AER Dual Mix vs. Redeye preamp??

[rokdog49]

Originally Posted by meb

Thanks Rokdog49. When I plug in the Red-eye, I do hear the 'smoothing'
effect, but I can tell no difference in output level. I wish the Red-eye had the
gain issue like the Twin. I missed the fact that the Twin had 'gain' as well
as boost. I will check in with Darren and see if the gain can be
adjusted internally like the twin. Just a little would really help. I like
the sound and the footprint of the Red-eye and need the 'boost' feature.

Do you have the instructions sheet?
It should tell you in there if ther is an adjustment screw for gain on the circuit board.
Seriously, give Darren a call.

[meb]

I couldn't find anything in the manual about gain. I took the back off of
the RE and do not see anything promising. I already have Daren's
phone # and email. I will contact him.

[rokdog49]

Originally Posted by meb

I couldn't find anything in the manual about gain. I took the back off of
the RE and do not see anything promising. I already have Daren's
phone # and email. I will contact him.

Ok great...good luck!

[meb]

Via email correspondence, Daren confirmed the internal gain feature
was only on the Twin. The feature set on the Twin better fit my needs
for an all-in-one product. I have both passive and active pickups that I
interchange occasionally. I can see certain situations where the Bright-Eye
Clean Boost could help, also.

Daren was kind enough to let me trade-in/trade up to the Twin.
It is already on the way.
How is that for superb Customer Service !!!

Thanks to Daren and the Fire-Eye team !

Michael

[jr.capo]

I just stumbled on this post string. I have the red eye, the dual red eye and the dual pocket tools

The AER dual pocket tools are great, it’s a compact 60 front end. You can use it as a DI and or mini mixer. The only issue is the Di is padded down and meant to feed into a mixer. So the line out is best if your sending it to anything other than a mixer. I use it this way all the time...to the effects return of my COmpact 60 - when I want finger tips controls, or to a QSC k-10 powered speaker. Of course you can also send it to a mixer, and avoid carrying a compact 60, it’s the same sound (I’ve A/B’d).

The red eye is great...I use one because it matches the impedance of my K&K’s. So that is first in the chain....then I go to my amp(c60) or to the pocket tool and on to a powered speaker (or the back of the c60). Either way, the red eye is first to balance out the K’Ks.

The red eye dual is also great because you can use it as a mute switch if you use one of those snark type tuners

Hope this helps everyone! If not, fire away with questions

[DoryDavis]

Originally Posted by jr.capo

I just stumbled on this post string. I have the red eye, the dual red eye and the dual pocket tools

The AER dual pocket tools are great, it’s a compact 60 front end. You can use it as a DI and or mini mixer. The only issue is the Di is padded down and meant to feed into a mixer. So the line out is best if your sending it to anything other than a mixer. I use it this way all the time...to the effects return of my COmpact 60 - when I want finger tips controls, or to a QSC k-10 powered speaker. Of course you can also send it to a mixer, and avoid carrying a compact 60, it’s the same sound (I’ve A/B’d).

The red eye is great...I use one because it matches the impedance of my K&K’s. So that is first in the chain....then I go to my amp(c60) or to the pocket tool and on to a powered speaker (or the back of the c60). Either way, the red eye is first to balance out the K’Ks.

The red eye dual is also great because you can use it as a mute switch if you use one of those snark type tuners

Hope this helps everyone! If not, fire away with questions

So the Red Eye, (single) doesn't boost the output of a passive piezo? It is more of an impedance matching function? I'm lost, about to order one for my passive LB6...

[ljguitar]

Originally Posted by DoryDavis

So the Red Eye, (single) doesn't boost the output of a passive piezo? It is more of an impedance matching function? I'm lost, about to order one for my passive LB6...

Hi DD

The LB-6 is a hot pickup, as is the K&K, and the purpose to run it through a preamp is not to boost the output level. Modifying the tone and providing multiple impedance matching outputs (XLR out) is the reason one would run it through a prosumer grade preamp. I used an LB-6 for 11 years as the basis for my rig in my Olson (came with an LB-6 installed). Also adding a boost circuit (for soloing). If I remember (I had hands on with one for several days once, but also had several others in the mix) it also provides for simultaneous XLR/¼" output (perhaps via effects loop) but don't hold me to that, but I'm sure it does. That way you can send your signal to the PA and an onstage amp at the same time.

I used an LB-6 for over 11 years with at least half dozen high quality preamps, always to great effect. In fact a piezo under saddle will benefit more from a preamp than even a soundboard transducer like the K&K Pure mini.

The Fire-Eye Red-Eye IS a preamp and WILL work with LB-6. I've never had anyone with an LB-6 show up in a guitar to mix at any gig where I ran sound, but have mixed a personal LB-6 (which was the original pickup in my Olson Dreadnought) through a number of prosumer grade preamps all with success.

Fire-Eye builds point-n-shoot preamps (choice of camera terminology is on purpose). It should work great for any decent piezo pickup (and the LB-6 is 6 piezos ganged to a single signal).

[steelvibe]

Originally Posted by DoryDavis

So the Red Eye, (single) doesn't boost the output of a passive piezo? It is more of an impedance matching function? I'm lost, about to order one for my passive LB6...

Hi Dory- It is an impedance matching buffer (which actually gives the impression that it is boosting the signal). But if you engage the red button It does boost it! Taken directly from Fire-Eye's website

"The Boost Button affects both the Effects Output level and the XLR Output Level. With the Boost Volume control set to minimum, the Boost Button adds +3 db to the output levels. (This is the threshold of clearly hearing a boost in the signal) With the Boost Volume control set to maximum, the Boost Button adds +8 db to the Output Levels.'

https://www.fire-eye.com/faq

[DoryDavis]

Larry J and Steelvibe, thank you so much for the clarification. I hadn't thought about he boost Steelvibe, yes by definition that'd bring up the signal (though maybe unnecessarily since the LB6 runs hot).

Larry J, I was curious as to your use of the word prosumer, and if you were referring to the RedEye as such- or were talking about various other preamps- I read your comment through a couple times to make sure I understood as best I could. (and thanks for your always valuable and actionable comments by the way). I guess I was thinking of the RedEye as a pro piece of gear, hand made with the best available components?

[ljguitar]

Originally Posted by DoryDavis

Larry J and Steelvibe, thank you so much for the clarification. I hadn't thought about he boost Steelvibe, yes by definition that'd bring up the signal (though maybe unnecessarily since the LB6 runs hot).

Larry J, I was curious as to your use of the word prosumer, and if you were referring to the RedEye as such- or were talking about various other preamps- I read your comment through a couple times to make sure I understood as best I could. (and thanks for your always valuable and actionable comments by the way). I guess I was thinking of the RedEye as a pro piece of gear, hand made with the best available components?

Hi DD

Yes. Prosumer gear to me is a category of solid, affordable, roadworthy, great sounding gear which will not spec out as 'high' as studio preamps, amps, etc. but works and performs well for many years.

Contrast my Raven PMB I or II, my DTAR Solstice (which I call prosumer) and cost $300-ish (even when they were new) with the Grace Felix which is $1150, or the Pendulum handwired $900 per channel preamps (back in the day). The Raven and DTAR in my mind are a solid mid-line group (Prosumer) of way-better-than-average preamps which still don't stack up to the 'specs' and self-noise tests of Avalon, Pendulum, Grace or others out there.

But I'm not putting this gear on the road full-time nor playing through top-end pro gear for PA systems.

Pro-sumer still starts with pro. To me it's a level above what most folks are willing to pay, and comes in limited supply compared to off-the-shelf gear.

I'd say there is a movable line somewhere in there which separates pro from prosumer. I don't put the Fire-eye in the full-on pro category primarily because of the lack of adjustable features.

I don't call my Raven PMB I & II or my DTAR Pro, because of lack of a parametric midrange control, and a couple of output options, and because there is detectable self-noise when compared to the aforementioned Grace Felix or the Pendulum hand-wired rack mount preamps. They are great preamps and given they were built a decade and a half ago, have been gigged tons and are still reliable, I think I made wise choices with them.

Hope that clarifies what I mean. I may have higher-than-average standards.

Thanks for the kind things you said. I just like to help people along when possible (hoping they can avoid some of the mistakes I made).

[Spook]

Originally Posted by Kelloggsy

Plug your guitar in, then you will understand why you don't need to tinker with EQ.

I am quite far from agreeing with this statement.

Single most important adjustment after volume is EQ. Rooms are different. Mix of instruments is different (we don't all just play solo). Amplification is different. And then there's feedback control. Folks worry about the nuances of sound (strings, pickups, pick material) and then fail to have EQ control.

EQ is critical. Where you do it in the signal chain can be flexible. But it is quite necessary in all settings. And while we're at it, just because there are knobs labeled 'bass' and 'treble' doesn't mean you're working with an EQ in the range needed for acoustic guitar. A lot of mixers have bass around 80hz and treble at 10Khz. Not very useful. Having a sweepable mid helps but once you use something good (Empress ParaEQ, Grace Design products) you won't go back.

[Andy Howell]

Agreed. EQ is very important in the real world. You may not need to tweak it much but you will need to!

[Doug Young]

Id consider the red-eye di to be an active di ( hence the name) Using Larrys description, an example of a totally “pro” di would be a Radial, which has zero eq. You dont generally need it, because you’re running the di into a mixer, which does have eq, hopefully run by a sound person from out front where they can eq your guitar for what the audience hears, which you cant really do onstage. So the red-eye just offers a few nice steps over a standard di, a bit more gain, boost, and a slight treble lift, which can be very handy with some pickups. But its not meant as a replacement for a full featured preamp with lots of eq. Its meant for situations where you want a clean simple active di with a few nice additional features.

[DoryDavis]

Originally Posted by jr.capo

I just stumbled on this post string. I have the red eye, the dual red eye and the dual pocket tools

The AER dual pocket tools are great, it’s a compact 60 front end. You can use it as a DI and or mini mixer. The only issue is the Di is padded down and meant to feed into a mixer. So the line out is best if your sending it to anything other than a mixer. I use it this way all the time...to the effects return of my COmpact 60 - when I want finger tips controls, or to a QSC k-10 powered speaker. Of course you can also send it to a mixer, and avoid carrying a compact 60, it’s the same sound (I’ve A/B’d).

The red eye is great...I use one because it matches the impedance of my K&K’s. So that is first in the chain....then I go to my amp(c60) or to the pocket tool and on to a powered speaker (or the back of the c60). Either way, the red eye is first to balance out the K’Ks.

The red eye dual is also great because you can use it as a mute switch if you use one of those snark type tuners

Hope this helps everyone! If not, fire away with questions

When you run the line out from the pocket tools into the QSC, do you run into channel one with the mic/line option. And if so, do you choose "line"? Thanks

[DoryDavis]

Originally Posted by ljguitar

Hi DD

The LB-6 is a hot pickup, as is the K&K, and the purpose to run it through a preamp is not to boost the output level. Modifying the tone and providing multiple impedance matching outputs (XLR out) is the reason one would run it through a prosumer grade preamp. I used an LB-6 for 11 years as the basis for my rig in my Olson (came with an LB-6 installed). Also adding a boost circuit (for soloing). If I remember (I had hands on with one for several days once, but also had several others in the mix) it also provides for simultaneous XLR/¼" output (perhaps via effects loop) but don't hold me to that, but I'm sure it does. That way you can send your signal to the PA and an onstage amp at the same time.

I used an LB-6 for over 11 years with at least half dozen high quality preamps, always to great effect. In fact a piezo under saddle will benefit more from a preamp than even a soundboard transducer like the K&K Pure mini.

The Fire-Eye Red-Eye IS a preamp and WILL work with LB-6. I've never had anyone with an LB-6 show up in a guitar to mix at any gig where I ran sound, but have mixed a personal LB-6 (which was the original pickup in my Olson Dreadnought) through a number of prosumer grade preamps all with success.

Fire-Eye builds point-n-shoot preamps (choice of camera terminology is on purpose). It should work great for any decent piezo pickup (and the LB-6 is 6 piezos ganged to a single signal).

Larry, I got a Red Eye and like for you, mine works well with the LB6. Which for starters is a relief to know this LB6 installation was worthwhile. I know there is "magic" in the Red Eye, I'm even thinking of trading up to the Twin. The sound pulls me in, its fun to play.

But hitting those (cost) numbers, I start to think about the Radial PZ Pre, with the EQ options. I know the Radial has the piezo boost option.
Oh, I tried the Red Eye with my maton/AP5. I didn't hear much difference there. No degradation, but nothing positive.

I have yet to try it with my Taylor Es-1. I tried it with my Gretsch 5420 with TV Jones pickups. That DID make a difference (positive). I wish I understood better what is going on with why one works better than the other (I understand the AP5 is an active pickup, and the RedEye is not designed with that in mind). Thanks everyone for this discussion.