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  #31  
Old 10-20-2020, 04:37 PM
247hoopsfan 247hoopsfan is offline
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One thing I know for sure is that the Lord doesn’t care what guitar we play, or what it cost as long as we play for Him. I started out in a worship band at 17 in 1972 playing my Yamaha FG200 that cost me a whopping $100. I wore grooves in the fretboard and still have that guitar. I took quite a few years off raising 5 kids, but have been playing in church band for the last 15 years. Now I play my Larrivees and my Goodall. They do sound better than my old Yamaha.
Our church is about 600. I get asked to play instrumentals frequently during reflective moments of the service. We record our services and the sound track.
Here is a recent service where I noodle on my Goodall. As I finish, the band comes in on The Cross Has the Final Word. You can hear our leader come in with rythym on his Taylor. I continue finger picking. The sound difference between his Taylor 810 and my Goodall is pretty obvious.
https://soundcloud.com/vbcmusic/the-...e-final-word-1
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https://soundcloud.com/247hoopsfan

Last edited by 247hoopsfan; 10-20-2020 at 04:44 PM.
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  #32  
Old 10-20-2020, 04:48 PM
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Bob Womack Bob Womack is online now
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You know, it is a funny subject. When I got started in music in the early '70s, it was the beginning of the Jesus movement and there were lots of people who would demand of you all sorts of things. "You have to divide your time equally between studying the Bible and learning guitar." "If you spend a lot of money on a guitar your priorities are all wrong." Then I studied the Bible and became thoroughly uncomfortable with legalism and judgementalism.

When I began playing in working bands and doing sessions I needed better guitars. I have a few. I discovered that there were always younger players in church who watched the band like a hawk. Some expressed feeling bad about their less-expensive instruments. I personally have chosen not to show up with top-dollar instruments when I play at church, specifically in order to not make other folks I play with feel bad about their instruments. That message is exactly the opposite of the one I'd want to put out in a church setting.

But I get it. You see commercial guitarista "guitar horses," like "clothes horses." Then you see the very same trend in Christian music. So-and-so plays a Taylor and suddenly everyone is playing Taylors. Then someone else is plays Gibsons and everyone switches to Gibsons, then McPhersons then Gretsches then Duesenbergs then small-shop steam punk electrics.* And it has to be a Vox amp until someone shows up with a small-shop handwired boutikwa thang and they all run off to get one. And the pedalboards? Oh my Gosh.

Duane Allman talked about this syndrome in studio cats (of which I am one):
Studios - that's a terrible thing, man! You just lay around and get your money. All of those studio cats I know, like one of them gets a color TV, see, and then the next day, man, they're all down to Sears or wherever - 'Hey' I'd like to look at some color TVs.'. And like this one place I know, all these cats - five of them - had Oldsmobile 442s One of them traded for a Toronado, and so all of them traded for Toronados. And now one of them's got a Corvette, and now they're all looking for new Vettes. Man, this is sickening. They're just keeping up with the Joneses and not playing their music. I was down there for about a half year, and I got sick of it. The sessions I do now, I just go in there and do it and leave.
I'm so out of that loop that I can't even see the other guys' heads bobbing up from over the horizon. It wants some balance.

Bob

* I think that was the order.
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  #33  
Old 10-20-2020, 04:58 PM
Ralph124C41 Ralph124C41 is offline
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And here is the other shoe ready to fall...

How many times have you gone to a church service and spotted somebody with an expensive guitar ... who really doesn't know how to play it very well and ... worse yet ... doesn't know how to keep it in tune?

I'm sorry but when I hear those out-of-tune guitars I just grimace. An out-of-tune HD28 will still sound out of tune.
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  #34  
Old 10-20-2020, 05:03 PM
Oldguy64 Oldguy64 is offline
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As a PK, I’ve often been flabbergasted by the response of observers and congregants when the Preacher-man or leaders in the church have “nice things”
These days more folks than not have a “real job” and they get a stipend or a pittance from the church.

Most folks are “tent-making” ministers. That’s how they afford higher end gear.

My gear has gotten better in the last 25 years.
But I still have the Alvarez Iron Horse that I started on.
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Last edited by Oldguy64; 10-20-2020 at 05:15 PM.
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  #35  
Old 10-20-2020, 05:17 PM
jay7347 jay7347 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ozarkpicker View Post
To be honest, most of the high end guitars I'm talking about are electrics. Some of the guys who play with Hillsong United, Bethel Music, Jesus Culture, Elevation Worship, and the like play premium-prices Custom Shop Fender/Gibson, PRS, Suhr and Veritas guitars...not to mention large racks of effects and boutique amps. That pales in comparison to most local church players that might have a nice Strat or Tele, and a few sundry pedals.

I'm certainly not, in any way criticizing these players personally or professionally...just pondering on how their means of aquisition.
You know, the bottom line is a guitar is just a tool. But because the playing situation is a worship band does it mean we should question how expensive their gear should be? I don't see this in other playing situations for AGF players and quite frankly I find the judgmental aspect of it rather troubling.

I play lead guitar in our worship band. I play some nice gear. I'm retired, my debts are paid off, the kids are all grown and I've saved money to buy some guitars I really enjoy playing. My goal for the next year is to practice my tail off to see how good I can get. I call it my retirement career. I guess the point I'm trying to make is that we shouldn't judge who plays what. It's really pointless.

-jay
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  #36  
Old 10-20-2020, 05:32 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ozarkpicker View Post

How are these instruments generally obtained? Manufacturer endorsements? Are they purchased by the churches they serve in?
I have always assumed that most folks who play at church bring their own instruments, and if they have nice ones, it is because they have the means, or they have prioritized owning nice instruments over other discretionary spending.

I am sure that there are some churches that have “deep pockets” because a parishioner or two bequeathed a large sum when they died, or made a donation that was earmarked for a specific purchase ( it is not uncommon for a stained glass window to be underwritten by a donation from a church member). But I think it is uncommon for a church to purchase instruments to be used for worship (though that wouldn’t be any more remarkable then spending big bucks on a pipe organ).

As for sponsors giving away high priced instruments....only for the creme de la creme.
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  #37  
Old 10-20-2020, 05:48 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ozarkpicker View Post
...Most of these cost more than the average worship guitarist could muster...
Quote:
Originally Posted by jay7347 View Post
...Because the playing situation is a worship band does it mean we should question how expensive their gear should be? I don't see this in other playing situations for AGF players and quite frankly I find the judgmental aspect of it rather troubling. -jay
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Originally Posted by ljguitar View Post

I'm not sure how you arrived at a mean financial income level of 'average' worship leaders (whatever those are), and how they afford their instruments. They also buy houses and cars, have kids, etc.

So my point is, I don't find it unusual nor suspicious when I see players with better-than-average instruments.


I agree with Jay and ljguitar. I would no more be concerned about the cost of YouTube performers' guitars than I would about the cost of other AGF members' guitars. I'm not going to second guess how much someone should spend on a guitar regardless of how and where they use it...
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Last edited by RP; 10-20-2020 at 06:03 PM.
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  #38  
Old 10-20-2020, 05:55 PM
nitram nitram is offline
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If Jesus had a computer I'll bet he'd bend over laughing at this.
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  #39  
Old 10-20-2020, 06:03 PM
LJOHNS LJOHNS is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ralph124C41 View Post
And here is the other shoe ready to fall...

How many times have you gone to a church service and spotted somebody with an expensive guitar ... who really doesn't know how to play it very well and ... worse yet ... doesn't know how to keep it in tune?

I'm sorry but when I hear those out-of-tune guitars I just grimace. An out-of-tune HD28 will still sound out of tune.
I assure you I was never out of tune nor were the others I played with. We were all pretty serious about our music.

Last edited by LJOHNS; 10-20-2020 at 06:18 PM.
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  #40  
Old 10-20-2020, 06:05 PM
LJOHNS LJOHNS is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jay7347 View Post
You know, the bottom line is a guitar is just a tool. But because the playing situation is a worship band does it mean we should question how expensive their gear should be? I don't see this in other playing situations for AGF players and quite frankly I find the judgmental aspect of it rather troubling.

I play lead guitar in our worship band. I play some nice gear. I'm retired, my debts are paid off, the kids are all grown and I've saved money to buy some guitars I really enjoy playing. My goal for the next year is to practice my tail off to see how good I can get. I call it my retirement career. I guess the point I'm trying to make is that we shouldn't judge who plays what. It's really pointless.

-jay
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  #41  
Old 10-20-2020, 06:06 PM
kevinplarson kevinplarson is offline
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I’m a lead pastor of a church of around 300. My elderly dad gave me some cash over the last year. I purchased two very nice, expensive Martins. I play them at times when I join the band.

We have a few instruments that are church property. I also bought my music guy a nice Nord keyboard with some of that same cash as a gift to a long-time friend. But generally speaking people buy their own stuff. I definitely prefer it that way. Most people don’t want to have their offerings go to buy specific people gifts. Don’t think it’s a good practice at all.
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  #42  
Old 10-20-2020, 08:46 PM
The Growler The Growler is offline
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Originally Posted by llew View Post
I play a lot of different guitars at church. Some are (what I consider) expensive but it's all relative. The bottom line is most parishioners wouldn't know the difference between a Zager and a Martin...and probably wouldn't care as long as the people behind them are doing what they've been called to do.
There you go. Totally agree.
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  #43  
Old 10-20-2020, 08:55 PM
SuperB23 SuperB23 is offline
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I used all sorts of random guitars for leading worship ranging from $1500 Rainsong - $9000 custom luthier built instruments. A lot depends on what type of songs we are playing and where we are playing them at whether inside or outside. My Rainsong guitars have been getting a lot of use this year with outside services here in smokey California.
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  #44  
Old 10-20-2020, 08:58 PM
llew llew is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nitram View Post
If Jesus had a computer I'll bet he'd bend over laughing at this.
My guess would be He doesn't need one?!?
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  #45  
Old 10-20-2020, 09:00 PM
llew llew is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tnfiddler View Post
As they should be. I know a couple who can’t make it outside of their church and have turned their church gig into their fame.
That's sad...it's not about "us"?
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