#46
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“Everything from small builders up to Collins” is a description, not a definition. “Guitars built by companies with fewer than 100 employees” would be a definition. |
#47
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Terry Whipple builds "boutique" guitars at far too friendly prices. I have been thinking about one for a couple years. Whipple Creek Guitars
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‘00 Martin HD28LSV ‘04 Martin D18GE ‘22 Burkett JB45 |
#48
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Presumably this person is not working on all parts of the guitar at the same moment. He would have to finish a neck, or a brace, or a saddle, and set it aside to work on another piece of the guitar and later assemble them. How is this different from having those parts made by various people? Is it in the assembly itself? How so? |
#49
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Ok. You're just being pedantic.
Feel free to go look up a range of working definitions and decide on what works for you. The OP defined it contextually based on their values and considerations.
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"What have I learned but the proper use for several tools" -Gary Snyder Bourgeois DR-A / Bowerman "Working Man's" OM / Martin Custom D-18 (adi & flame) / Martin OM-21 / Northwood M70 MJ / 1970s Sigma DR-7 / Eastman E6D / Flatiron Signature A5 / Silverangel Econo A (Call me Dan) |
#50
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OP - enjoy the hunt ! Lots of GREAT guitars out there! Cheers! |
#51
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Well said^^^^^^^ |
#52
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“Boutique” is better left vague. I gotcha. |
#53
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hans
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1971 Papazian (swiss spruce/braz RW) 1987 Lowden L32p (sitka/ind RW) 1992 Froggy Bottom F (19th cent. german spruce/koa) 2000 Froggy Bottom H12c (adir/ind RW) 2016 Froggy Bottom K mod (adir/madrose; my son's) 2010 Voyage-Air VAOM-2C http://www.soundclick.com/hanstunes (recorded on Froggy H12c) |
#54
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So, give me a guitar made by a old and very experienced luthier (Goodall and Thompson being my recommendations) who has built up mastery of all those aspects of luthiery. Or if that's too costly, then give me a team of masters of each task, someone who's shaped ten thousand necks, another who's voiced ten thousand tops, etc. all overseen by a master of guitar design and construction, and so forth. Whether it's a $1,500 Larrivee or a $15,000 Bourgeois, they are factory guitars—just from very good factories. All the above is the theory. In practice, a chain is as strong as it's weakest link, so if you get an apprentice for one task instead of a master, you get quality control problems. Further, management may be temped by short term profits to hire unskilled, lower-wage workers or to lower quality standards, especially if the business is owned by distant corporate overlords (cough, Gibson) that care more about profit than guitars. This, in my view, is where solo luthiers have an advantage. Their name is on the door, and they live and die by their reputation and word of mouth. They are much less likely to lower their standards and let a bad one slip out the door, and much more likely to eat the loss on the materials and labor and start over, lest that bad guitar turn into a torpedo that scuttles their livelihood. |
#55
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Some assumptions there. But good stuff. I do like your high standards.
It should be said, the word “factory” simply means making. But yes, it connotes products cranked out impersonally for mass consumption by a line of time-clock punching dimwits flinging wood with no concern for the success of the company. No, but I wonder if multiple masters in a small business are better at sharing a deep well of experience, and building on one another’s ideas, than say a recently bereaved loner with a worsening cough and diminishing strength. That said, I like the single luthier criterion for “boutique.” It’s clear. |
#56
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Yes, clear but some strange exceptions.
For example, the Yamaha LL-56 and LS-56 guitars would be boutique, since they are, supposedly, made by one person. Yet few would consider Yamaha a boutique brand. 😄 Or, Goodall would not be boutique, because they have two builders (father and son). So it's a definition, but with some asterisks. |
#57
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What do you want in your next guitar? All the makers mentioned so far can make a great guitar and each will have some degree of individuality about what they produce. A Lowden isn’t a Goodall and a Goodall isn’t a Northwood. Playing the three side by side is the best way to hear the strengths of each maker. So, try before you buy, as you mentioned in an earlier post. As many as you can and side by side if you can too. I see you are in Greensboro, so you are in reasonable distance of Sound Pure in Durham, and Dream Guitars in Asheville. SP has quite a few used acoustics in your price range and a bunch of new ones you can try at the same time to get a feel for each maker. DG is limited in your price range at the moment but they do get them in and they also have a massive range of other used guitars. Visiting with the genial Paul Heumiller and trying a bunch of guitars can be a very enjoyable and educational day. You are right about used prices on the AGF being all over the place. I recently saw a 20+ year-old guitar in the Classifieds with an asking price pretty much the same as a readily available brand new one. So instead of the AGF, have a look at the websites of the shops mentioned above to get a better idea of prices (recognising that they typically include their commission as 20 – 25% of that price). Or, visit the SCGC website and see how they price all the variables in their custom build section; it is very helpful to understand what impact wood choice and various embellishments add to a new price, and part of those costs will be reflected in the used price. My personal rule of thumb is that a used guitar in great condition will sell at around 45-55% of its true new price via a private sale. That is a long term view and Covid may be upsetting it in the short term. And of course there are people that will ask more than this and probably people that will pay more too. Last edited by colins; 10-27-2021 at 04:54 AM. |
#58
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Never meant for this to be a discussion about what defines boutique. I assumed everyone understands what I meant. But I guess I’m just a vague person. I don’t like clearly defined anything so I would include makers like Breedlove, especially their Oregon series, and possibly a unique model Larrivee if I could play them first.
In all honesty I was mainly thinking SCGC, collings, H&D, Bourgeois, Goodall, Thompson, all the most popular builders, as well as Webber, etc. I was trying to get an idea of which models from those makers are the ones in my price range (used) because probably 75% of them are way over my budget. I will also check out the smaller builders that folks have mentioned here - I appreciate the suggestions! |
#59
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I still think you should consider looking at Iris guitars as a really unmatched offering at the price point - small shop, top-shelf builders (typically called boutique by most standards) but they are making exceptionally affordable guitars that don't cut any corners for playability or sound. Really quite amazing what you get for $2000 or just a little over in most cases. |
#60
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Iris is good. I've bought and sold Bourgeois and Collings guitars for less than 3 grand.
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