Tired of the Quack! Need pickup recommendations for my J45...

[myersbw]

Another 3.14159 cents here... trust Doug's library of tones...it's an awesome resource and I've used it a few times for comparison.

Yes, absolutely glue those piezo elements in properly (not with tape) or you might as well not do it at all. I really like the JJB 330 element, too. (I've used the 15mm 3 element pigtail he offers. VERY inexpensive)

You also mentioned not lightening up your attack and piezos do produce a voltage based on that sound pressure. What gauge strings are you using? Mediums, lights or something heavier? If mediums, try a gauge or so lighter on the pick (if using a pick).

I go heavy with some strums, so I use a 0.60mm pick. Many of my friends like something heavier...this one works for me.

I had the Lyric in one guitar. It's fine for solo work, but I'll guess you'll fight some feedback issues if trying to keep up with any traditional band & drummer...? (It truly is a microphone, but it does sound very nice!)

I was in a spot where I needed an acoustic in a particular song, but had to keep up on par with a band in a small location. The solution? For that one, I used the electric and pushed it through my iPad (Sonic Port interface) and used the acoustic simulator in BiasFX...worked AMAZINGLY well for the need!

Good luck on the tone search! SO many choices and all the solutions have some genuine merit!

Oh...and one other thing...do you use a harmonizer with the acoustic in question? If not, no biggie. But, if you do, the UST's and the Pure Mini/JJB elements will serve better than the Lyric. Mostly because the Lyric will pick up room noise as it's a mic. That translates to a Harmonizer going a little bonkers!! :O

Cheers!

[sbpark]

Originally Posted by myersbw

Another 3.14159 cents here... trust Doug's library of tones...it's an awesome resource and I've used it a few times for comparison.

Yes, absolutely glue those piezo elements in properly (not with tape) or you might as well not do it at all. I really like the JJB 330 element, too. (I've used the 15mm 3 element pigtail he offers. VERY inexpensive)

You also mentioned not lightening up your attack and piezos do produce a voltage based on that sound pressure. What gauge strings are you using? Mediums, lights or something heavier? If mediums, try a gauge or so lighter on the pick (if using a pick).

I go heavy with some strums, so I use a 0.60mm pick. Many of my friends like something heavier...this one works for me.

I had the Lyric in one guitar. It's fine for solo work, but I'll guess you'll fight some feedback issues if trying to keep up with any traditional band & drummer...? (It truly is a microphone, but it does sound very nice!)

I was in a spot where I needed an acoustic in a particular song, but had to keep up on par with a band in a small location. The solution? For that one, I used the electric and pushed it through my iPad (Sonic Port interface) and used the acoustic simulator in BiasFX...worked AMAZINGLY well for the need!

Good luck on the tone search! SO many choices and all the solutions have some genuine merit!

Oh...and one other thing...do you use a harmonizer with the acoustic in question? If not, no biggie. But, if you do, the UST's and the Pure Mini/JJB elements will serve better than the Lyric. Mostly because the Lyric will pick up room noise as it's a mic. That translates to a Harmonizer going a little bonkers!! :O

Cheers!

I use EJ17 13-56 strings and picks 1.0mm-1.5mm thick. Again, I really don't want to adjust how I play the guitar to get the pickup(s0 to work. Sounds counterproductive. As I mentioned previously, I'd rather have a pickup in there that works with my style of playing, instead of adjusting my playing style to suit the pickup. I also do not use a harmonizer.

[martingitdave]

Originally Posted by sbpark

I use EJ17 13-56 strings and picks 1.0mm-1.5mm thick. Again, I really don't want to adjust how I play the guitar to get the pickup(s0 to work. Sounds counterproductive. As I mentioned previously, I'd rather have a pickup in there that works with my style of playing, instead of adjusting my playing style to suit the pickup. I also do not use a harmonizer.

I think, as mentioned, the library Doug Young created is going to give you the best comparison available. Also, for the benefit of the commentor(s) trying to offer advice, you might consider sharing your budget for this project.

Many folks here, who recommend the K&K style pickup, are looking at a certain price/performance category. The unit you currently have, and the K&K for instance, are in the moderate price category, once you factor in basic DI/preamp. It sounds like this might not be suitable to your ears.

I, for instance, don't make a living playing music, so I am satisfied with what I consider Taylor's 80/20 solution (ES2). 80% of the performance for 20% of the cost/effort. It sounds very good for my playing style and is simple and easy to use. But, my solution won't be your solution.

If you want a more sophisticated level of performance, I'm afraid you'll have to look into the more expensive boutique style products available, Trance being once of them. They typically use multiple sources of traditional (or advanced) pickups, transducers, and microphones with higher end electronics. Again, Doug's site is very useful for understanding the characteristics of those systems.

In car terms, you'll need to decide if you're a standard domestic, luxury import, or exotic sports car guy. I'm more the former than the later.

[sbpark]

Originally Posted by martingitdave

I think, as mentioned, the library Doug Young created is going to give you the best comparison available. Also, for the benefit of the commentor(s) trying to offer advice, you might consider sharing your budget for this project.

Many folks here, who recommend the K&K style pickup, are looking at a certain price/performance category. The unit you currently have, and the K&K for instance, are in the moderate price category, once you factor in basic DI/preamp. It sounds like this might not be suitable to your ears.

I, for instance, don't make a living playing music, so I am satisfied with what I consider Taylor's 80/20 solution (ES2). 80% of the performance for 20% of the cost/effort. It sounds very good for my playing style and is simple and easy to use. But, my solution won't be your solution.

If you want a more sophisticated level of performance, I'm afraid you'll have to look into the more expensive boutique style products available, Trance being once of them. They typically use multiple sources of traditional (or advanced) pickups, transducers, and microphones with higher end electronics. Again, Doug's site is very useful for understanding the characteristics of those systems.

In car terms, you'll need to decide if you're a standard domestic, luxury import, or exotic sports car guy. I'm more the former than the later.

I'd be willing to spend $300-$350 just for the pickup system, not counting a preamp, which I already have.

[davidguevara80]

LR Baggs Lyric is a great option. If you hate the element, then you don't want the Anthem. That's a lyric + Element.

[sbpark]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xWWrumsoP8k

This video was pretty helpful. Now, I realize there's a LOT of variables that are resulting int the tones they are getting, including player style attack, type of guitar they're using, string and pick choice, etc., not to mention what the engineer who is recording this is doing. However I really thought that the Lyric in Keith Sewell's guitar sounding the best and most natural. while the Anthem sounded the worst to me, borderline unacceptable, while both M80's were decent and much better than the Anthem, but not as good as the Lyric. I almost felt like Any Reiss' guitar with the M80 has sort of an electric semi-hollowbody sound to it for some reason, like an ES or something.

[frank4001]

Originally Posted by sbpark

I have a '14 J45 Standard. Love the guitar, especially it's punchy low end, but not digging the sound of the stock LR Baggs Element. Currently have a bone saddle in the guitar, which sounds great unplugged, but very uninspiring plugged in, and ditto for the Tusq saddle that was in there stock, not much difference when plugged in. I've tried several different 'fixes' like different DI's, played it though different amps, and just have to be honest with myself, I just hate the sound of the pickup, and no other band-aid fix later in the signal chain is going to help unless I start off right with a good pickup. I currently have an Aura Spectrum DI, and although I think it sounds 'ok', it's still a "band-aid on a bullet wound" if you know what I'm saying.

I play mostly solo acoustic stuff, but that may change in the future if I start playing with a band again, so keeping that in mind it will mostly be used for the solo stuff, but still should be able to pull double duty with a rock/country/Americana-type band.

Not a fan aesthetically of sound hole pickups (currently have sitting in a box an LR Baggs M80) and just don't want to see that thing in the sound hole of my lovely J45!

Should I consider a dual source system along the lines of the LR Baggs Anthem? Aside from the large control portion that gets hidden inside, it seems like a great option since you can blend the UST and mic for the given situation. Maybe more UST for a full band, and more mic for a solo gig?

Obviously open to other suggestions. I'm just looking for something that sounds natural. I'm looking to start from scratch, ditching the Aura Spectrum DI, and looking to get a new pickup for the J45.

If it helps, in addition to the style of music I mentioned I play, I'm running through a pre-Fender SWR California blonde.

I have a 2013, took out the Baggs Element and replaced with a JJB SBT and a bone saddle. Much better... the bone vs tusq saddle is not very different but just getting that Baggs out of there helped acoustically also..

[sbpark]

Originally Posted by frank4001

I have a 2013, took out the Baggs Element and replaced with a JJB SBT and a bone saddle. Much better... the bone vs tusq saddle is not very different but just getting that Baggs out of there helped acoustically also..

I am thinking along the same lines as you. Ultimately I really want the guitar to sound it's best unplugged, which is how i use it most of the time, but will definitely be using it more and more plugged in soon. Part of me just thinks that the Element UST int here now is killing some of the tone of the guitar when played unplugged, and I think it's like a damper in there! I'm going to remove it today.

The dilemma is wanting a guitar that does double duty, that will mostly get played plugged in with just me and my voice, and once in a while with a full band or in a jam situation.

As different as the remaining choices are, it's kind of down to the internal mic or a sound hole pickup. The internal mic (Lyric) sounds great, but others have mentioned loss of low end (hence adding the UST to the Anthem, but again, not going with any kind of UST this time), and the sound hole pickup is way more feedback resistant, but unsightly and not as natural sounding. Decisions, decisions!

[martingitdave]

Based on the video I would have to agree. I had a guitar that I installed a Lyric in. I thought the microphone was great for that guitar. It needed a touch of EQ on the bottom end, and might be a bit feedback prone in loud band situations. If you want to stay in the LR Baggs family, it is worth a look, in my opinion. It is the most natural sounding.

[sbpark]

Originally Posted by martingitdave

Based on the video I would have to agree. I had a guitar that I installed a Lyric in. I thought the microphone was great for that guitar. It needed a touch of EQ on the bottom end, and might be a bit feedback prone in loud band situations. If you want to stay in the LR Baggs family, it is worth a look, in my opinion. It is the most natural sounding.

How feedback prone was it, and what situations did you use it in that caused it to feedback? I'm wondering even if it would feedback in an intimate setting where my amp was close to the guitar like in a small coffee house, etc. with the Lyric.

[martingitdave]

No feedback in coffee house in my experience. I never had an issue. Only heard one person complain about it in a loud band setting.

Sent from my XT1585 using Tapatalk

[sbpark]

Found this video link in an old thread on here. Thought this guitar sounded very natural: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JL9RKvl6qMw

[frank4001]

Originally Posted by sbpark

I am thinking along the same lines as you. Ultimately I really want the guitar to sound it's best unplugged, which is how i use it most of the time, but will definitely be using it more and more plugged in soon. Part of me just thinks that the Element UST int here now is killing some of the tone of the guitar when played unplugged, and I think it's like a damper in there! I'm going to remove it today.

The dilemma is wanting a guitar that does double duty, that will mostly get played plugged in with just me and my voice, and once in a while with a full band or in a jam situation.

As different as the remaining choices are, it's kind of down to the internal mic or a sound hole pickup. The internal mic (Lyric) sounds great, but others have mentioned loss of low end (hence adding the UST to the Anthem, but again, not going with any kind of UST this time), and the sound hole pickup is way more feedback resistant, but unsightly and not as natural sounding. Decisions, decisions!

I hear you ... I have found that with a preamp (I use an Ashdown, pedal type) I can EQ it for the situations pretty easily with the JJB..... and I'm also one of those "no batteries in the guitar" type people too... So it's been working well so far.. Good luck...

[Doug Young]

Originally Posted by sbpark

I've definitely noticed that strumming style affects the amount of quack. I have a particularly heavy right hand, so it's kind of tough trying to hold back when I normally don't do that, for the sake of it sounding less "quacky". I've also experimented with different gain stages, and find that dialing back the pickup volume on the pickup itself helps reduce quack, but at the loss of some low end as well. Instead of changing my attack and style to suit the pickup, I'd like to find a pickup that suits my style.

Heavy strumming is by far the hardest thing for any pickup to handle. Most just curl up and die. The K&K might work, but it can still be overdriven, and may get mushy under hard attack. Also, it picks up the sound of hitting the top or bridge, so if your heavy hand includes hitting wood in any way, it will pick that up, quite loudly. That's either a good thing or a problem, depending on what you want. Some use this to add percussion sounds.

The Baggs Lyric is the first pickup I've encountered that handles a heavy attack really well, and I see others have suggested that as well. The Trance Amulet is a close 2nd. Each of these has it's own sound, which may or may not suit you, but it's worth a try.

[sbpark]

Originally Posted by Doug Young

Heavy strumming is by far the hardest thing for any pickup to handle. Most just curl up and die. The K&K might work, but it can still be overdriven, and may get mushy under hard attack. Also, it picks up the sound of hitting the top or bridge, so if your heavy hand includes hitting wood in any way, it will pick that up, quite loudly. That's either a good thing or a problem, depending on what you want. Some use this to add percussion sounds.

The Baggs Lyric is the first pickup I've encountered that handles a heavy attack really well, and I see others have suggested that as well. The Trance Amulet is a close 2nd. Each of these has it's own sound, which may or may not suit you, but it's worth a try.

Done deal then! Picking up a Lyric today!

Anyone have any tips for the easiest way to remove the thumbwheel volume control inside the sound hole for the LR Baggs Element that sin there, so as not to damage the guitar or thumbwheel?