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  #1  
Old 04-23-2018, 04:08 PM
rxm1611 rxm1611 is offline
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Default Why an early 60's Martin 00-21

My brother was approached to buy a 00-21. I have, nor he has any experience with this guitar. For those who do what would you say are the positive and negatives
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Old 04-23-2018, 04:45 PM
Wade Hampton Wade Hampton is offline
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The Martin 00-21 from that era is one of their lesser-known but greatest guitar designs of all time. It’s got a 12th fret body join, which means the notes above the octave are that much more difficult to reach, but that additional amount of body cavity gives the 00-21 a remarkably powerful and projective voice. It’s got far more bass response than most players would expect, and it’s a lot louder than you might expect, as well. I’ve owned a couple of them, and am looking for another.

The main drawback of the 00-21 for me was the wide 1 7/8” nut. I flat out dislike slotted headstocks, too, even though some players would consider that to be a benefit. Then there’s the slightly restricted access up above the octave that I already mentioned.

So those are the disadvantages of the 12 fret 00-21, the extra wide fretboard being the one that I like the least. But the advantages are musically impressive, in my opinion, and for me outweigh the annoyances of the nut width and slotted headstock.

In any event, you and he should definitely go play the guitar that’s for sale and get your own impressions of it. But the 12 fret 00-21 is one of the greatest unsung Martin models that there is.

Hope that makes sense.


Wade Hampton Miller
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Old 04-24-2018, 07:47 AM
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DenverSteve DenverSteve is offline
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What Wade said. Great guitars but, I too, dislike the neck. If it’s been kept in good shape, it could be a diamond.
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Old 04-24-2018, 07:52 AM
Cameleye Cameleye is offline
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I have a '52 00-21 that I find amazing with great clarity and projection, mainly for fingerpicking though.
The wide neck is a plus for me, very comfortable.
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Old 04-24-2018, 07:53 AM
SongwriterFan SongwriterFan is offline
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I have a 1965 00-21NY, and I love it.

Mine was a single-owner and was in GREAT shape when I bought it (except it needed a neck reset, which I had done).

Wonderfully resonant guitar.
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Old 04-24-2018, 08:57 AM
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The 00-21 was Martin's lone, continuously produced, steel string model in 12 fret configuration. Even though it was straight braced at this point, it was still forward braced. All Martin 12 fret guitars were and are forward braced.

When Martin shifted the bracing rearward on the 14 fret guitars in the mid 30's, they didn't change the bracing position on the few 12 fret guitars still in production. This accounts for part of the reason that postwar 12 and 14 fret guitars sounded so different. Not only is the 12 fret body longer, the bracing is still in the original forward position.

As already noted, some players really don't like the wider 1 7/8" neck. If you like that, or if you don't care one way or the other, you'd be hard pressed to find a better guitar in any period than the 00-21. Of course it won't have the bottom end of a Dreadnaught, but it will be a great sounding guitar.
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Old 04-24-2018, 11:20 AM
1Charlie 1Charlie is offline
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The back and sides of an early '60's Martin 00-21 will be made of Brazilian rosewood, highly prized and usually priced accordingly.
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A few nice ones, a few beaters, and a few I should probably sell...
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Old 04-24-2018, 11:37 AM
Mycroft Mycroft is offline
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"Approached?" Approached how? Some guy standing by an alley? "Psst. Hey, buddy, you look like you could use a guitar. Why don't you come on down here..."

Ahem.

I have a 1964 00-21, and it has become one of my favorite guitars. Mine, while crack-free, needed a fair amount of rehabilitation when I got it, including on the finish, a new pickguard, and a neck reset and new frets. And has proved to be well worth it. Don't be afraid of a guitar that might need work, so long as the price reflects it.

I string mine with lights, and use it mostly as a fingerpicker and for light flatpicking. As noted above, it is louder that you might expect for it's size, although it would not hold up in a full bluegrass jam. more bass than you might expect as well, but not a Dread. To paraphrase Townes Van Zandt: "I'm going to miss the system here, the lows are low and the trebles clear." Nice articulate bass, and clear trebles indeed. Nicely balanced.

If indeed an early 60s, then it will have Brazilian Rosewood on the back and sides. Even then, builders were starting to have difficulty in sourcing Brazilian that was wide enough for larger boded guitars, which is why they made the switch to East Indian in the late 60s. But with the smaller bodied guiars, like a 00, they could still get good quartersawn wood. Mine has absolutely lovely straight-grained quartersawn chocolate Brazilian from edge to edge, with no wandering off quarter at the edges of the lower bout like some guitars have. Very ho-hum, for folks obsessed with figuring like many of the stumpwood Brazilian backs that many guitars have these days. But also less crack-prone. Your Bro should not overlook that when checking out this guitar. It should also have a Rosewood fingerboard and bridge.

Downsides. Well, some people simply don't appreciate the tonal qualities of a smaller guitar. To each their own. If a persons idea of the be-all and end-all of how a guitar should sound is a Dreadnaught, then a 00-21 is not going to be for them because it will never sound like one. But on it's terms, and if a person likes those terms, it is a supurb design.

Several people have noted the wide neck, which I quite like, and some have issues with restringing a slothead. Somethng not mentioned is the neck shape. Mine has a bit of a V to it. Someone use to a thin Taylorsque electric guitar speed neck might not like the one on mine. I find it very comfortable. OMMV.

Since no one else has mentioned it, given the years of the guitar that you have asked about, there is something that I should mention. From something like 1961 to, I think it was 1965, Martin responded to the Great Folk Scare and built another version of the 00-21 as well: the 00-21 New Yorker. The NY was probably the first time that Martin reached back into the past and built a new guitar that was based on an old design that they no longer made. Sort of the first step towards guitars like the Golden Eras, Vintage series, and the Authentics. The 00-21NY was based on the old pre-steel string 00-21s of the early part of the 20th century. Designed and braced more lightly than a standard 00-21, for either nylon or silk and steel. I've heard of them being strung with an extra-light steel set, but caution is advised.

Same woods as the standard 00-21, the body and neck are indistinguishable. However, there are several differences. First, a NY should have a straight bridge instead of a belly bridge. No fretboard dots. Originally did not come with a pickguard. (but don't rule out one having been added. And, of course, if you look inside at the neckblock, it will have the letters "NY" appended to the "00-21" model designation.

These are really nice light-touch players. Wonderful fingerpickers. I've a friend who has one, a '63, I think, and he does play his with a pick, abet a bit lightly. We have, of course, A/B'd the two guitars. Remarkably similar in tone and feel. Mine has a bit more dynamic range when you dig in a little, his a bit more responsive to a lighter attack. Martin made less than a thousand 00-21NYs, and they are a bit sought after. You can't go wrong with either model in my book, depending on how you want to play it. I bring it up in case the seller is unaware of what they have got.

Hmm, my quick response turned into a novel. Kind of shows my feels about the guitar, I guess.

Good luck.

TW

Last edited by Mycroft; 04-24-2018 at 11:42 AM.
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  #9  
Old 04-26-2018, 12:30 PM
Mycroft Mycroft is offline
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I think that I speak for everyone in asking that you let us know what your brother finds. Consider it as vicarious gas.
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