Entry level recording rig for teenager stuck at home...
My friends' daughter is 16 and like most of the world, can't get out of her house.
She is a decent guitarist and can sing and play some keyboard. She has started writing music just sent me a message asking what a decent but inexpensive recording system I'd recommend. Just something for demos to get her ideas down. I'm guessing she has $200-$300 to spend. She already has a mic. I'm clueless. Any ideas? Thanks! David |
Tell her to get a used Apogee One. It’ll be a mic and interface all in one. They’re great.
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Zoom R8 and a good set of headphones. She can record anywhere, not tied to her computer. (Tascam is also a choice...) The huge advantage of this comes from the creativity side of the equation. It's super-easy and you don't get sidetracked by manipulating the technology. Recording is intimidating enough, let alone without needing to worry about the tons of things that you need to concern yourself with. Much better to hit the red button and have a hardware device that is designed to be easy to operate. Save all the complex stuff for when you're sitting behind the DAW screen, no instrument in hand. Step 2: If she ends up with anything she wants to take further in the process of production then the tracks can be imported into her computer and edited or manipulated within any DAW she jells with. |
Get a Spire Studio. It's great and can record up to eight tracks, so she can record her different instruments and voice separately, then combine into one song. It has a very decent built in mic, but her separate one can be plugged in if desired.
Do some searches on this site and the internet and read others opinions on how useful and cool this thing is. |
Thanks guys! Much appreciated!
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Zoom H5.......
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Since she already has a mic, maybe a Zoom or Tascam handheld recorder with mic inputs. They also have internal mics as well.
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What about video/audio recording? The ZOOM Q2n is under $150 on Amazon. 2 built-in mics. Runs on 2-AA batteries or usb power-bank. Decent audio and video settings for a pocket-sized inexpensive scratch-pad idea recording gizmo. And what 16 year old girl wouldn't want to see her "selfie" performing her creations too. Which can be saved to a mini-sd card - laptop, and/or posted online.
I have the first version. It's easy and great to see & hear instant audio/video results right on the units' tiny screen and tiny speaker, or line-out through the headphone jack and video-out connections. They now have an updated Q2n 4k model for fifty bucks more. Good luck! |
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I'm thinking of doing the same, get a, Zoom q2n 4k, but wondering if for like $50 more I might be missing out on something a lot better. Is it a big price jump to go a grade better than the q2n 4k? I saw a video of a guy who used a GoPro Hero 6 with a small Rode mic. The Hero 6 is now older and prices came down for that... only he was using it for conferences with his business and not music... For 2 yrs I've had very nice response at open mics and would have started first time coffeehouse gigs to try my music with the general public only the CoVid19 happened. It's just my vocals with guitar and sometimes harmonica. I thought I could post my songs as a video on YouTube to see how the general public likes me as I believe open mic goers are more empathetic and not the real test. I'm just trying to avoid having to learn software like ProTools etc. and keep it simpler that way but have reasonable quality on a low budget. I'm willing to spend $300 and see the q2n 4k, at $250. Thanks! Winfred |
Amazon has the H4n Pro for $189 right now. Multi-track recorder, USB interface, USB microphone all in one. Any teen's iPhone will have a better camera than the Zoom Q
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If you have an Apple computer I would always recommend Garageband and a basic USB interface as a cheap way to get recording.
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Hi!
I'm a songwriting musician trying to find ways to present my music and looking at the Zoom q2n-4k and as of yesterday noticed 4-19-20 they upped the price to $220. Like you suggest maybe she doesn't need the 4k version. I checked Amazon, and several other independent sites and they all have it at $220, so maybe the company requested it of all their sellers. I also read that the two batteries run out quickly and is strongly suggested to buy the $44.25 battery compartment with a very high shipping cost of $13.95 for something so very small and light. It also comes with no batteries. Maybe she doesn't need it as 2 batteries can run it for 2 hrs, but not sure if that's 2 hrs at the highest resolution 4k video and 96hz recording or not. Maybe that doesn't help, but I tried. Sincerely, Winfred Quote:
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I have the Q2n - the battery life is no where close to 2 hrs (maybe if you used the audio only setting). I use a Mophie USB power bank and another no-name phone charger that works well. So if you have
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Those of you who require 2 hours of video recording time at once have my respect. That said, you can use any phone charger with the Zoom q2n-4k and have essentially infinite time (subject to vagaries of power distribution and more critically, the capacity of your memory card).
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I have an Apogee- it’s great, but getting the spire made everything easier. |
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https://www.acousticguitarforum.com/...d.php?t=502715 The learning curve on this is much easier than a Zoom H4n Pro (I have both - haven't used the H4n Pro since getting the Spire Studio). Combined with the app for iPhone or iPad, you get a lot of good options and up to 8 tracks. |
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Do you mean the "iZotope Spire Studio Portable Recorder" I see on Amazon for $295? Reading back in the thread, I realize this Father wants something for his child just to record and not video too, and I see now how the Spire would be simple and great to use. Do you mean you couple the Spire with your iPhone or iPad for the camera part of it in order to create a video? I don't have either type of phone or pad just a desktop PC, and a laptop that are both about 9 yrs old and no camera lenses on them. I have just a small Skype type of lens I've never used yet. It's one that you clip to the top center of your flat screen... but it's the real minimal kind of lens, to me not of a nice enough quality as I'd like to get. I think iPhones are Apple aren't they? So if I pay for a Spire plus a nicer phone (I have a cheap smart phone that was free for Seniors via a charity) wouldn't I with the Spire spend maybe close to $500? How complex is the Zoom q8 or the other one, the h4n Pro? Do you like the $220 q2n-4k? I kind of have a feeling getting the q2n-4k as buying problems... but maybe not. Would in my case I be better off getting one of the Zooms? Thanks! Winfred |
The Zoom recorders are great! Keep in mind that the entry level ones sound as good as the more expensive models when you use the built in XY mics (which is to say stellar!). The advantage to the more expensive ones is having more inputs and features. This is only an advantage if you have high quality external mics. An inexpensive Zoom on a stand is probably exactly what she needs.
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I have no hands-on experience with the q2n-4k, but I have used the H4n Pro, both as a recorder and for feeding audio to a video. For what I am doing with video, it was more work than it was worth. I found the H4n Pro very clumsy to use - too many fussy wheel turns and button pushes to work your way through the menus. Currently, for YouTube videos, I am using a Shure MV88+ video kit, which essentially is a small condenser mic that is attached to the iPhone, significantly enhancing the audio when using the iPhone's video capability (which is plenty enough for me). Yes, iPhone and iPads are Apple products. I think you would be into it for more than $500 if you were to buy a Spire Studio and an older generation Apple device. If the phone you are currently using is capable of recording video, you can use the onboard mic of that device and not have to spend any additional $$. I find the onboard mic for phones is great when using it as a phone, and not so great for other uses... BUT it would get you started; with no additional investment. It costs nothing to set up a YouTube channel, as long as you have an internet connection... and since you are posting here, I'd say you are good to go. I know you have some concerns about random comments when posting on the internet, but (as far as I know) no one has actually died from embarrassment. Record some music and post away! I have been playing for over 50 years, and last recorded something about 40 years ago. About 4 years ago, my wife asked if I'd record some music so she could have it on her phone and iPad. My first recordings were made with the mic on an iPad Mini. Looking back, they sounded pretty awful, but my wife was happy to have something on her devices. I bought the H4n Pro to get better sounding recordings. I would transfer the files from the H4n Pro to my laptop and into a DAW (digital audio workstation). It took time and effort to make it happen, but I was able to record 4 tracks, so I could do a vocal/guitar stereo track, a bass track, and a drum track. She was delighted with those results. She is the one who suggested I get the Spire Studio... what a difference! I have recorded a bunch of songs with the Spire, and what used to take me all day with the H4n Pro, I can accomplish in an hour or so. I'm not looking to be "discovered." I played out for a lot of years, with bands, a duo, and a trio, but solo the last few decades. I do an occasional gig because it is working with people that I enjoy. I don't need the recording to support any aspirations. If you want to hear any recording I've done, look at the "Enjoying the Spire Studio" thread on this sub-forum. I particularly enjoy collaborating with my long-time friend and music partner, and the Spire Studio has made that easy for us, since we are about 1,400 miles apart. So, probably more than you were asking about, but distilling that down to one suggestion: use what you have to record. If that doesn't please you, then considering what you want for sound, you can start spending more money. In the past couple years, I have probably spent a several grand buying stuff for recording... the other equipment for playing out (PA, amps, pedals, and a variety of guitars) is stuff I already had. In the grand scheme of things, the Spire Studio has been the best investment (for me) for recording... but, you DO need a device (phone or tablet) to get the most out of it. Then, it is a matter of climbing that learning curve with mic placement, EQ, mixing, sound enhancements, etc to get the sound you want. Good luck with the process. When retail comes back around, go to a music store that also handles recording equipment and see what they recommend. Jim |
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What about something simple and cheap like this into an iPhone or iPad and just record a video using the Apple device, or even GarageBand or the Zoom app for audio. Seems like a reasonable solution to just get going using the pretty good power/quality of what so many already have. I don’t record at all, but am thinking of going this route. Thoughts? Any one try one of these?
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The Spire has a pretty decent condenser mic built-in and two preamp inputs... but I'm not aware of anyone using it to add audio to a video. |
For Winfred: since I was unfamiliar with the Zoom Q2n-4k, I took a few minutes to look it up. Looks like a slick little unit for doing videos, if you don't already have an iPhone or equivalent. For $220, it seems to have some of the capability of the Zoom H4n Pro (audio recorder) with a camera similar to a low level GoPro (without the weather-proof capability). I don't see a downside to that.
Those cameras have a relatively wide angle view - any of the narrower views are "digital cropping," so with each increase in apparent focal length, you are getting less data. Just something to keep in mind, if the view of the camera seems a bit too wide for your use. "Zooming in" will result in less video quality. That $220 is less than the cost of an audio recorder and most action camera video recorders (which typically have crap audio). Looks to me like it would be an inexpensive way to get into making some YouTube videos. I'm guessing that the $20 increase is due to the same reason the Shure MV88+ is out of stock almost everywhere: increased interest in making videos because everyone is home, with plenty of time on their hands. Good luck with the options! |
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I searched the Spire and looked at the H4n. I'm glad to know about the Spire and some day maybe I'll get one. Right now all I want to try is YouTube just to see if the general public, beyond the open mics I've played at, responds to my music. I just feel the open mic people are more empathetic than the general public. I was going to try my music to the general public at coffeehouse gigs and had contacted some owners of coffeehouses yet just before performing the virus CoVid19 hit. I need some visual means as I plan to create videos of me playing for YouTube, yet I feel they'll be bored looking at just me ha! Another artist makes sense in that others want to see the artist because they want to learn how they played a particular song. My chords are very easy, so maybe the first verses, then the bridge, then maybe go to nice scenes etc. that could go with my song. With "Both Sides Now" by Joni Mitchell, I'll get permission to play it, then post it. Once they see my simple chords it would go to maybe nice pictures of clouds or free video clips from some of the sites with clouds, like from "pixabay" or one of those free sites. I don't think anyone will click on my original song... so planning just one cover at first to attract viewers to my originals, that's if anyone even clicks on my cover song ha! I guess with the clouds clips that means having to learn editing software, a problem that I guess is inevitable for me to surmount and maybe after-all just have it where the camera is on me and that's all, a simpler route. I have 2 nice condenser mics, a matched pair too, from years ago I've kept carefully stored for 17 years in the original boxes, and I learned the q8 by Zoom has plug-ins for that, so maybe get the q8... but then I read the q8 only has 2.3K resolution, yet others say it has 3K. I just need to look at videos of the q8 today and decide, but maybe not... more below. I guess at this point I don't need the big mics and maybe just get the q2n-4k by Zoom and save money. The problem then is, the big "if". If my original songs that follow my cover song draw a lot of clicks, then with the q8 I could, I guess... record superior quality to the q2n-4k and post my original songs for sale on like Spotify etc. With my YouTube video I could have a link so they could buy my song at Spotify. What I'm leaning is with the q8 I have two things in one. Let me know what you think... I didn't mention yet that I bought in early January the Scarlet 2i2 3rd Generation that sits still sealed in the original box. I was befuddled over it thinking it was depressing having to learn more software, and other reasons. I guess I could sell the 2i2 as I guess, but not sure, what I record with the q8 and the condenser mics would sound just as good in quality as the 2i2. Is that right? I could then if I get the q8 sell my 2i2 on like Craigs List. Does that sound like the right thing? Maybe I should buy the q8 for that reason? It's kind of intense as I'm seeing prices jump and yesterday saw at least 2 online stores increasing the price of a q8 by $50 more, and some stores noting it's sold out!! I also for 17 years still have the mic stands and nice XLR cables. I also in January had purchased 2 pop filters and 2 shock mounts for the condenser mics that are also still new in the boxes. Do you think recording with the q8 would be just as good as recording (sound wise of course) with the 2i2 so in my case having the q8 would be like two things in one, a better deal? Thanks a million for all of the time you took for an unknown like me! Sorry my learning curve is so flat! I understand if you don't have time... Kindest Regards, Winfred |
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I have been putting out an occasional YouTube video for years (different genres: but mostly motorcycles/scooters, boating/dolphin watching, and music), and most get fewer than 100 views. If the result you are after is a lot of people seeing it, you will have to promote the heck out of it - send the link to everyone you know and encourage them to send to everyone they know, post it on other social media (Facebook, Twitter, Instagram, and whatever the in-thing is currently). Keep in mind that you are competing for attention with people who post stuff for a living and have some truly professional equipment and staff to support that. Do an internet search on whatever piece of equipment you are considering, and you will see dozens (maybe hundreds) of videos with unboxing, use, and reviews. It will also give you some insight into why some of those videos are so much better than others... and that is usually reflected in the number of views. Just like building a music career, you have to beat back the concern and put something out there. Do a hundred videos and you will learn what works for you and what doesn't. Do one video and it may get lost in the sheer numbers of videos that are uploaded every second. This is absolutely NOT intended to talk you out of doing it - just the opposite: you need to use any bit of equipment you have to start generating content. You can always get better equipment as you progress. Those mics and that audio interface that are sitting in boxes aren't going to record themselves... time to get 'em out and start making some music. No camera? Put it on SoundCloud. Record it again when you get a video camera. Record it again when you get a better camera and/or mic. You will learn a little bit by doing one video... you will learn a lot more by staying at it and putting out more videos. Our daughter is a middle school teacher. We volunteer in her classroom for special projects. If you ask that age kid what they want to do when they're out of school, the majority of them say they want to be a YouTube star or a social influencer. That's your competition. They already have no fear of any kind of media and they upload posts with next to nothing for equipment. All this to say: it matters less what equipment you buy and more about getting it out there... covers, originals - yes, all of it. Go for it! |
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You're a real talent and have been enjoying your recordings! I hadn't heard that, "Please Come to Boston" since when I'd hear it on the radio years ago. They seemed to play it in the fall when college started and it was hard for the protag of the song to leave his loved one, a great song you do very well with, and the others too! I just wanted to pass this by you and have to decide very soon because of prices going up on things (Zoom q8 went up $50 suddenly and the q2n-4k up $20 with quite a few stores.) and also things selling out. I think hyper inflation looms too. I have a new Scarlet 2i2 still sealed in box since January, a foolish mistake. Would audio be just as good quality with the q8 and I don't need the 2i2 and sell it? I have two hardly used great condenser mics, a matched pair, stored 17 yrs ha! My desktop (Windows 10) and laptop (Windows 7) are 8 yrs old and both “Duo-Core”. I must record in quiet corner of my Senior high-rise late at night, so “my plan”... sneak with guitar on my back, roller suitcase with mics (2 pop screens, and shock mounts too), 25ft long mic cables (Is 25 ft too long and lose power etc?), mic stands, q8 to be (hard to boycott Amazon but bad treatment of employees over CoVid19), camera tripod to be, desk lamp for lighting ha!, maybe bring laptop if I must (Is laptop necessary when filming, and Windows 7 too old?) or can I later add slight reverb etc once I download into my desktop? Recording just my vocals, acoustic guitar with no plug-in, and harmonica, hoping to post my original music, also 1 or 2 covers, on YouTube. Is all that doable? Do I need to copyright my originals and pay some kind of fee if I play a cover? THANKS!! Winfred |
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