live performance with different tunings

[MartinDetune]

I play in an acoustic band (singer, steelstring-guitar, double bass).
I use several different open tunings in our set, currently standard + 6 alternate tunings. I use a stompbox tuner to tune to 440Hz in order to keep in tune with our bass player.

Therefore we have to deal with tuning breaks in our live performance.

What kind of advice from open tuning experts to deal with retuning during the set is out there?

1) The other two band members tell stories during the tuning breaks (our current solution)?

2) two guitars, less retuning?

3) same as 2) plus a guitar tech?

4) seven guitars (expensive...)

5) Adrian Leggs solution with banjo tuners? Experiences?

6) Any other suggestions?

Looking forward to an interesting discussion,

Martin Detune

[billyfamilyvide]

A mix of 1 and 2. Keep the stories short, personal and funny I like when I vibe with a band beyond the music. Short little quips into their lives are a great way to do that.

[David Youngman]

Hi Martin,
I also use a lot of tunings in my performances. I agree that having a couple of guitars and just filling the time with talking is best.

I was watching a video of Tommy Emmanuel recently talking about performing with different tunings and he commented that tuning between songs is boring for one thing and second is that the guitar needs time to settle into a tuning. Not only will the guitar have trouble staying in tune but the tone can be affected as well. Since seeing that video that's when I started bringing a second 6 string.

I've also started to try not to use so many different tunings. I'm getting closer to being mostly Standard and DADGAD.

One other thought about filling that tuning time would be to have one or all of the other musicians start the song while you tune (making it musical of course).

[MartinDetune]

I am interested in that Tony Emmanuel video.
Is it in youtube or is it on DVD?
Could you give me some more infos about the video?

Thank you,

Martin

[Hotspur]

Originally Posted by MartinDetune

I play in an acoustic band (singer, steelstring-guitar, double bass).
I use several different open tunings in our set, currently standard + 6 alternate tunings. I use a stompbox tuner to tune to 440Hz in order to keep in tune with our bass player.

Therefore we have to deal with tuning breaks in our live performance.

What kind of advice from open tuning experts to deal with retuning during the set is out there?

1) The other two band members tell stories during the tuning breaks (our current solution)?

2) two guitars, less retuning?

3) same as 2) plus a guitar tech?

4) seven guitars (expensive...)

5) Adrian Leggs solution with banjo tuners? Experiences?

6) Any other suggestions?

Looking forward to an interesting discussion,

Martin Detune

I my order of preference would probably be 3, 4, 2, 1.

It's not a big deal if you have to stop and tell a story once or twice during a set while a guitarist retunes - so long as you're comfortable and confident that you can retune quickly, it's no big deal.

But if you need seven different tunings, that's just unworkable. It's a performance killer.

Having two guitars and no tech doesn't really solve the problem, because you're basically only saving yourself a single retune.

There might be some wiggle room depending on the tunings. eg, if you've got a guitar that doesn't need a total retune when you go from standard to drop D, you could do that between songs no problem.

The other thing I'd do is re-arrange some of the songs. I want to put this nicely: there's no way in hell you NEED seven different tunings. There are ways to play some of those songs in other tunings. Maybe it's not the best possible way to play the song, but ask yourself seriously if the subtleties lost are really going to be noticed by your audience, especially since you're playing in a band context. You could also consider the use of partial capos to reduce the number of tunings you need.

[David Youngman]

Here's the link for the Tommy Emmanuel video

http://tommyemmanuel.tv/index.html?c...-emmanuel-gear

You have to register with an email to watch the full video (FREE). In this video he talks briefly about playing with different tunings around the 13:50 mark. If you're not already familiar with Tommy, I strongly recommend you check out his playing and music. He's one of the very few guitarists, IMO, that brings it all together (Performance, Musicality, Technique, God-given talent).

[donh]

Plan the tuning shifts so you change only one or two strings per change.

Also, practice the retuning itself and practice listening to the whole guitar as you retune. Eventually you can get to where you hear all the strings and their relative positions and can juggle them in tune far far faster.

Go listen to Peter Mulvey live.

[dberch]

I also use many tunings and have struggled with this same issue. I always take two guitars, one for regular and one for Open D. Sometimes I'll take a 3rd guitar for open G.

What I've found is most of the other tunings I use are just one string (or two) away one of those.

For example, I do one song in DADGAD. I grab the open D guitar and tune the 3rd string up a half step. Double drop D is one string away from open G. Etc...

Also, I use a Boss Tu-2 tuner so I can mute and talk while tuning. It seldom takes more than a few seconds to mute, swap guitars, re-tune one string, and go.

Hope this helps,
David

[williejohnson]

Originally Posted by Hotspur

I want to put this nicely: there's no way in hell you NEED seven different tunings.

I couldn't agree more. Using alternate tunings is fun but using seven different tunings for live performance is not a good idea.

[Andy C]

It depends how different the tunings are from each other. If they're similar enough so that there's only one or at most two strings to retune in order to get from one tuning to another, you can get pretty slick at it. You could work at this, building up a feel for how the machines need to be tweaked, using the inline tuner almost as a confirmation rather than a guide. Two guitars could help here if the tunings can be organised into a couple of related groups. I'd try to arrange the setlist so that the number of strings to be retuned between items is minimised and, if it's possible while maintaining a reasonable sequence to the set, try to order things so that you're tuning strings down rather than up. Much less fraught.

Of course, the other thing to do is to get all your songs so blindingly good that the long, riotous applause at the end of each one gives you plenty of cover to get your retuning done!

[Laird_Williams]

Originally Posted by dberch

I also use many tunings and have struggled with this same issue. I always take two guitars, one for regular and one for Open D. Sometimes I'll take a 3rd guitar for open G.

What I've found is most of the other tunings I use are just one string (or two) away one of those.

For example, I do one song in DADGAD. I grab the open D guitar and tune the 3rd string up a half step. Double drop D is one string away from open G. Etc...

Also, I use a Boss Tu-2 tuner so I can mute and talk while tuning. It seldom takes more than a few seconds to mute, swap guitars, re-tune one string, and go.

Hope this helps,
David

I play a lot of contemporary fingerstyle and the varied tunings are a must. I approach things in a manner similar to this. Instead of thinking of the individual tunings, I think of "families" of closely-related tunings. I have a guitar for each "family", and going from one tuning to another within a family is usually a matter of 1 or 2 strings. The guitar does not need much 'settling' into a tuning because not much has changed. Further, the guitar setup can be optimized for the 'central' member of the tuning family and then tunings are short and stay stable.

I use 3 guitars:
One for Standard/Drop-D
One for Open-D/DADGAD/Open-G
One for CGCGCD/Open-C/CACGCE/EACGCE

I also plan my setlists to minimize the number of strings re-tuned between songs. For example, I almost always play songs on that last guitar so that the tunings are used in the order shown or its reverse - which is ONE string difference between tunings.

And I'd like to point out that this strategy helps avoid wasted time in practice too.

Of course - then there are the two songs with 'nightmare' tunings...