Hospitals Are Ripping people off

[Silurian]

Originally Posted by Otterhound

You have the authority to stop , change and OK everything . You simply chose not to .
Be your own advocate .
What was the nature of your household accident ?
What was done upon entering the emergency room ?
How much was the bill ?
What would you have changed or stopped during all of this ?
How much of what was done did you simply disregard because you had insurance and figured that most , if not all , was going to be paid by someone else ?
Why did you not question things at the time ?
Just asking .

Probably because he was in hospital relying on the integrity and professionalism of the staff to provide him with the appropriate treatment.

He wasn't buying a new car and questioning the salesman about the usefullness of the 'optional extras'.

[Silly Moustache]

Originally Posted by fazool

Sorry to hear that. We've got excellent hospital systems around us and have had good luck. Our last three or four ER visits ended up with an evaluation and sending us home so we didn't have that "must be admitted" experience.

I know our prior health plan (called Health Care Plan) was forcing doctors into quotas and how long they could spend with patients at their office, etc.

Well on a Friday they all quit. Like, literally ALL the doctors quit. On Monday they opened their own office (they obviously had this planned) that they now own. We never missed a single appointment and continue to see the same doctors. The docs fought back against a greedy corrupt HMO that ended up going out of business (because they had no doctors).

So, I know that stuff happens. But I don't think it's the "norm".

Fazool wrote something that caught my eye : going out of "business"

Should health care be a Business or a service?

[Nyghthawk]

Originally Posted by Silly Moustache

Fazool wrote something that caught my eye : going out of "business"

Should health care be a Business or a service?

Neither. It should be a right. If not, we are portioning out life.

[fazool]

Originally Posted by Silly Moustache

Fazool wrote something that caught my eye : going out of "business"

Should health care be a Business or a service?

Good question. But, honestly, we can't really discuss that without getting into socio-politics and having the thread go downhill very quickly.

[HHP]

Originally Posted by Silly Moustache

Fazool wrote something that caught my eye : going out of "business"

Should health care be a Business or a service?

The economics work out the same either way. Its just that "business" rely on your voluntary participation and cannot mandate the conditions and cost of your use.

[jimmybcool]

If this was what they billed your insurance it is not what they were paid. And they must have run a heck of a lot of tests to get to $32,000. Likely insurance pays them about $5,000.

But the real problem is for those without insurance. They get billed the $32K and they can not reduce the bill.

[Twelvefret]

Originally Posted by Silly Moustache

Fazool wrote something that caught my eye : going out of "business"

Should health care be a Business or a service?

How are services underwritten? Do you think they just happen?

[Wozer]

Originally Posted by jimmybcool

If this was what they billed your insurance it is not what they were paid. And they must have run a heck of a lot of tests to get to $32,000. Likely insurance pays them about $5,000.

But the real problem is for those without insurance. They get billed the $32K and they can not reduce the bill.

amen on that...

I had a CAT scan about 20 years ago...the doctor told me it was going to cost "about what X-rays would cost" (pffft...yeah, righto)...got the bill and it was for just under $5k...told them to stuff it as I was misinformed (lied to IMO)...they finally reduced the bill to $1,200 and told me that's what an insurance company would have paid out...

say what????

I as a person paying out of pocket gets charged 4x what an insurance company gets charged????

now THAT (among MANY other things) is what is wrong with medical care these days.

[Kerbie]

I think we need to be careful here...

[Song Writer]

Originally Posted by Silly Moustache

I am sorry for the OP's situation, but he doesn't make it clear where/which country this occurs.

I'm aware that most (but not all) on this forum live in the USA, and so I assume that this issue has occurred in the USA, but this was not made clear.

Most other "western" nations have a very different health system.

In the UK, for instance, hospital and ambulance services and (often) medicines are free at the point of delivery. It is over stressed, somewhat disorganised and underfunded, but generally speaking it works very well, and doesn't charge people for treatment.

British hospitals are reluctant to admit unless really necessary and they now release patients much sooner than they used to, with frequent check-ups booked for some time thereafter.

I have spent much of this year visiting a hospital not local to me - in the next city west, but I can't complain about the service or the people working there. The drugs they heaped on me boggled my mind and I have the top of one of our refrigerators piled high (think a cubic yard) with meds that (I sincerely hope) I will never use, but cannot return by law.

Since April, I have lived mostly on a food substitute I'm still living on plus other drugs are delivered to my door on demand and free of charge.

Last week I visited my GP to discuss my pain meds situation, (working to reduce them) and mentioned a problem with my right shoulder (massive weight loss has caused me a lot of joint issues). I have just received a letter for physio next Thursday.

The week before I had an appointment with MAX-FAc and my first speech therapy appt., made on the same day for my convenience.

My costs in this matter have been limited to fuel to drive the 40 mile round trip, and hospital parking costs, (although they made my daily visited F.O .C.)

So, just to make it clear, things are different in different countries.

^^^^^+1

This, while anecdotal, explains why it is far more sane and humane to remove the profit motive from health care. The more you get in the black, the more it doesn't feel Hippocratic.

[Otterhound]

Originally Posted by Wozer

amen on that...

I had a CAT scan about 20 years ago...the doctor told me it was going to cost "about what X-rays would cost" (pffft...yeah, righto)...got the bill and it was for just under $5k...told them to stuff it as I was misinformed (lied to IMO)...they finally reduced the bill to $1,200 and told me that's what an insurance company would have paid out...

say what????

I as a person paying out of pocket gets charged 4x what an insurance company gets charged????

now THAT (among MANY other things) is what is wrong with medical care these days.

The only flaw that I can see in this is that you failed to negotiate before the procedure .
In the end , you were treated fairly . It's just that you needed to do what insurance companies do .
If I may be so bold , the lesson here is that far too many appear to be fearful when it comes to negotiating with doctors and hospitals or believe that they should not need to .

[jimmybcool]

Originally Posted by Otterhound

The only flaw that I can see in this is that you failed to negotiate before the procedure .
In the end , you were treated fairly . It's just that you needed to do what insurance companies do .
If I may be so bold , the lesson here is that far too many appear to be fearful when it comes to negotiating with doctors and hospitals or believe that they should not need to .

I agree with this in principle. The problem is you are negotiating at a time in your life when you fear for your life or are in serious pain. And the inherent trust we have in doctors and hospitals is ingrained. It is not a position to be in to have a fair negotiation.

I know I'm lucky as heck to have had premium insurance in 2016. I spent 3 months in hospital and the bills rang up to $300,000. My insurance wrote them down to about 1/3 of that and I paid $600. Had I not been insured it would have been ugly.

[SpiderTrap]

This was in ORLANDO FL , BCBS SAys Unecesscary TESTS that were Not Approved .

[fitness1]

I haven't read through every post, but recently both parents have been in an out a few times, and there is something I've learned.

Observation rooms are not the same as being admitted. If they are technically admitted for 3 days and end up going into a rehab facility, Medicare has to pay.

If they are in "observation" that is not the case......at least here in our local hospital in MI.

Mom was in for about 44 hours a few weeks back. She was treated for NOTHING and had very little in the way of testing (blood work etc) The bill was over 7500.00. That was "observation".

[chitz]

I have seen insurance companies not pay for "observation" stays before.
It's a crime against humanity!