ISO Compact yet quality acoustic PA rig for in/outdoor solo, duo, trio w/vocals

[JGarofalo3]

Time to step into the 21st century and grow up from my acoustic rig that has served me for 12 years. a Behringer small mixer with Behringer 15's its a beast, weighs a ton and is cumbersome and starting to get "glitchy"

Really not in the know to some of these new "systems" I've seen from JBL and others (LR Baggs?), etc.

While the sky isn't the limit budget wise, I do not want low end cheap gear. This will be the last PA I buy so if I can get another 12 years out of it like I got my low entry point Behringer gear Id be thrilled. I just want to upgrade to nicer stuff.

Acoustic guitar with vocals (solo) sometimes joined by acoustic bass (and backing vocals) and once in a while a 3rd piece and or vocals

Any and all recommendations and experiential suggestions are greatly appreciated.

I'm looking to buy soon (very soon)

TIA

JG3

[BlueStarfish]

I'm sure you'll have lots of good suggestions here shortly.

Here are a couple of questions, if you can comment on this the suggestions will be more tailored for what you need.

What size and type of venues do you play?

Do you want the acoustic bass to play through your rig, or are you OK having the bass player instead bring a smallish bass amp?

What is the "third piece"? Another acoustic guitar? Electric guitar? Keys? Mando or fiddle? Something else entirely? Will they plug in, or need an instrument mic, or bring their own instrument amp?

[wood nacho]

Originally Posted by JGarofalo3

Time to step into the 21st century and grow up from my acoustic rig that has served me for 12 years. a Behringer small mixer with Behringer 15's its a beast, weighs a ton and is cumbersome and starting to get "glitchy"

Really not in the know to some of these new "systems" I've seen from JBL and others (LR Baggs?), etc.

While the sky isn't the limit budget wise, I do not want low end cheap gear. This will be the last PA I buy so if I can get another 12 years out of it like I got my low entry point Behringer gear Id be thrilled. I just want to upgrade to nicer stuff.

Acoustic guitar with vocals (solo) sometimes joined by acoustic bass (and backing vocals) and once in a while a 3rd piece and or vocals

Any and all recommendations and experiential suggestions are greatly appreciated.

I'm looking to buy soon (very soon)

TIA

JG3

What sort of area are you trying cover? I'm a big fan of the Bose S1 but if you're coming from using (multiple?) 15" speakers, it isn't going to cut it for you. I'd suggest checking out one the line array units. Maybe try renting one of the Bose L1 Pro 8 systems and see if it suits your needs.

[YamahaGuy]

EV30M. There. I said it. Should cover your needs. I'll be getting one to replace my Yamaha Stagepas 1k.

[JGarofalo3]

Originally Posted by BlueStarfish

I'm sure you'll have lots of good suggestions here shortly.

Here are a couple of questions, if you can comment on this the suggestions will be more tailored for what you need.

What size and type of venues do you play?

Do you want the acoustic bass to play through your rig, or are you OK having the bass player instead bring a smallish bass amp?

What is the "third piece"? Another acoustic guitar? Electric guitar? Keys? Mando or fiddle? Something else entirely? Will they plug in, or need an instrument mic, or bring their own instrument amp?

Venues run from breweries, wineries and pub/restaurant bars indoors and the same and Tiki bars outdoors so small/medium indoor spaces to larger open spaces outside

My bass player does play an acoustic bass when we duo and does backing vocals.

3rd piece is sometimes only vocals but could be cajon or another guitar or string and likely also play through the PA (while they might bring their own i'd ideally like the ability to plug in. 8 channels is optimal if possible

Hope that helps

[Chipotle]

In this kind of situation I like to be "modular", rather than use an all-in-one array system. You can mix/max pieces to fit the size of the group and the size of the space.

My system covers everything from a solo show at a tiny coffee shop to a full band in a decent size outdoor setting: Two QSC K10.2s, a QSC CP8, and Behringer XR18 mixer.

Tiny coffee shop solo? Plug guitar & mic straight into CP8. A bit bigger? K10 on a stand "high & behind", with mixer if using a 2nd guitar or another musician. For bigger places and/or a band, K10s out front, CP8 as a monitor, all running through the XR18 (18 inputs, 6 aux outs plus main L/R). If you have bass/keys, maybe bump up to K12s, or add a subwoofer.

I like the QSCs, a bit more money but known quality. Others can probably suggest less expensive but still good speakers (e.g. Yamaha or EV). I also love the XR18. I mount the tablet for controlling it right on my mic stand so everything is at my fingertips. Being able to walk out in the house and make adjustments is fantastic. I've done a couple gigs lately running through various house PAs, and everyone is doing the digital/tablet thing; it's a game changer.

[JGarofalo3]

Originally Posted by Chipotle

In this kind of situation I like to be "modular", rather than use an all-in-one array system. You can mix/max pieces to fit the size of the group and the size of the space.

My system covers everything from a solo show at a tiny coffee shop to a full band in a decent size outdoor setting: Two QSC K10.2s, a QSC CP8, and Behringer XR18 mixer.

Tiny coffee shop solo? Plug guitar & mic straight into CP8. A bit bigger? K10 on a stand "high & behind", with mixer if using a 2nd guitar or another musician. For bigger places and/or a band, K10s out front, CP8 as a monitor, all running through the XR18 (18 inputs, 6 aux outs plus main L/R). If you have bass/keys, maybe bump up to K12s, or add a subwoofer.

I like the QSCs, a bit more money but known quality. Others can probably suggest less expensive but still good speakers (e.g. Yamaha or EV). I also love the XR18. I mount the tablet for controlling it right on my mic stand so everything is at my fingertips. Being able to walk out in the house and make adjustments is fantastic. I've done a couple gigs lately running through various house PAs, and everyone is doing the digital/tablet thing; it's a game changer.

Appreciate the suggestions as I am a fan of mixed set ups and am a fan of QSC too. For my full band I use a QSC mixer with JBL speaker cabs and different monitors although in the full band I personally use IEM. I can always pivot to that gear when I have multiple pieces and larger, more expansive venues but was/am looking for something for more intimate (<100 ppl) or an outdoor Tiki bar and (selfishly speaking) looking to do less lugging around as I get older and dont have the juice to carry the heavy s**t like I used to LOL

[Chipotle]

Originally Posted by JGarofalo3

Appreciate the suggestions as I am a fan of mixed set ups and am a fan of QSC too. For my full band I use a QSC mixer with JBL speaker cabs and different monitors although in the full band I personally use IEM. I can always pivot to that gear when I have multiple pieces and larger, more expansive venues but was/am looking for something for more intimate (<100 ppl) or an outdoor Tiki bar and (selfishly speaking) looking to do less lugging around as I get older and dont have the juice to carry the heavy s**t like I used to LOL

Even the "heavy" stuff these days is nothing compared to way back when (racks of power amps, anyone?). A CP8 is a great lower-cost and lower-weight (21lbs) option, and is appropriate for a small acoustic group if you don't need low-end for bass or keys. I don't think the all-in-one stick systems necessarily are lighter weight than individual pieces if you choose carefully, although they may come out ahead in ease of set up, particularly if this setup will only be used for a small group/space and you don't need it to handle a larger venue.

[nickfromny]

Lots of great choices for you..


Speakers:
Yamaha DBR 10s or 12's (both on sale right now)
Yamaha DXR 10 or 12
QSC K10.2 or 12.2

All of those come with 6 or 7 year warranties.

Mixer-
it depends if you are open to digital/Ipad control
For me, the best new small format mixer that can have on board control and ipad control is the Allen and Heath CQ series. the CQ12 will be great for what you want, can record multitrack to an SD card, has great preamps and effects. Lacks some of the more advanced features that I don't think you will ever need. Need an external router if you want Ipad control. Everyone can control their own monitor mix, etc. The bigger A&H CQ stuff has built in 5ghz routers that work great.

If you are anti-digital mixer, than Any Allen and Heath Zed series mixer will be great. Built like a tank, sounds great, proven track record. I am not a fan of the Yamaha mixers, but some are.

As a solo artist who loops percussion and who plays 4-6 nights a week, I use this
either a QSC K10.2 or
QSC K8.2 over an EV 12" sub for a fuller range sound
Allen and Heath CQ mixer ( I have all 3 and use whatever I need for the show)


A new set up of a pair Yamaha DBR 10s (at $319 each right now) and an Allen and Heath CQ12t ($899 but can be had for less with coupons for Memorial Day) will get you an excellent sounding, lightweight PA that will cover most everything you play and have you out the door for under $1500, assuming you don't need new stands, etc... For a step up in sound, go for the DXR's or QSC's, although they are heavier too.

The all in one systems are great, and I used them too but ultimately enjoy the ability to mix and match as needed for each show.

[Chriscom]

Originally Posted by JGarofalo3

Appreciate the suggestions as I am a fan of mixed set ups and am a fan of QSC too. For my full band I use a QSC mixer with JBL speaker cabs and different monitors although in the full band I personally use IEM. I can always pivot to that gear when I have multiple pieces and larger, more expansive venues but was/am looking for something for more intimate (<100 ppl) or an outdoor Tiki bar and (selfishly speaking) looking to do less lugging around as I get older and dont have the juice to carry the heavy s**t like I used to LOL

In that case I'd join Yamaha guy in recommending the EV Evolve 30m, which is what I use for venues even somewhat larger than that size. The only caveat would be how heavy is too heavy. The sub is about 35 pounds, and I personally get tired of lugging that up and down in my third-story walkup apartment. Another possible drawback is that the app for the built-in mixer isn't exceptionally well documented--but now that I know it, I love it. Been gigging with it for a couple years now.

You can check out the specs and inputs and all that here

https://www.sweetwater.com/store/det...-speaker-black

My only other comment is that bass players of any type generally seem to fare better with their own amps. There's a larger Evolve, the 50m, but then you're really getting heavier and it may not be worth the larger sub. Now I just gigged a rainy farmer's market with the EV Everse 8, and they now have a 12, and I bet the latter could handle 100 just fine (I'd do it with my 8 if the audience wasn't outright screaming the whole time) but then you're down to two combo TRS/XLR inputs and a bluetooth/eighth-inch.


The other stick system I'm familar with is the Bose line, and while great, the built-in number of inputs and EQ/mixer are much more limited without using an outboard mixer, by Bose or someone else. Bose Pro8, Pro16 would be your candidates.

[Medford Guitar]

My group (me on acoustic, 3 female singers) use an EV Evolve 50 with an Allen Heath ZED 10FX. The mixer is small and works excellent. Great EQ on it.

Yes the sub comes in at 44lbs but I use a cart so it's not too bad.

We do similar gigs, breweries, wineries, etc. We tend to get many compliments about our sound. Especially from other musicians.

[JGarofalo3]

All great feedback - thank you

Why would you choose the EV over the JBL PRX or visa versa?

Seems like the JBL system is a bit more robust and tech a bit better but they are certainly comparable

[Chriscom]

Originally Posted by JGarofalo3

All great feedback - thank you

Why would you choose the EV over the JBL PRX or visa versa?

Seems like the JBL system is a bit more robust and tech a bit better but they are certainly comparable

I'm a 30m (and Everse 8) owner so definitely biased. That being said, I'm not sure in what way the JBL system is a bit more robust--sincerely interested to know. The manual mixer control screen looks much better than what's on the back of the 30m/50m for sure, but I never use that anyway.

The JBL PRX One doesn't get as much love around here after a number of users reported significant problems with the app, partly re part of its functionality, and especially reliability issues during gigs. Scanning past threads, I see some users felt the knobs and such weren't as solid as they could be. An earlier JBL PA, while sounding great apparently, had some gain-stage issues that required a little jerry-rigging to handle, nothing anyone couldn't handle though, like a DI of some type in front of the mic input (IIRC).

I could be wrong, but I think the PRX One is all-plastic. Personally I am not against that per se, there are varied qualities, but the Evolve subs are plywood which I feel improve low-end sound. (They definitely increase weight!).

My 30m's app is amazing, (after you figure it out), it has plenty of inputs for this solo guy with room for guests, the sound draws frequent compliments, and it's built like a tank. This is just me but the only PA I ever considered instead was something in the new Bose line, which has its unsurpassed 180-deg dispersion. But with a less solid stick build, limited built-in inputs and mixing, and idiotic lack of a master volume, I ruled out any of them.

It's entirely possible JBL has solved its app issue and I'm sure there are happy users.

[jseth]

For guitar/voice application, I am a HUGE fan of the Bose rigs... I don't think that a Pro8 is enough for two or three players, though...

I'd say get the Pro16 or 32 and be done with it.

I still have and love my older L1 Model II rig, and I have no plans to sell it for something else... I've heard a lot of other "stick" type PA's, but they don't sound nearly as natural or as good as my Bose does...

[meb]

Other posters have given the agf laundry list of frfr speakers and stick systems.
To me, it is how to combine them. I like a stick system to serve as my foundation,
It provides a small footprint, serves as my monitor I hear what the audience
hears, and hopefully standalone covers a majority of my shows.
If I need more, I can DI out from there to whatever other speakers I need.
I have a QSC K8.2 and an RCF 708A.

I personally use the Pro8 as my foundation. I like the Bose ergonomics
(I still wish the Pto8 was lighter)
and analog interface to the digital world. To others who actually like
and can operate the DSP/ipad....interface to the EV30M, kudos! great choice.
Learning the EV interface also makes for an easy transition to add an Everse 8.

I remember hauling 2 frfr speakers around, putting them on high stands with
cables all over the room. I keep looking for suitable lightweight frfr
speakers to use standalone, but keep coming back to my sick pro8.