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  #1  
Old 09-11-2019, 07:32 PM
Matt G Matt G is offline
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Default Timberline all Mahogany

I'm thinking of getting a Timberline T20 (all mahogany). My biggest reservation is the mahogany top. I'm used to spruce tops, and I wonder if the mahogany will be a lot quieter and less dynamic. The all hog 6-string guitars I've played have less dynamic range than the spruce tops.

I have listened to Jamie Dupuis play his Timberlines, with various hard wood tops, and they sound plenty dynamic and responsive. But I've never heard him play it live. So maybe the recording sounds better than in real life.

Any one have any input on this--any experience with all mahogany harp guitars vs spruce tops?

Thanks,
Matt
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  #2  
Old 09-12-2019, 04:44 AM
philjs philjs is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Matt G View Post
I'm thinking of getting a Timberline T20 (all mahogany). My biggest reservation is the mahogany top. I'm used to spruce tops, and I wonder if the mahogany will be a lot quieter and less dynamic. The all hog 6-string guitars I've played have less dynamic range than the spruce tops.
Hi Matt,

I received my T30HGc about a month ago (for the gloss finish and other relatively minor upgrades, eg. the ebony tuner buttons, the bevel, etc., not because I expected it to sound any different). I had prior experience with an all-mahogany Martin J12-15 (which I loved) so I really didn't sweat the mahogany top, but I have no experience with a spruce-top harp guitar so take this with a grain or two of salt.

Consider the SIZE of that top! It's NOT quiet, nor does it lack dynamic range. The bass is LOUD and it just blooms. I did find it a bit "crisp" right out of the box so "warmed" it up by restringing with EXP phosphor-bronze strings (replacing the 80/20 set it ships with), and since I'm a DADGAD player, I restrung with mediums on the down-tuned strings and also re-strung for a sub-bass tuning of GABCEG tuning (modified Bennett subs as per a recommendation from Frank Doucette).

They are, frankly, as good as you've heard in videos. Check out the T30HGc demo by Scot Ryder...this is pretty close to what mine sounds like (with Scot playing it, maybe, and a little less reverb!). Like Scot I play with a variety of partial capos so this video really sold me on investing in this new venture. It's a whole new world, and I'm just beginning to explore!



FYI, I've got 6 Rees Harps sharping levers incoming so my next trick will be making some pretty major additions to that sub-bass head...! More on that journey will follow...

Phil
__________________
One Size Does Not Fit All

Asturias: '17 GS Custom (Euro spruce/mahogany) Crosby: '10 FSE (redwood/black walnut), '10 Bouzar (spruce/maple),
'12 JE Baritone Multiscale (redwood/black walnut), '19 Cittar (Lutz spruce/mango) Furch: '17 S22CMc (cedar/mahogany)
Larrivée: '89 J-09 (spruce/rosewood) Lowden: '10 O23c (cedar/Claro walnut) Timberline: '19 T30HGc (all mahogany)


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Last edited by philjs; 09-12-2019 at 05:58 AM.
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  #3  
Old 09-12-2019, 07:49 AM
jaymarsch jaymarsch is offline
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I have nothing to offer in terms of experience with the model you are looking at, Matt, but I so appreciate philjs sharing that video. Nice tone on that all-mahogany harp guitar though I don't know if it matches what you want to hear in terms of dynamics.

Best,
Jayne
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  #4  
Old 09-12-2019, 11:03 AM
Matt G Matt G is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by philjs View Post
Hi Matt,

I received my T30HGc about a month ago (for the gloss finish and other relatively minor upgrades, eg. the ebony tuner buttons, the bevel, etc., not because I expected it to sound any different). I had prior experience with an all-mahogany Martin J12-15 (which I loved) so I really didn't sweat the mahogany top, but I have no experience with a spruce-top harp guitar so take this with a grain or two of salt.

Consider the SIZE of that top! It's NOT quiet, nor does it lack dynamic range. The bass is LOUD and it just blooms. I did find it a bit "crisp" right out of the box so "warmed" it up by restringing with EXP phosphor-bronze strings (replacing the 80/20 set it ships with), and since I'm a DADGAD player, I restrung with mediums on the down-tuned strings and also re-strung for a sub-bass tuning of GABCEG tuning (modified Bennett subs as per a recommendation from Frank Doucette).

They are, frankly, as good as you've heard in videos. Check out the T30HGc demo by Scot Ryder...this is pretty close to what mine sounds like (with Scot playing it, maybe, and a little less reverb!). Like Scot I play with a variety of partial capos so this video really sold me on investing in this new venture. It's a whole new world, and I'm just beginning to explore!



FYI, I've got 6 Rees Harps sharping levers incoming so my next trick will be making some pretty major additions to that sub-bass head...! More on that journey will follow...

Phil
Hi Phil,

Thanks for your detailed response. Glad to hear your Timberline is loud and responsive. I dabble in DADGAD, and I'd love to play a harp guitar in it.
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  #5  
Old 09-12-2019, 11:04 AM
Matt G Matt G is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jaymarsch View Post
I have nothing to offer in terms of experience with the model you are looking at, Matt, but I so appreciate philjs sharing that video. Nice tone on that all-mahogany harp guitar though I don't know if it matches what you want to hear in terms of dynamics.

Best,
Jayne
Hi Jayne,

I agree--that all-mahogany harp guitar does sound good. I think it's plenty dynamic in the video. It would probably work fine for me.

Matt
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  #6  
Old 09-12-2019, 02:00 PM
Naboz Naboz is offline
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I like Phil's point; that the size of that whole top gives a substantial surface to provide dynamic range that probably makes up for the mid-range tendency of mahogany tops (my perception). I'll listen to the video when I get to my good headphones.
My Holloway HG is always in DADGAD--I use GHS True Mediums (along with whatever brand subs can be acquired , usually GHS or D'Add' from Elderly Instruments); love the depth in that tuning!
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  #7  
Old 09-12-2019, 05:59 PM
Matt G Matt G is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Naboz View Post
I like Phil's point; that the size of that whole top gives a substantial surface to provide dynamic range that probably makes up for the mid-range tendency of mahogany tops (my perception). I'll listen to the video when I get to my good headphones.
My Holloway HG is always in DADGAD--I use GHS True Mediums (along with whatever brand subs can be acquired , usually GHS or D'Add' from Elderly Instruments); love the depth in that tuning!
Naboz,

The surface area of the top is truly massive. Apparently the lower bout is less than 16" across, from the specs I found today. So it seems like it would be comfortable enough. (My favorite guitar is 16.25, and it's not too wide.)
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  #8  
Old 09-15-2019, 11:47 AM
Naboz Naboz is offline
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Default Scot Ryder

Wow! I wish I could get that sound in a recording--beautifully set up! Scot's playing reminds me some of Stephen Bennett. But a very soulful playing (of an original?).
Phil, you say your Timberline sounds like that (without the reverb)?
Then you must be really happy.
My Holloway is a Lifer, but that all mahogany Timberline was lacking nothing in range in that video...and has piqued my interest. (The Big Minus is the 1 11/16 nut.)
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  #9  
Old 09-15-2019, 01:54 PM
philjs philjs is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Naboz View Post
Phil, you say your Timberline sounds like that (without the reverb)? Then you must be really happy.
My Holloway is a Lifer, but that all mahogany Timberline was lacking nothing in range in that video...and has piqued my interest. (The Big Minus is the 1 11/16 nut.)
The nut is actually 44mm (1.73").

I'm very happy, and impressed, with the T30HGc. It might sound more like Scot's recording if I put a Tonewood Amp on it (and he was playing it) but it is a wonderful sounding instrument, on top of being a harp guitar!

The mahogany top lacks nothing in crispness and treble response -- I don't think a spruce lover could be disappointed -- but it also works very well with those deep bass notes. I may try EB Aluminum Bronze strings on it next, it's still a bit treble/mid heavy for my ear, but I love the bass!

My sharping levers will be here this week so now I've got to think seriously about installing them. Won't know until I actually have them whether there will be room for one on the highest bass string...so don't know whether I'm going to fit all 6 or just go for 3 or 4.

Phil
__________________
One Size Does Not Fit All

Asturias: '17 GS Custom (Euro spruce/mahogany) Crosby: '10 FSE (redwood/black walnut), '10 Bouzar (spruce/maple),
'12 JE Baritone Multiscale (redwood/black walnut), '19 Cittar (Lutz spruce/mango) Furch: '17 S22CMc (cedar/mahogany)
Larrivée: '89 J-09 (spruce/rosewood) Lowden: '10 O23c (cedar/Claro walnut) Timberline: '19 T30HGc (all mahogany)


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  #10  
Old 09-16-2019, 01:15 PM
Matt G Matt G is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by philjs View Post
The nut is actually 44mm (1.73").

I'm very happy, and impressed, with the T30HGc. It might sound more like Scot's recording if I put a Tonewood Amp on it (and he was playing it) but it is a wonderful sounding instrument, on top of being a harp guitar!

The mahogany top lacks nothing in crispness and treble response -- I don't think a spruce lover could be disappointed -- but it also works very well with those deep bass notes. I may try EB Aluminum Bronze strings on it next, it's still a bit treble/mid heavy for my ear, but I love the bass!

My sharping levers will be here this week so now I've got to think seriously about installing them. Won't know until I actually have them whether there will be room for one on the highest bass string...so don't know whether I'm going to fit all 6 or just go for 3 or 4.

Phil
That's too bad about the nut width. I saw it advertised as 1.75 somewhere and 1 11/16 somewhere else. I was hoping the actual nut is 1.75
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  #11  
Old 09-16-2019, 03:15 PM
philjs philjs is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Matt G View Post
That's too bad about the nut width. I saw it advertised as 1.75 somewhere and 1 11/16 somewhere else. I was hoping the actual nut is 1.75
Timberline prominently lists the nut width as 1.73". Where have you seen it advertised differently?

Regardless, the string spacing is EXACTLY the same...

Phil
__________________
One Size Does Not Fit All

Asturias: '17 GS Custom (Euro spruce/mahogany) Crosby: '10 FSE (redwood/black walnut), '10 Bouzar (spruce/maple),
'12 JE Baritone Multiscale (redwood/black walnut), '19 Cittar (Lutz spruce/mango) Furch: '17 S22CMc (cedar/mahogany)
Larrivée: '89 J-09 (spruce/rosewood) Lowden: '10 O23c (cedar/Claro walnut) Timberline: '19 T30HGc (all mahogany)


Solo or Trio
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  #12  
Old 09-16-2019, 06:43 PM
Matt G Matt G is offline
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Hi Phil,

I saw the Timeberline nut advertised as 1.75 at a couple retail websites:

https://www.elderly.com/products/tim...itar-with-case This model is the TG60HGc, not the TG20 (don't know if that makes a difference in the nut width, or if they are both the same).

http://www.harpguitarmusic.com/listi...ine-models.htm Gregg Miner's website actually lists the nut at 44.5mm, which is a hair over 1.75 inches.

The 44mm nut doesn't rule out a Timberline for me completely, but it lessens the appeal. 1.75in (44.5mm) is the narrowest I'm comfortable with on complex fingerstyle tunes. My ring finger tip flares out a bit and it's pretty hard to fit it cleanly on narrower nut widths.

Thanks again for your input,
Matt
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  #13  
Old 09-17-2019, 05:04 AM
philjs philjs is offline
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You made me curious enough to get out my dial calipers (metric, of course) this morning, Matt. Are you ready for this?

The nut on my T30HGc actually measures 44.8 mm which is a bit more than 1.76". I suspect that the quoted 1.73" is a nominal minimum size...I also suspect that Gregg, and the folks at Elderly, actually measured one!

You're welcome. Now go spend some money...

Phil
__________________
One Size Does Not Fit All

Asturias: '17 GS Custom (Euro spruce/mahogany) Crosby: '10 FSE (redwood/black walnut), '10 Bouzar (spruce/maple),
'12 JE Baritone Multiscale (redwood/black walnut), '19 Cittar (Lutz spruce/mango) Furch: '17 S22CMc (cedar/mahogany)
Larrivée: '89 J-09 (spruce/rosewood) Lowden: '10 O23c (cedar/Claro walnut) Timberline: '19 T30HGc (all mahogany)


Solo or Trio
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  #14  
Old 09-17-2019, 06:08 AM
Matt G Matt G is offline
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Thanks for measuring! Now I have no more excuses. Except of course the biggest one: I can barely play a six string guitar. How will I learn to handle twelve?

Quote:
Originally Posted by philjs View Post
You made me curious enough to get out my dial calipers (metric, of course) this morning, Matt. Are you ready for this?

The nut on my T30HGc actually measures 44.8 mm which is a bit more than 1.76". I suspect that the quoted 1.73" is a nominal minimum size...I also suspect that Gregg, and the folks at Elderly, actually measured one!

You're welcome. Now go spend some money...

Phil
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  #15  
Old 09-20-2019, 02:00 PM
Naboz Naboz is offline
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"You're welcome. Now go spend some money... "

Phil

Ha! Bunch of enablers around here...I'm trying to keep the GAS at bay!
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-It's a dangerous business, going out your front door;
You step into the Road, and if you don't keep your feet,
There is no telling where you might be swept off to.
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harp guitar, mahogany top, timberline

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