Electric for Flesh Player?

[lfarhadi]

Until very recently, I have been almost exclusively an acoustic player, and exclusively playing with the flesh of my fingertips.

For the past year, I have been immersed in theory and playing lead lines (to backing tracks), which has piqued my interest in electric. I consider myself very knowledgeable about acoustics but pretty clueless about electrics.

The only electric I have played for any length of time is a PRS SE Custom 24 that a bass player friend of mine took in on trade, and so gifted to me a few years ago. Overall, I enjoy it -- it's quite easy to play (especially coming from acoustics) -- but the tone/response is lacking when played with fingertips.

I would like to buy an electric in the $5-10k range (probably closer to $5k) that is better suited to someone who plays with fingertips. Ideally it would also be lighter and wider in the lower bout (closer to acoustic specs) but that is less important.

A couple guitars that have been on my radar are a Collings I30 or a custom shop tele with a hotter set of pickups (like the Texas specials).

I welcome any/all feedback and thoughts. Thanks in advance!

[SaintClarence27]

Originally Posted by lfarhadi

Until very recently, I have been almost exclusively an acoustic player, and exclusively playing with the flesh of my fingertips.

For the past year, I have been immersed in theory and playing lead lines (to backing tracks), which has piqued my interest in electric. I consider myself very knowledgeable about acoustics but pretty clueless about electrics.

The only electric I have played for any length of time is a PRS SE Custom 24 that a bass player friend of mine took in on trade, and so gifted to me a few years ago. Overall, I enjoy it -- it's quite easy to play (especially coming from acoustics) -- but the tone/response is lacking when played with fingertips.

I would like to buy an electric in the $5-10k range (probably closer to $5k) that is better suited to someone who plays with fingertips. Ideally it would also be lighter and wider in the lower bout (closer to acoustic specs) but that is less important.

A couple guitars that have been on my radar are a Collings I30 or a custom shop tele with a hotter set of pickups (like the Texas specials).

I welcome any/all feedback and thoughts. Thanks in advance!

Have you considered or tried a hollowbody or a semi-hollowbody?

IME, as someone who does electric with both fingertips and pick, I typically just crank it up with fingerstyle vs keep it a little lower volume with the pick. But I'm a strat player. I would suggest hitting the LGS and playing several, but don't rule out one of the big hollowbodies.

[rockabilly69]

I'm mostly a fingerstyle person too and I use Les Pauls, SGs, Telecasters, Stratocasters, Gretsches, etc. I use mainly Ernie Ball strings Regular Slinky and have adjusted to their feel. Don't overthink it, just play. Jeff Beck and Mark Knopfler are both flesh players and both of them played many different guitars.

[imwjl]

Originally Posted by lfarhadi

Until very recently, I have been almost exclusively an acoustic player, and exclusively playing with the flesh of my fingertips.

For the past year, I have been immersed in theory and playing lead lines (to backing tracks), which has piqued my interest in electric. I consider myself very knowledgeable about acoustics but pretty clueless about electrics.

The only electric I have played for any length of time is a PRS SE Custom 24 that a bass player friend of mine took in on trade, and so gifted to me a few years ago. Overall, I enjoy it -- it's quite easy to play (especially coming from acoustics) -- but the tone/response is lacking when played with fingertips.

I would like to buy an electric in the $5-10k range (probably closer to $5k) that is better suited to someone who plays with fingertips. Ideally it would also be lighter and wider in the lower bout (closer to acoustic specs) but that is less important.

A couple guitars that have been on my radar are a Collings I30 or a custom shop tele with a hotter set of pickups (like the Texas specials).

I welcome any/all feedback and thoughts. Thanks in advance!

Delay gratification and try lots of stuff. If you're spending that much money you also have to think about amps that are 1/2 of your electrical instrument.

Collings have amazing build quality and finish plus good looks. As much as I love mine I'm also seriously in love with my Telecaster and at times think I like the format having been an acoustic player first.

Why you want those particular pickups sticks in my mind. Are you after distortion or crunchy tone? If you've been an acoustic player do you want a more articulate tone? Lots of stuff to consider. A less hot traditional ALNICO 5 magnet pickup with a boost pedal or the right amp could get you some of both. Another related matter do you want silence when not playing? If so compare the P-90 and similar humbucker Collings model with a same amp.

When you try guitars try to use same or similar amp for all your testing. Also in testing/trying be mindful of setup. Some chains and discount places might not have an otherwise wonderful guitar set up well.

Try some classic well known tube amps and modern great practice amps like the Yamaha THR and Spark amps. You want to know how loud a tube amp is when happy, and also know the solid state amps like the ones mentioned are also great in their way.

It might be hard to find boutique amps to try but I bet you can find the Mesa models that switch 2 or 5 watts to multiples higher. The models have very different personalities. A really fine Telecaster and a California Tweed 2:20 Mesa will fit in your budget, work at home and you can jam with that too.

Back to the Collings and Telecaster examples. A Telecaster can have a big or small radius neck, traditional small frets or huge ones. Most of the Collings necks are large radius and nicely middle of the road with frets. None of that is right or wrong. My Collings neck that's bigger radius is great for precise fretting and bending same time I find my smaller radius Telecaster fun for barre chords and a fun moving chords more sloppy play.

Basically, you're at the edge of a really big deep rabbit hole that can get expensive but bring lots of joy. There are regulars here who can do a much better job than my writing trying to express stuff I learned late in life.

On line or in person Dave's is one of the world's best and especially for electric guitars stores. Visit the site if only to look at his collection/museum. They usually have more of some great models than lots of stores have guitars.

[Steve DeRosa]

Originally Posted by lfarhadi

Until very recently, I have been almost exclusively an acoustic player, and exclusively playing with the flesh of my fingertips...

I consider myself very knowledgeable about acoustics but pretty clueless about electrics...

The only electric I have played for any length of time is a PRS SE Custom 24 that a bass player friend of mine took in on trade, and so gifted to me a few years ago. Overall, I enjoy it -- it's quite easy to play (especially coming from acoustics) -- but the tone/response is lacking when played with fingertips.

I would like to buy an electric...that is better suited to someone who plays with fingertips. Ideally it would also be lighter and wider in the lower bout (closer to acoustic specs)...

A couple guitars that have been on my radar are a Collings I30 or a Custom Shop Tele with a hotter set of pickups (like the Texas Specials).

I welcome any/all feedback and thoughts. Thanks in advance!

Experienced electric and acoustic player here - welcome to the dark side ; in addition to some great advice above, here's my thoughts:

• I'm not surprised that you find the tone/response lacking after coming from a lifetime of acoustic - IME (and that of a number of other converts on the Electric subforum) you're not alone; as I'm sure your aware the PRS is a more rock-oriented guitar, and typical full-size humbuckers tend to sound dark when fingerpicked (which keeps them from getting abrasive and edgy when played with hefty amounts of gain through a British-voiced tube amp - a longstanding rock setup) - you'll want to look for something naturally brighter...
• Your description of an "ideal" guitar matches several current offerings by Gretsch and Godin (I own examples of both so I speak from personal experience): full-size (16" at the lower bout, and 2-1/2" to 3" deep) and equipped with pickups that emphasize clarity and definition rather than ear-searing power - which leads me to:
• As a fingerstylist the one thing you don't need is hotter pickups - what I said about clarity and definition - the same goes for the amp you use (more about which later) - and thankfully you don't need to spend $5-10K to achieve professional-quality tone/playability/QC either. The Godin CW II (a twin P-90 single-coil pickup, hollowbody similar to the Gibson ES-175) feels/handles almost identically to the well-respected Seagull mini-jumbos (small wonder since Godin is the parent company) and weighs about as much (5 lbs.+/-) to boot - not only a familiar-feeling package, but the late Tony Bennett's guitarist used one on tour for a number of years, and I seriously doubt he was in a position to compromise his tone. Similarly, the Gretsch Electromatic 5400-Series hollowbodies (which come with Filter'Tron small-humbucker pickups similar to those long favored by Chet Atkins - whose fingerpicking credentials need no further introduction) provide a larger, more "acoustic" feeling body size slightly slimmer (but also a bit heavier at a still-manageable 7 lbs.+/-) than the Godin, with a more "electric" feeling neck (a medium C-shape - compared to the Godin's D-profile - that makes it faster for some players, especially those using thumb-over technique) and shorter scale at 24.6" versus the Godin's 24.84" - a consideration if you're accustomed to Martin-type 25.4" instruments. Best news of all is that you can have either one for under $1K - and give up none of what really counts in an electric guitar in the process...
• Finally, be aware that the amplifier you use counts for at least 50% of your final tone (along with your choice of strings - I'd recommend a wound-G set for a more familiar feel), and as a fingerpicker your primary goals should be clean headroom at a sufficient power level for your needs. In this department I'd keep an eye on what the jazzers and country pickers are using, rather than the rockers, and keep it simple: a basic clean-toned tube or analog solid-state amp (you don't need the complexities of a modeler for what you're looking to accomplish) with one or two 12" speakers should get the job done, and depending on just how much power you need (FYI when the first high-power electric-guitar amps came on the market in the late-50's, it was with the goal of maximum dynamic range for pop/jazz/country styles rather than OSHA-hazard volume levels - and I routinely practice at acceptable home levels with amps in the 50-120W range) suitable combo amps can be had for under $500 on the new or used market - which leaves you with a complete rig for significantly less than what you were willing to pay for the guitar alone. Granted there is more expensive gear to be had on both ends of the cable - but even if you choose to upgrade later, you'll never lose the need for an in-the-trenches setup that'll get it done for you night after night...

All the best,,,

[Rudy4]

Consider spending way less and try out a Cordoba Stage. Electric nylon strung guitars are VERY comfortable to play with fingers.

[Charlie Bernstein]

Judging from the Collings, it looks like you might want a hollowbody, two-pickups f-holes. On the other hand, you're also thinking about a Tele. Either would serve you well, but it's not clear what you're really looking for. What's your reasoning? Tell us more.

From Telecasters to jazz boxes, any electric guitar can be played without a pick. No electric guitar is made especially for picks or bare fingers. No pickup is, either.

But since you mentioned that you want a wide body, Gibson has plenty of jazz boxes that fill that bill — the ES-350, for example. The ES-325 is flatter, but it's a nice hollowbody.. And Paul Reed Smith, of course, has a good line of hollowbodies. Also, check out Heritage Guitars. It was started by former Gibson employees who didn't want to move when the company closed it's Montana factory. Heritage has a great reputation.

The best jazz boxes have carved tops, but that might be beyond your price range. But if you think you can swing it, do some searching.

One word of caution about extra-hot pickups, like the Tele you're thinking about: It's easy to overdrive an underwound pickup, but it's impossible to tamer an overwound pickup. So if you want versatile pickups, you don't want them hot. Lindy Fralin's and Jazon Lollar's websites are good places to start some pickup browsing.

Happy hunting. Let us know what you come up with.

You're welcome in advance.

[Glennwillow]

Originally Posted by rockabilly69

I'm mostly a fingerstyle person too and I use Les Pauls, SGs, Telecasters, Stratocasters, Gretsches, etc. I use mainly Ernie Ball strings Regular Slinky and have adjusted to their feel. Don't overthink it, just play. Jeff Beck and Mark Knopfler are both flesh players and both of them played many different guitars.

I agree with Daniel. Strats and Teles, for example, are great to play with bare fingers and nobody has to spend more than $1500 max. Mark Knopfler does great with these guitars and also with a Les Paul.

Frankly, I don't know why a PRS SE Custom 24 wouldn't work well.

- Glenn

[Bob Womack]

I agree with the advice to skip hot pickups. instead, being someone who plays with flesh and nails, I can tell you something to listen for when you audition guitars: listen for tonal articulation. You want a guitar that has a good sound when played quietly but blooms into another sound as you push it. As your technique develops you'll begin to notice this. You can pluck moving your fingers parallel to the guitar's surface, you can pluck pushing down on the string, you can even put your finger under and gently whip outward from the body. And finally, you can gently pinch a string and pull and release. Each of those methods should elicit a different sound from the guitar. Here is a live segment from David Gilmour:


He uses a vintage Gretsch DuoJet and plays with bare flesh. The middle solo begins at 2:59 and the end solo at 5:22. If you listen closely you can hear the difference between the heavier picking and the lighter picking - his tone not only becomes louder when he bears down but becomes sharper. He uses the whipping technique that I spoke of as well. That is the sort of articulation you want to hear in a guitar - not just a single tone. I can get some of that on my ES-335 with '57 Classic pickups and on a weight-relieved Les Paul as well when the amps is right on the edge of distortion.

Bob

[29er]

As others have already mentioned, try a lot of guitars of different types and see what you like. As for myself, this Gretsch 6122-1959 scratches the electric itch when I feel the need. It's a hollow body with a long scale and 1 3/4" nut width which works for me since most of my acoustics have a wider nut compared to most electric guitars. It has enough acoustic volume to be a good couch guitar for unplugged noodling.

It also has great TV Jones pickups and top shelf materials and build. It's even well below 5k new. Just throwing out what I prefer. Take your time and enjoy the process!

[doctone]

I'm still a beginner, but what I have experienced is that that a full hollow body responds differently to your fingers than a tele/strat type. The attack is kind of softer, easier to control, if this makes any sense. I feel more at home coming from the acoustic. The other thing is that my Gretsch's nut width, scale and neck profile are not too far away from my acoustic.

[SalFromChatham]

I think a 335 is a great choice for you, and will also hold its value. You can also look at some similar models from Heritage.

I have a Heritage 335 copy…

What a great neck…

[lfarhadi]

OP Here.

I really appreciate all the detailed responses. It is super helpful.

I see now that this is more than 1 deep rabbit hole... there is the electric guitar hole, the pickup hole, the amp hole, the pedal hole, etc. To be totally honest, I'm not sure I'm prepared to allocate the mental space for all that. I spent years (very enjoyably, and I think productively) doing that for vintage and luthier acoustics.

When I started on the path of deeper study of musical theory and lead playing, it was because I felt I finally felt settled with my (acoustic) quiver, so I felt liberated in focused just on playing.

Ironically (or predictably, you might say), this lead to GAS for another electric.

I think for now I will take the advice to be patient and keep trying out different models (and amps) along the lines of what has been suggested here. I live in between both Rudy's locations and definitely plan a trip there in the near future (in addition to my local guitar center). We'll see where it all goes and of course will keep everyone posted.

Thanks again for all your help.

[SaintClarence27]

Originally Posted by lfarhadi

OP Here.

I really appreciate all the detailed responses. It is super helpful.

I see now that this is more than 1 deep rabbit hole... there is the electric guitar hole, the pickup hole, the amp hole, the pedal hole, etc. To be totally honest, I'm not sure I'm prepared to allocate the mental space for all that. I spent years (very enjoyably, and I think productively) doing that for vintage and luthier acoustics.

When I started on the path of deeper study of musical theory and lead playing, it was because I felt I finally felt settled with my (acoustic) quiver, so I felt liberated in focused just on playing.

Ironically (or predictably, you might say), this lead to GAS for another electric.

I think for now I will take the advice to be patient and keep trying out different models (and amps) along the lines of what has been suggested here. I live in between both Rudy's locations and definitely plan a trip there in the near future (in addition to my local guitar center). We'll see where it all goes and of course will keep everyone posted.

Thanks again for all your help.

Not to add more fuel to the fire, but the multi effects pedals these days are amazing as well.

[mr. beaumont]

Originally Posted by lfarhadi

OP Here.

I really appreciate all the detailed responses. It is super helpful.

I see now that this is more than 1 deep rabbit hole... there is the electric guitar hole, the pickup hole, the amp hole, the pedal hole, etc. To be totally honest, I'm not sure I'm prepared to allocate the mental space for all that. .

Good guitar and a good amp and you're good to go. No need for rabbit holes.

You have a budget that will allow you top of the line stuff. Go play a bunch. There's no "electric for a flesh player." Any advice you get here is just people recommending what they like

I'd also recommend, concentrate on finding something that feels "good" not "similar to your acoustic."