Resonator... Gretsch or National?
 

I’d like to take the resonator plunge and play some finger style blues. My heart says National El Trovador but my wallet says Gretsch Alligator. Unfortunately I have NO local shops with both to play side by side.

Any advice? Is the tone of the National worth saving up for a year? Or are they close enough that I should get the Gretsch now?

I guess I can throw in the option of saving up for a few months for Gold Tone as well.

Thanks in advance

The overall higher quality of the National is immediately apparent when you can compare them side by side, but from what I have seen and heard - and from personal experience owning and using a National guitar and several National mandolins - I think that a low cost Gretsch resonator guitar will probably give you 90% of the sound of the National for a lot less money.

As it happens, I worked with Don Young and MacGregor Gaines, the two owners of National Reso-Phonic at the time, while they were developing what eventually became the National RM-1 mandolin. I was a consultant for the project. On one of my visits to their plant I asked Don whether all the inexpensive Asian-made resonator guitars like Regals and Gretschs were robbing sales from them.

“No, not at all,” he told me. “Just the opposite.” He went on to say that lots of players start off with these affordable resonator guitars, then as they go forward with playing them, after awhile decide that they want to upgrade to a National. He and Mac saw these low cost resonator instruments as a sort of informal feeder system that helped generate future sales for National.

So my suggestion is that you seek out a few resonator guitars to play, both Nationals and Gretschs if you can find them, then decide how much you want to invest at this point.

For a lot of guitarists, an inexpensive resonator guitar is as much of a resonator as they’re ever going to need, especially if they’re looking at it as a second or third instrument to double on. But if you’re like a lot of players, you might find that it whets your appetite for an even better one.

And that’s when you start working towards putting some money aside and stepping up to a National.

Short version: you might find that a Gretsch resonator guitar is as much resonator as you’re ever going to need. But if not, then look into upgrading.

Hope this helps.


Wade Hampton Miller

Nationals definitely have a smoother more refined tone. What I didn't care for about Nationals is the wider nut. A 1 3/4 nut is the widest I can deal with. Nationals are usually wider. So keep an eye on that aspect. Also keep in mind that the cone of resonator guitars can be upgraded for smoother sounds. After market of coarse.

I didn’t think about a cone upgrade, that’s a good idea to explore.

I have a National 12 fret NRP that I bought used online. You can probably find some "like new" used El Trovadors around that will save you a lot of money. So that might help.

Based on playing one Gretsch for about 30 seconds out of curiousity post-NRP purchase (and the roughly ten or so other Nationals I had previously played), I would not recommend a Gretsch reso unless you get your hands on one and tell yourself you could be satisfied with it.

Nationals sound hauntingly beautiful. They sing and reverberate. They also look nice. The Gretsch I played sounded like a garbage can lid soiled with three inches of gunk by comparison. The Gretsch also felt like it easily weighed twice as much as my NRP.

However, if we ever experience a zombie apocalypse and ten to twelve of the brain eaters are dragging their legs after you, the Gretsch would undoubtedly knock them all down if tossed, whereas an El Trovador would only take out two or three. So the Gretsch has that going for it.

Buy cheap, buy twice!

Go for the National. If you like the wood body sound (as do I) then the Estralita is also worth considering, plus a little extra space on the fretboard.

Also, consider a used one, but National necks and neck sets can be dodgy, so you do need to know what you're looking at.

I'm with Wade on this one. A Gretsch ain't a National, that's for sure.

That said, I've had a Gretsch Boxcar for about 5 years and I am very happy with it's performance. Sounds like a reso should and plays very well.

Keep in mind that everything I play are budget guitars. I do make a good portion of my living gigging with them though.

Don't wait a year for a National - get a Gretsch now and start enjoying it right away. You can also buy a National later. My .02 :)

I fortunately own a Hot Rod : that brand was marketted for some times some years ago. They were sold around 1k$ brand new then. Maybe you could find a used one. The guy who ran that brand is a National lover that wanted to offer an alternative at lower price...

A Gretsch is a good place to start. They are consistent and playable out-of-the-box. Save a ton of $$$ and see where it goes. Enjoy the ride.

Shall I assume you mean the Gretsch is a metal bodied model and not a wood? Otherwise I need to question your logic on the SHTF scenario described here :) :)

He is, no doubt, talking about the Gretsch Honeydipper metal bodied reso. I had one, but it was so loud and heavy I sold it and got a Boxcar. Very heavy.

I was going to say something along these lines but Wade said it so much better than I. It's like most things. Yes, I can tell the difference when side by side but in the midst of a song, those differences fade away for me. The increased cost simply wasn't worth it for me so I have a Gretsch Boxcar and simply love it. I'd love a national too but my used Gretsch was way less than $300 and worth every penny.

If you want to hear how great a Gretsch G9200 "Boxcar" can sound, go to Youtube and enter G9200 and look at Toby Walker's video--I went and bought one after watching it!! As with many things, the quality of the tool is not the limiting factor for me. Bill

I like Silly Moustache's comment - Buy cheap, buy twice!

Go to Reverb and set up a feed for National’s. Watch it like a hawk. Reasonably priced ones pop up but they go quickly. I got my 2005 Polychrome Tricone for under $1200 and bought it within an hour of it being listed. Selllers who have things listed will sometimes do a big price drop. You have to do your research and be ready to jump.

Nothing wrong with Gretsch and they are good for the money but the difference is night and day and it’s worth being patient for a good deal on a National. It will also hold its value.

Not sure whereabouts you are, but if in the UK, tryout Michael Messer guitars, both wood and metal body are great quality for their money.

Definitely a National wins over a gretsch, but the cost difference is considerable! I've never owned a Gretsch but I have played quite a few over the years in stores as I am always curious (and Republics and so on). I would definitely try before you buy if you can, I played two identical models side by side at one stage (I think it was a boxcar...) one was not good at all and the other was really, really nice. I played another recently which I liked so much I was mentally going through my collection deciding what to sell before I snapped out of it.
They can be great, but play first if you if you can.

I play blues with a slide on my resonator guitars. I own a Gretch Boxcar, Gold Tone PBR-D with a Beard Legend cone, and a National steel NRP. For general information: the NRP has a biscuit bridge steel body, the Boxcar and the PBR-D have a spider bridge laminate wood body. The two different styles have very different tones to me. The Boxcar is a great value. I also bought a Boxcar after watching Toby Walker on Youtube. The Boxcar is no match for the PBR-D or the NRP but is still a very good instrument.

I bought my 2007 PBR-D used, in 2018, for $500 with a good quality hardshell case. I changed out the 11 year old Beard BC-1 cone for a Beard Legend cone. Huge difference in tone with the Legend cone. I really love this guitar. I often see these on the used market for a reasonable price.

The NRP is a 2009 model. I bought it in 2019 for $1500 with OEM hardshell case. It is in mint condition. I replaced the cone with a new National cone. I assumed replacing a 10 year old cone would be a good idea. There was noticeable tone improvement with the new cone. The NRP is a much better built guitar than the other two and I would buy another if mine disappeared.

On another note, I bought a Gold Tone Beard GRS, online from Guitar Center, before I bought the NRP. The GRS is biscuit bridge steel body guitar that looks similar to a NRP. I thought since I liked my Gold Tone Beard PBR-D, I would like the GRS. I did not care for the tone or the construction of the GRS. In open G tuning it sounded like a banjo. I tried different cones and strings and was never able to get decent tone from the guitar. When I had the cone out, I inspected the construction inside. The structural design was somewhat similar to the NRP neckstick design but the workmanship and execution was very sloppy. I took the GRS back to Guitar Center I went on the hunt for my NRP.

I'm not that much of a resonator player but I've never played a Gretsch that sounded or felt anywhere as nice as a good National. I've owned a Tricone in the past and am presently saving up for a Collegian for country blues slide

Are you Ray Whitney who used to play hockey for the San Jose Sharks?

I have a Gretsch Honeydipper. It's a decent reso for someone like me that only plays slide once in a while.

It's not a National. But I didn't expect it to be.

But worth what I paid for it no doubt.

Been trying this... I think you’re right. I’m not looking at that specific model but several that I like are popping up used but barely played for a substantial discount and it makes the economics pretty different. I think I’m going to save up for the National. Thanks to everyone for the feedback.

And if that post was from Ray Whitney of the Sharks, thanks for all the great goals, esp that 2OT goal against Kidd in the playoffs!!

Ha, just saw this. No that’s not me. I only played for the Red Wings! (just kidding).

I have a Republic Duolian that sounds good and plays easily as received from Republic. I ordered mine with an optional Schatten NR-2 Biscuit Bridge Piezo Pickup. The guitar comes with a really decent hardened gig bag. The whole shebang cost me about $800 shipped including tax. Read my review here

Republic Guitars

If you're just going to dip your toe into the pool, a Gretsch is fine. I say buy used, so you don't lose a lot if you decide to upgrade and sell i . If you're serious, buy once and get a National. Used Nationals can be found for not that much if you're patient. And others may disagree, but I say go with a metal body for any thing other than a spider cone!

For blues, a single biscuit cone.
Fingerpicking and all rounder, tricone
For bluegrass, Spider cone

Bummer. It would be super cool if you went from Hockey pro to acoustic guitar player and gave me advice on this forum. I guess that was a long shot but I’ll still listen to you :)

Those are cool. Never heard of them before. Thanks for the suggestion!

Yeah I’ve been lazy about working on my blues during covid so I haven’t bought anything yet. However I was thinking it probably makes sense for me to get a less expensive resonator for now and see if it sticks before deciding if I want to get someone in the $2k+ range.

Truth is, I’m more of an electric guy and dabble in finger style blues and classical so I can get by with a $500-800 guitar no problem. If me testing the waters becomes life changing.. well then it’s totally worth a bigger investment.

Thanks for the feedback.

HERE is my review of the Gretsch G9202 Honey Dipper Special I've added to my studio kit. i agree with Wade: if this is going to be a first-line instrument for you, you will probably want a National or a Dobro. I get a request do to a session with a reso about once every two years so I just needed a decent reso at a price point that wouldn't dominate my budget. Be sure to read all the way down about the case and cone.

Bob

Thanks for all the info in this thread, it's all very informative. I'm thinking about getting one and am looking at a real nice Gretsch Boxcar right now for $350. That's all my budget will allow at this time. I'll let you know if I get it.