side bending?????

[dreadsftw!]

okay so a professional side bending setup would run me around 300.00 so i was wondering if i used the standard bending pipe i could use this bending pattern to bend and heat the wood against? here is the pattern: http://www.bluescreekguitars.com/sho...roducts_id=208

[Neil K Walk]

Check out this thread over at the Kit Building Forum:

http://www.kitguitarsforum.com/board...php?f=4&t=2856

About halfway down in the discussion there's this link for a DIY Low Cost Bending Machine that costs $23 or so make, including the bending form:

http://www.lint.org/TechNotes/lowcostbender.html

[charles Tauber]

Originally Posted by dreadsftw!

i was wondering if i used the standard bending pipe i could use this bending pattern to bend and heat the wood against?

No. That is an "insert" for the bending "machine". In a bending machine, heat is supplied either by light bulbs or by electric blanket. As kwakatak pointed out, you can make your own bender for relatively little cost, including making the insert in your link.

If you are unable to make a bender, you likely will be unable to make a guitar unless from a kit with many of the steps already completed, such as having bent sides.

[martinedwards]

there are a bunch of ways to bend "on the cheap"

if you wet and warm the wood then you can force it into a mould with clamps (depending on the wood.....)

I used a steam wallpaper stripper to good effect with walnut and oak sides but maple was too brittle.

soaking the sides in a trough of just boiled water from a saucepan for 10 mins should be just as good.

another cheap alternative was a hot air blow gun into a blocked pipe.

worked great till the gun died......

I have seen pics of a guy who used a caterer's blow torch to heat a small saucepan held by the handle in a vice.......

When I eventually build my "man cave" the chimney from the wood burning stove will be supported by wall brackets so that I'll be able to use it!!

[charles Tauber]

Originally Posted by martinedwards

there are a bunch of ways to bend "on the cheap"

One way I've been using for 30 years, is simply a section of hardware-store copper pipe attached with strapping to a piece of wood. A propane torch is put in one end and the copper pipe is "sealed" on the other end with a screw-on lid from a jar of jam. An oven mitt under the pipe keeps the wood from burning. Pretty Mickey Mouse, but under $10 or so.

[Kitchen Guitars]

Originally Posted by charles Tauber

One way I've been using for 30 years, is simply a section of hardware-store copper pipe attached with strapping to a piece of wood. A propane torch is put in one end and the copper pipe is "sealed" on the other end with a screw-on lid from a jar of jam. An oven mitt under the pipe keeps the wood from burning. Pretty Mickey Mouse, but under $10 or so.

On that rig I use Aluminum Foil wrinkled into a ball and shoved in the hole. Lets it breath a touch.

[bigsnaketex]

I built a mold with the clamps (like a fox bender) but instead of all the heat blankets and such, I installed the guts from an old gas space heater underneath it and lined it with light gauge stainless. I "bake" it at about 250 after I boil my wood for several hours.

Works like a charm!

[arie]

Originally Posted by dreadsftw!

okay so a professional side bending setup would run me around 300.00 so i was wondering if i used the standard bending pipe i could use this bending pattern to bend and heat the wood against? here is the pattern: http://www.bluescreekguitars.com/sho...roducts_id=208

if you want to do it on the cheap then you're probably better off making a hot pipe and using a propane torch. trace and cut yourself a half template out of decent plywood to compare against.

[Comfyfoot]

A bbq charcoal starter in a muffler pipe with a dimmer switch, a bit more controllable then the propane.
Laminating sides thinned to .06 or so is a good option as well, they can be squished in a mold or a basic vacuum bag set up. What ever method you decide upon, the investment in the tooling is relatively small and long lived. My thinking was to invest in the blanket and slats, and make an Everett style mold, which is like a Fox pattern without the frame, uses basic nuts and bolts. There is a pic of this on the link posted by Kwak. I will upgrade to Fox bender sometime.

[arie]

for me i use a heating blanket and a fox style machine and molds that i built from scratch. i use a bending iron for kerfing and binding. imo part of lutherie is making your own tools.

[charles Tauber]

Originally Posted by Comfyfoot

A bbq charcoal starter in a muffler pipe with a dimmer switch, a bit more controllable then the propane.

That sounds like it would work well.

Just for the record, a propane torch is very easy to control. What I like about the torch is that takes almost no time to heat the pipe. (I use it in addition to the Fox bender that I've used for the past 30 years.)

[murrmac123]

Originally Posted by bigsnaketex

I "bake" it at about 250 after I boil my wood for several hours.

Works like a charm!

You boil your wood for several hours ? What species of wood are you using for your sides ?

If you boiled mahogany sides for "several hours" you would end up with mahogany soup ...

[naccoachbob]

I'm curious about the boiling or saturation of wood in any respect. The wood we use for backs and sides is usually dried pretty well for us. To introduce that much water seems like it's just asking for problems. Maybe it does work. I'm just raising the point out of curiosity.
Thanks,
Bob

[Joeval]

Originally Posted by naccoachbob

I'm curious about the boiling or saturation of wood in any respect. The wood we use for backs and sides is usually dried pretty well for us. To introduce that much water seems like it's just asking for problems. Maybe it does work. I'm just raising the point out of curiosity.
Thanks,
Bob

As I understand it, when you heat it most of the water we introduce when we soak it it boiled off. It's the steam generated that lets us bend the wood, not just the water or just the heat.
(Or, I might be dead wrong, I've not actually done any bending yet... Soon though!)



A lot of what I've seen says rosewood and such can be soaked, maybe for half an hour or so, but some of the more highly figured woods only need spraying or misting with water? Can anyone more experienced weigh in on this?

[charles Tauber]

Originally Posted by Joeval

As I understand it, when you heat it most of the water we introduce when we soak it it boiled off. It's the steam generated that lets us bend the wood, not just the water or just the heat.

My understanding is that it's the heat. The "latent heat" in the steam distributes the heat more evenly and faster.

In practice, just adding water won't plasticize the wood sufficiently; adding heat, without the water does, but, burning and scorching are reduced with the use of water/steam.

One potential result from too much water is that the sides will "potato chip", not remain flat/ripple across their width, requiring more work.

A lot of what I've seen says rosewood and such can be soaked, maybe for half an hour or so, but some of the more highly figured woods only need spraying or misting with water? Can anyone more experienced weigh in on this?

There are a variety of ways to bend wood. Which to use depends upon the preference of the woodworker, their experience and the setup they have accessible. Some soak the wood, some boil it, some steam it, some mist the surface. What to use, in part, depends upon what method one uses to actually bend the wood - an unheated press, a heated press, a heat blanket, a traditional hot bending pipe...