Circa OM and Franklin OM

[Dutch918]

Hey all,

I’ve been reading and searching on here since like ‘08 and I’m about to jump in the waiting line for one of these builders to help round out my collection and I was hoping to hear a bit about the sound difference between these two builders. Obviously, this is not a, “which is better” thread, as both of these builders are considered to be at the top of the heap.

Instead, I wanted to hear the opinions of the forum members about these two builders that are considered more traditional luthiers.

For the sake of conversation, I am looking at an OM model with an Adirondack top and Brazilian rosewood back and sides. I am floundering between 1 11/16 nut width and 1 3/4 (from what I read, Franklin mainly offers 1 3/4) and 2 1/8 string spacing, if possible.

This guitar will be utilized almost exclusively for flat picking and a bit of strumming. Not sure if it’s helpful but I use 1mm blue chip flat picks. I’d like to occasionally mess around with some fingerstyle on this build, but I have a beautiful Sinker Redwood/ Braz Rosewood Kevin Ryan Nightingale that fills that slot to perfection.

I really respect the opinions on this forum, as y’all have helped me build my small collection thus far… (the search engine on here is a beautiful thing!)

Please let me know if there is any other information needed for your consideration.

Thank you!

[justonwo]

I own four Circas and have played many more. I’ve owned one Franklin Jumbo and almost bought a Franklin OM.

John has been building with a taller X brace for the last 6-7 years with the goal of increasing power, headroom, and projection. He is a self-proclaimed “mids junky” and this tends to come across in his newer builds. You don’t have to be shy digging into a Circa, as you will get a really pleasing and proportional response with no real limit on headroom. My Brazilian and Adi OM has that sparkle and shimmer you’d expect and is a bit less mids focused than my OM-18 and even my OM-30. I don’t use my Circas for strumming or flat picking, so I can’t comment on how well they work for that, but I do pick hard with fingerpicks and a thumb pick, so I can tell you they are powerful.

I was contemplating buying a Franklin OM with EIR back and sides a while back. I can’t remember the kind of spruce that was used for the top. I had the guitar for a couple of days, and my takeaway was that it sounded so close to my Circas as to be more or less duplicative. So I didn’t follow through on the purchase. People that have played or owned both Franklins and Circas may disagree, but my feeling playing this one Franklin was that these two builders are very close to each other. If I were going to own guitars by both, I might consider getting a Franklin Jumbo rather than an OM. But beware that the bass on a Franklin Jumbo can be enormous. For me, it was too much. That guitar was Brazilian and Sitka if memory serves.

[mhw48]

I haven't played a Circa, so I can't speak to a comparison, however I own a Franklin Jumbo and am in Nick's queue for an OM build sometime in the Spring. Nick Kukich is very flexible with things like nut width, neck shape etc -- in fact, he convinced me to go with an 11/16th nut on my Jumbo, which works really well. Nick is great to work with (although, since his work day is 5pm to 5 am, you have to time your phone calls!)
If you are thinking of this guitar as primarily for flatpicking and strumming, I'm sure a Franklin OM would be an excellent choice, but I'd echo Justonwo's suggestion to also think about a Franklin Jumbo. Nick also makes a 12 fret Dreadnaught, based on a Gibson Roy Smeck. I'm sure Nick would be happy to give you his opinion on the difference between his designs.

[antsdmb]

My post on this would be almost 100% this right here from Juston. The only place I differ is that I do lay into my Circa OM for beyond fingerstyle, and I can emphatically tell you it shows no limitations. It's a remarkably versatile guitar that takes anything I care to throw at it.

I think this comes down to preference in the end, but whatever you decide you will get a world class guitar.

Originally Posted by justonwo

I own four Circas and have played many more. I’ve owned one Franklin Jumbo and almost bought a Franklin OM.

John has been building with a taller X brace for the last 6-7 years with the goal of increasing power, headroom, and projection. He is a self-proclaimed “mids junky” and this tends to come across in his newer builds. You don’t have to be shy digging into a Circa, as you will get a really pleasing and proportional response with no real limit on headroom. My Brazilian and Adi OM has that sparkle and shimmer you’d expect and is a bit less mids focused than my OM-18 and even my OM-30. I don’t use my Circas for strumming or flat picking, so I can’t comment on how well they work for that, but I do pick hard with fingerpicks and a thumb pick, so I can tell you they are powerful.

I was contemplating buying a Franklin OM with EIR back and sides a while back. I can’t remember the kind of spruce that was used for the top. I had the guitar for a couple of days, and my takeaway was that it sounded so close to my Circas as to be more or less duplicative. So I didn’t follow through on the purchase. People that have played or owned both Franklins and Circas may disagree, but my feeling playing this one Franklin was that these two builders are very close to each other. If I were going to own guitars by both, I might consider getting a Franklin Jumbo rather than an OM. But beware that the bass on a Franklin Jumbo can be enormous. For me, it was too much. That guitar was Brazilian and Sitka if memory serves.

[FormerFoodie]

First of all, welcome to the forum Dutch918! I look forward to reading more of your posts down the road.

In regards to your question... At the height of my indulgence, I owned three Circas. I am now down to one Circa, but would jump on an opportunity for another (if I had the cash).

If I had the cash, however, I likely would prioritize adding a Franklin to the mix. Mainly for diversity, but at a visit to Luthiers Collection many years back, a Franklin was one of three best guitars I played that day. (Best guitar I played there was a Kim Walker, and the Franklin tied for second with a Brondel.)

I play mainly finger style and I really don't play with a heavy hand.

You truly have a first world problem picking between a Circa and a Franklin. If it's possible, I'd recommend making the decision after playing the exact guitar you are considering on purchasing. I'm sure some Circas are 'better' than some Franklins, and that some Franklins are 'better' than some Circas. I put better in quotes because it truly is subjective but the main point is that a guitar should be evaluated for its individual merits.

Let us know what you decide!!!!!

[usb_chord]

I’m pretty sure both Nick and John will do a 1 11/16th if requested. Both builders will work well for what you’re doing just as long as you communicate your needs up-front. Nick’s will lean warmer, probably with more low-end and a lot of complexity - especially in Brazilian rosewood but even in mahogany. They're easy to like but very lightly built.

John’s guitars can tend to be a little more torquey with a strong mid-range and lots of headroom. Both will be incredible - The Circa more forward, the Franklins usually more laid back. Foodie mentioned Kim Walker's guitars above and I gotta say, the best of Nick's OMs reminds me of Kim's - especially when Nick uses the slightly deeper box that Kim uses by default.

John's work is pretty special; his latest guitars dont remind me of anyone. I've not heard his particular EQ from any other Martin style builder. Neither he or John are building Martins - They've got their own thing going. I'd want one from both of them!

[iim7V7IM7]

Both Nick Kukich (Franklin Guitar Co.) and John Slobod (Circa Guitars) are great luthiers for anyone looking for an traditionalist-evolved traditionalist custom OMesque guitar. You will be happy with a guitar from either of these luthiers. They are different personalities each with their own ways of working and communicating. I recommend that you reach out to each and begin a conversation and see who YOU mesh with more.

I own a custom old German Spruce / Cuban Mahogany OMc that Nick made for me about 3-4 years ago that I truly adore. I have also played over a dozen of John’s guitars at luthier exhibitions over the years and have a guitar on order for delivery in 2023. His guitars are wonderful as well.

There is really no point trying to describe my impressions of their tonal distinctions with words because they can mean different things to different players. There is no bad choice here between these two luthiers. Don’t over analyze it. Reach out to each and see where it goes. There is no bad outcome either way.

[Dutch918]

All of these replies have been incredibly helpful! I already knew that both were world class, I was just curious as to how each behaved and usb_chord nailed it for me. Your explanation of John’s sound is identical to what I’m looking for on this build. In addition, it seems as though I might want to jump on Nick’s waiting list as well for a jumbo.

I had an hour long conversation with John today, and we discussed the sound I was looking for and style of play it will be used for. At this point we’ve boiled it down to two options.

Thank you everyone who replied to my thread. All of you really helped me determine which way I want to go on this build. I look forward to posting more often and not lurking every night with that lovely search function!

Now the wait begins!