Two Bose S1s as a PA system? *follow up*

[Captain Jim]

Originally Posted by DavidE

I could be tempted if two were louder than my L1M2 and had the bass of even one sub. But that's not happening.

Physics. I consider the S1 to be "about half" of an L1C. Neither of which will have the punch/bass/volume of an L1 M2. What I discovered when switching from a traditional PA with powered mixer and heavy cabs with 15/horn was that you don't need big volume to cover a specific space... something you have probably found with the L1 M2 vs a traditional PA. If you are playing to groups of 300 all the time, a pair of S1s isn't going to cut it. But, for a smaller audience size, those same S1s could be plenty enough.

Sometimes what is needed isn't volume, but coverage. An S1 isn't the answer for every situation (obvious), but there are a lot of situations where it works.

[HomeBySix]

I have been doing the same exercise lately for an open mic I run. I thought at first I could do it with an L1Compact, since its advertised for up to 100 people and we typically have half that. However, its an long rectangle bar, probably 50 feet end to end and 20 feet wide. The Compact just didn't have enough juice in that setting. So I returned it to GC for the L1S model and a B1 Bass (next step up). For what we need, with things set at half volume (using a Tonematch), we are getting great sound, to me better than our previous setup with QSC K10 and a mixer board. We have not experienced a lot of feedback, but we are having to adjust to the sound coming from behind us since we no longer use a monitor. It was often the monitor that created the feedback for us, so overall our setup has been simplified and our sound improved. The coverage is better, so folks can be talking and you can still hear the music, as previously stated its not just about volume. The sound is crisp and clean.

[Nama Ensou]

Originally Posted by HomeBySix

I have been doing the same exercise lately for an open mic I run. I thought at first I could do it with an L1Compact, since its advertised for up to 100 people and we typically have half that. However, its an long rectangle bar, probably 50 feet end to end and 20 feet wide. The Compact just didn't have enough juice in that setting. So I returned it to GC for the L1S model and a B1 Bass (next step up). For what we need, with things set at half volume (using a Tonematch), we are getting great sound, to me better than our previous setup with QSC K10 and a mixer board. We have not experienced a lot of feedback, but we are having to adjust to the sound coming from behind us since we no longer use a monitor. It was often the monitor that created the feedback for us, so overall our setup has been simplified and our sound improved. The coverage is better, so folks can be talking and you can still hear the music, as previously stated its not just about volume. The sound is crisp and clean.

I almost bought an L1C last year and opted instead for a JBL Eon One which is fairly comparable with reportedly a bit more bottom end and a touch more volume.

Previous to making that purchase I'd considered also the L1S but had not wanted to go down from the L1 MII that I already had. Lately considering starting to carry it again after a few volume/coverage fails from the Eon One.

L1 MII > L1S > Eon One > L1C > S1 is pretty much how I see it, with all of them being good choices, dependent on end user requirements.

[Tico]

Originally Posted by varmonter

Two are not any louder
than one.

I believe that is not true.
If both are set to the same gain adding a second would increase the volume by 3 dB (double power).

[DavidE]

Originally Posted by Captain Jim

Physics. I consider the S1 to be "about half" of an L1C. Neither of which will have the punch/bass/volume of an L1 M2. What I discovered when switching from a traditional PA with powered mixer and heavy cabs with 15/horn was that you don't need big volume to cover a specific space... something you have probably found with the L1 M2 vs a traditional PA. If you are playing to groups of 300 all the time, a pair of S1s isn't going to cut it. But, for a smaller audience size, those same S1s could be plenty enough.

Sometimes what is needed isn't volume, but coverage. An S1 isn't the answer for every situation (obvious), but there are a lot of situations where it works.

I use a JBL Eon One for the smaller jobs and on most of those I'm pushing it to it's limits, and sometimes a little beyond. I have a duo gig tomorrow where if the weather cooperates I'll need to add some powered pa speakers to my L1M2 to cover the area. If the prediction for rain holds, I'll be inside and the L1M2 will do nicely. An S1 would cover maybe 1% of my gigs from what I'm understanding.

[Captain Jim]

Originally Posted by DavidE

I use a JBL Eon One for the smaller jobs and on most of those I'm pushing it to it's limits, and sometimes a little beyond. I have a duo gig tomorrow where if the weather cooperates I'll need to add some powered pa speakers to my L1M2 to cover the area. If the prediction for rain holds, I'll be inside and the L1M2 will do nicely. An S1 would cover maybe 1% of my gigs from what I'm understanding.

Certainly, it comes down to the right tool for task. You can't expect an S1 to have the volume or coverage of your L1 Model 2. The OP was asking about two S1s to use as a small PA, not as the proper gear for every occasion. Sounds like you have equipment to handle the situations you play; no need to buy smaller if you don't have the use.

[lkingston]

A lot of it depends upon what kind of music you play and how loud that style of music should be. Nobody hires a fingerstyle guitar and singing duo to “rock the house”. It is rare that a two Bose S1 system wouldn’t be appropriate for what I do.

[HomeBySix]

Originally Posted by Nama Ensou

I almost bought an L1C last year and opted instead for a JBL Eon One which is fairly comparable with reportedly a bit more bottom end and a touch more volume.

Previous to making that purchase I'd considered also the L1S but had not wanted to go down from the L1 MII that I already had. Lately considering starting to carry it again after a few volume/coverage fails from the Eon One.

L1 MII > L1S > Eon One > L1C > S1 is pretty much how I see it, with all of them being good choices, dependent on end user requirements.

I saw the JBL and considered it, especially since it was a bit more bang for buck, but the sales rep talked me out of it... I think your comparison high to low is pretty much spot on.

[MikeBmusic]

My friend had the 2 S1 system set up last night. It sounded good, no harshness. I thought the high end of the vocals was a bit dull, but that could have been the mixer EQ settings. Guitars all sounded smooth.
Volume and spread was plenty for the mid-size somewhat-noisy room. Largest combo using it was 3 acoustic guitars and 2 mics, and nothing got muddied/muffled.

[KevWind]

Originally Posted by Tico

I believe that is not true.
If both are set to the same gain adding a second would increase the volume by 3 dB (double power).

The point is "louder" isn't really the issue or necessarily the reason for two over one.
Two are going to move twice as much air and thus have better coverage . Which will be percieved buy the audience .

And is the reason all of the bigger professional acts aways have two of the big curved line array's, one on either side of the stage.

[lkingston]

I know I am really tempted to get a second S1. My setup would then be my Elite Acoustics D6-8 mixing my guitar and two vocals and pointed at myself as a monitor, and the two S1s out towards the audience. If the venue had a house PA I would feed that from the D6-8 instead of the S1s. If I occasionally needed a better system I would just rent it. I don’t see that happening very often though.

[lkingston]

For the kind of small coffee shop or living room performances where a Fishman Loudbox Mini would suffice, I would just use the D6-8 by itself. For small restaurants and bars, I would use the D6-8 plus one S1 on a stand.

[Chriscom]

Largest combo using it was 3 acoustic guitars and 2 mics, and nothing got muddied/muffle

That's impressive. I would have thought that's too much.

Thanks for the report.

[lkingston]

Originally Posted by MikeBmusic

My friend had the 2 S1 system set up last night. It sounded good, no harshness. I thought the high end of the vocals was a bit dull, but that could have been the mixer EQ settings. Guitars all sounded smooth.

Volume and spread was plenty for the mid-size somewhat-noisy room. Largest combo using it was 3 acoustic guitars and 2 mics, and nothing got muddied/muffled.

How big was this room? About how many people? Also, what kind of mics?

[Methos1979]

Originally Posted by lkingston

I know I am really tempted to get a second S1. My setup would then be my Elite Acoustics D6-8 mixing my guitar and two vocals and pointed at myself as a monitor, and the two S1s out towards the audience. If the venue had a house PA I would feed that from the D6-8 instead of the S1s. If I occasionally needed a better system I would just rent it. I don’t see that happening very often though.

I was really tempted to do this as well but in the end we decided to get the QSC k8.2 for the really louder needs. It could have gone either way since price-wise it's a wash between the two. First all-battery operated outdoor gig tomorrow!