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KevWind 08-08-2021 09:56 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Pnewsom (Post 6781255)
This is getting into advanced territory, but it's good to see and hear what's possible.

There are three ranges available to a singer. The body or full voice, head voice, and falsetto. The full voice is obvious and lots of singers can manage two or more octaves range with it. Head voice can add an octave or more, and the falsetto allows even more range.

However, crossing over from one voice to the next in a way that sounds seamless is the challenge, but once learned it can be a great asset.

Here's a nice example, with Joey Landreth moving through all three vocal ranges, along with some great harmony singing and playing.

Interesting also I note he is capo'ed @ 3


I am a seat of the pants type when comes to vocals (no formal training )
I get the falsetto in this fun cover of Stayin' Alive.
So in this is it falsetto and head or is there body also ?

Noting they are both capo @ 1

rllink 08-08-2021 10:04 AM

As long as we've veered off on the capo discussion, over time I've found that I utilize the capo much more as I have gotten better at playing the guitar. It isn't a crutch, it has become a tool of the trade.

Deliberate1 08-08-2021 10:08 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Pnewsom (Post 6781255)
Here's a nice example, with Joey Landreth moving through all three vocal ranges, along with some great harmony singing and playing.


OP here. Been a really log time since I heard that tune, on a long lost Ry Cooder disc. What a gem. And Joey has got it down. Thanks for that.
David

Deliberate1 08-08-2021 10:17 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by KevWind (Post 6781327)
Interesting also I note he is capo'ed @ 3


I am a seat of the pants type when comes to vocals (no formal training )
I get the falsetto in this fun cover of Stayin' Alive.
So in this is it falsetto and head or is there body also ?

Noting they are both capo @ 1

OP here. LOVE it!
What a Martin was meant for....
David

KevWind 08-08-2021 10:35 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Brent Hahn (Post 6780774)
Interesting. That's a great song for you. I'd love to hear you try it in G (no capo, same chord shapes) or ideally F# (capo up two frets with E and A chord shapes). In A, you seem a little tentative going up to those D's and it gets you out of that lovely warm chesty thing you do so well. In F#, those D's would become B's and you'd sail right through them.

So not that song but here is one in G no capo, a John Prine cover I posted over in the JP cover thread .

This is from a series of cover songs I have been doing I call "One shot One Take " which they literally are And is also a good lesson in what not to do when recording of playing live ,,,which is when backed off from with this mic (in cardioid mode). turning my head to glance at the fretting hand (a bad habit of mine) results in a significant trailing off presence. So do you think in this situation setting the mic for OMNI would be better ? Understanding learning to not rotate my head would be more desirable . Same thing with occasionally shifting the guitar


Brent Hahn 08-08-2021 11:29 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by KevWind (Post 6781359)
So do you think in this situation setting the mic for OMNI would be better?

No way to know without trying it, I guess. But I don't really have a problem with the sound changing when you turn your head, wouldn't have noticed if you didn't bring it up. The mic's fairly far off, and those big LDC's are cardioid but not laser-beam directional. With something like a Neumann KSM105 or a Sennheiser e945 (both very popular, very directional live-performance mics), peek-sneaking can really wreck a recording, but I think this sounds absolutely fine. And the song and the key are a great fit for you.

Andyrondack 08-08-2021 11:48 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by KevWind (Post 6781327)
Interesting also I note he is capo'ed @ 3


I am a seat of the pants type when comes to vocals (no formal training )
I get the falsetto in this fun cover of Stayin' Alive.
So in this is it falsetto and head or is there body also ?

Noting they are both capo @ 1

About these types of voices and how to recognise them, warm up the voice by playing a scale on your guitar and humming the note, start low and slowly work higher, as you hum the note really focus on whereabouts in the body you are feeling the resonating note vibrate , at the lower end of your range you should feel the vibrations below the neck, as you hum higher notes then the vibrations should pass through the jaw nose and head, that's the lower voice and head voice, it's just about where you feel the vibrations. Falsetto is what men do when trying to sound like women..

Harmony123 08-08-2021 11:58 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by KevWind (Post 6781327)
....
I get the falsetto in this fun cover of Stayin' Alive. ...

Fantastic! I really enjoyed the performance. So how’d you learn to sing falsetto?

KevWind 08-08-2021 12:38 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Harmony123 (Post 6781428)
Fantastic! I really enjoyed the performance. So how’d you learn to sing falsetto?

No no that is not me ( they could be my kids ) I was just using that as an example to ask about range . I sound like cats in sack when I try to falsetto :D
I am the gramps lookin' guy in the Angle from Montgomery video .... post #35

KevWind 08-08-2021 12:39 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Andyrondack (Post 6781423)
About these types of voices and how to recognise them, warm up the voice by playing a scale on your guitar and humming the note, start low and slowly work higher, as you hum the note really focus on whereabouts in the body you are feeling the resonating note vibrate , at the lower end of your range you should feel the vibrations below the neck, as you hum higher notes then the vibrations should pass through the jaw nose and head, that's the lower voice and head voice, it's just about where you feel the vibrations. Falsetto is what men do when trying to sound like women..

Hey thanks for info I will give it whirl

Andyrondack 08-09-2021 07:15 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by KevWind (Post 6781456)
Hey thanks for info I will give it whirl

Perhaps what I wrote did not give quite an acurate idea, because it's possible to manipulate the voice and sing lower notes of a song in a head voice and higher notes in a chest voice by manipulating where the noise vibrates, probably best to play around this by trying to sing in someone else's style, so for a lower voice you might pretend to be Howling Wolf or Odetta then sing the same thing in the style of Shirley Temple without actually singing any higher and feel how the location of resonating vibrations change.

KevWind 08-09-2021 07:35 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Andyrondack (Post 6781969)
Perhaps what I wrote did not give quite an acurate idea, because it's possible to manipulate the voice and sing lower notes of a song in a head voice and higher notes in a chest voice by manipulating where the noise vibrates, probably best to play around this by trying to sing in someone else's style, so for a lower voice you might pretend to be Howling Wolf or Odetta then sing the same thing in the style of Shirley Williams without actually singing any higher and feel how the location of resonating vibrations change.

:up::up::up:

Pnewsom 08-09-2021 09:48 AM

I've had good results from imitating my talkative cat and dog.

I first recognized head voice watching Neil Young singing. I heard the sound and saw the face expression and some how I knew this is what I'd been looking for. I had been killing myself try to sing too high in full voice.

Should have taken some lessons earlier on in life.

Andyrondack 08-09-2021 01:07 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by KevWind (Post 6781992)
:up::up::up:

Sorry that should have been Shirley Temple not Williams, she was a Labour MP, not sure she ever sang anything.

The Bard Rocks 08-09-2021 07:44 PM

Getting back to where we started, I think it is critical to know your range. And it's easy to discover. It befuddles me that so few people establish this and then they get surprised when they can't sing something (or, worse, don't know that they can't). For me there are 2 uppers and lowers to know. The first is how high or how low are you fully comfortable with? (Match single notes you play to what you can sing and you'll quickly discover your range.) The second is what are the limits?

When selecting the key to play in, I try to keep the highest and lowest notes of the song within my comfort range. Usually that works. But if the song goes higher or lower than what is comfortable but still stays within the possible, I will keep the song, assuming I like it enough. On a high note above my comfort level, I can still be reasonably good sounding if it is one that is punched, rather than held.


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