played a Grand Pacific yet.

[MChild62]

Comparing the 517 with the D18 at the shop (and my D15 Special at home), I didn’t feel the bass was lacking. On the contrary, very full and complementary, for example playing Carter style, but definitely different.

I would not call the 517 “thin” at all but I agree 100% with martingitdave that it is not a Martin tone if that’s what you’re after.