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  #16  
Old 10-25-2017, 07:36 PM
Guitar Slim II Guitar Slim II is offline
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Originally Posted by mistertomlinson View Post
You guys are FREA-KING AMAZING! Especially JonPR for really going above and beyond what I expected. It's awesome that I can just go online and ask for help and people I've never met will take the time out of their day to help me with no benefit to be gained. Freaking... awesome.



1. The nerd in me definitely wants the 8 under the clef. As a guitarist, I like that it signifies the music is for guitar. Now, does it have to be literally attached like in your image or can it hover below like AndreF's image?

6. I did mean to put the staccato in that bar. Unless I am mistaken as to how it should be notated, the duration of that note is short. I thought it was supposed to be there. Also, would you mind explaining why some of your staccato dots aren't centered? What exactly does it mean?

7. "Repeat and Fade" does look nicer than "4x."

8. As for the permanency of the tattoo and possible regret down the road, my precondition to getting a tattoo is that it be meaningful enough that I never regret it and this meets that criteria. Honestly, I'm not even a Metallica fan anymore. And while I do like the song, it's not my appreciation for the song that prompts me get it tattooed permanently on my body (although "permanent" is debatable considering laser removal. While expensive and painful, it IS an option. Though in all seriousness, I know having a tattoo won't actually have a material impact on my life. They are much more acceptable nowadays and the stigma less significant).

My reason for getting the tattoo is because I learned to play this as a teenager and my mom always enjoyed listening to it, despite not being a Metallica fan. She would actually request I play it for her from time to time. She would always tell me she wanted me to play it at her funeral for everyone. But because I get stage fright and choke pretty easily when I play for people and considering the emotional ramifications of losing your mom, I told her I wouldn't do it... and I didn't. So, I thought it apropos to get the outro tattooed instead. It's a tattoo I'll never regret. Trust me, I've been thinking about this since she died 4 years ago and I've finally decided there aren't really any compelling reasons not to do it. I know... it's permanent. I know... there's a stigma, but neither of these really matter. They won't meaningfully impact my life. Plus, it's not a skull with a cobra wrapped around it. It's tasteful. (I also plan to get it touched up as often as necessary as I hate the way faded, green tattoos look). Also, I don't intend to tell anyone but family what the song is, so I don't actually want anyone to recognize it. That's just for me.

In your notation, what does the 3 above the notes in the 4th bar signify? Also, in that same bar, I'm realizing, shouldn't that third chord be staccato as well? So, both examples for the 4th bar are acceptable and neither is the "right" one? I can pick either?

As for cutting the 1st and last bars and changing the repeat symbols, would doing it the other way be incorrect? The problem with removing bars is I actually need it to be long as it's going on the inside of my arm so I'd like it run almost the entire length of it. Would that still be acceptable?

Also, the B and C in bar 3 are correct. He plays that open B a few times where it almost doesn't seem to belong. I actually think that's one of the revisions I need to make. I think I left one or two out.



So, if I had the correct stem on the bass notes to indicate the notes' duration, would everything else be left the same as JonRP notated? Actually, they would be whole notes, right? So they wouldn't have stems but be hollow instead?
Not whole notes, dotted half’s, and they would have a stem. 6/8 equals 3/4 equals three beats per measure equals dotted half.

Note, there is one measure of 3/8. The bass note for that measure would be a dotted quarter, still with the stem.

And the stem directions would need to be corrected on other notes as well.

Last edited by Guitar Slim II; 10-25-2017 at 08:26 PM.
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  #17  
Old 10-25-2017, 08:02 PM
Guitar Slim II Guitar Slim II is offline
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Originally Posted by JonPR View Post
OK, here's that truncated version (including the repeat and fade instruction). Trust me, this would sound the same as the original when repeated.

Tell you what, guys. This is just 7 or 8 bars of music. You and Jon settle on what you think is accurate in regards to the notes, etc, and I'll take a shot at formatting it in way that would please my old professors. Make it look like a proper fancy piece of classical guitar music.

Then the OP will have an AGF-approved model to give to his tattoo artist.

Let me know.
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  #18  
Old 10-25-2017, 08:31 PM
mistertomlinson mistertomlinson is offline
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This is what I've come up with thus far. What does everyone think? There are some errors, but I obviously intend to proofread the final version.

@ Guitar Slim II, I noticed in the 3/8 bar, there isn't actually a bass note. Am I correct that no dotted quarter note need be used? Also, please do post your version. Don't let my latest mockup stop you. I want all the help I can get.

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  #19  
Old 10-25-2017, 08:34 PM
mistertomlinson mistertomlinson is offline
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Actually, I'm listening to it again and see the e from the previous bar is sustained through the 3/8 bar but stops abruptly with the last staccato note in that bar. How would this be notated? I also forgot the staccato for the last note.

Also, if anyone's curious, I intend to have it tattooed to look like it was hand written. I didn't want it to look like it was printed and perfectly uniform. My only requirement is that the staff be perfectly straight, but everything else should look free hand. I'm bringing the artist a few examples I found online. Doing it this way also allows me to put on weight (or muscle ) and not noticeably distort the already imperfect lines.

Sigh. I have more revisions to make. I'm seeing I added notes just assuming the outro was played like the intro, but I'm realizing it isn't. So ignore a couple b notes I put in there that don't belong.

Last edited by mistertomlinson; 10-25-2017 at 08:49 PM.
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  #20  
Old 10-25-2017, 08:47 PM
Guitar Slim II Guitar Slim II is offline
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Whoa, that's awesome. You have a much better "hand" than I do!

I can't speak to the accuracy of the notes or articulations (staccato marks). But the formatting looks much better. The second group of each measure should also have stems up. In fact, everything but the bass notes should be stems up.

I know the rule is: above the middle line, stems down; below the middle line, stems up. But that only applies to single lines and vertical chords. When you have more than one "line" on the staff - bass and whatever - then it gets reversed: all bass stems are down, and all treble stems are up.

So, stems up on everything that's not bass. Correct the dotted quarter to a dotted half.

The 3/8 measure? If the note sustains but is not actually played, then use a tie. In other words, tie the previous dotted half to a dotted quarter in the 3/8 measure. This tells the performer not to pluck it, but to let it continue to ring for that duration.

I think that's it. I offered above to do this in Finale, but I think you've got it covered. I'll eyeball it again if you want, if you make more corrections.

Last edited by Guitar Slim II; 10-26-2017 at 03:12 AM.
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  #21  
Old 10-25-2017, 08:51 PM
mistertomlinson mistertomlinson is offline
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Originally Posted by Guitar Slim II View Post
Whoa, that's awesome. You have a much better "hand" than I do!

I can't speak to the accuracy of the notes or articulations (staccato marks). But the formatting looks much better. The second group of each measure should also have stems up. In fact, everything but the bass notes should be stems up.

I know the rule is: above the middle line, stems down; below the middle line, stems up. But that only applies to single lines and vertical chords. When you have more than one "line" on the page - bass and whatever - then it gets reversed: all bass stems are down, and all treble stems are up.

So, stems up on everything that's not bass. Correct the dotted quarter to a dotted half.

The 3/8 measure? If the note sustains but is not actually played, then use a tie. In other words, tie the previous dotted half to a dotted quarter in the 3/8 measure. This tells the performer not to pluck it, but to let it continue to ring for that duration.

I think that's it. I offered above to do this in Finale, but I think you've got it covered. I'll eyeball it again if you want, if you make more corrections.
Should the notes still be on the right side of their respective stems in the second grouping in each bar? And would there still be a need for 2 groups of note in each bar or would they all be joined by the same beams?
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  #22  
Old 10-25-2017, 08:57 PM
Guitar Slim II Guitar Slim II is offline
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Oh gosh, almost forgot. You don't need to stem the bass notes UP if there is a simultaneous note in the treble. Sometimes you see it any way, for a more consistent look.

But the real reason you stem up is to avoid writing rests above every bass note. If there's already a note there, it's a moot point. So, you can theoretically just write the bass note stem-down, and NOT connect it with the beamed note above -- that is, if there IS a note above. If no note above, stem up as well as down

Either way is acceptable, call it an artistic decision on your part.
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  #23  
Old 10-25-2017, 08:59 PM
Guitar Slim II Guitar Slim II is offline
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Originally Posted by mistertomlinson View Post
Should the notes still be on the right side of their respective stems in the second grouping in each bar? And would there still be a need for 2 groups of note in each bar or would they all be joined by the same beams?
Good questions. The default for 6/8 is 2 groups of 3. Leave them beamed that way. Stems up go to the right of the note, the note head is on the left. It's consistent every time.
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  #24  
Old 10-25-2017, 10:02 PM
DupleMeter DupleMeter is offline
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I agree with Guitar Slim II & mistertomlinson on the notation fixes.

But, I wouldn't connect the bass notes to the treble in a guitar piece.


And that last bar probably warrants an eighth rest on beat 1 of the treble.
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  #25  
Old 10-25-2017, 10:14 PM
Guitar Slim II Guitar Slim II is offline
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Originally Posted by DupleMeter View Post
I agree with Guitar Slim II & mistertomlinson on the notation fixes.

But, I wouldn't connect the bass notes to the treble in a guitar piece.


And that last bar probably warrants an eighth rest on beat 1 of the treble.
Yup, like that look better. Last bar could go either way, a rest would be quite proper in the situation. Generally, you Would connect to the beam on a repetitive pattern, where you have to put rests measure after measure after measure. If there’s just one, a rest is probably preferable.
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  #26  
Old 10-25-2017, 11:02 PM
DupleMeter DupleMeter is offline
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Originally Posted by Guitar Slim II View Post
Yup, like that look better. Last bar could go either way, a rest would be quite proper in the situation. Generally, you Would connect to the beam on a repetitive pattern, where you have to put rests measure after measure after measure. If thereís just one, a rest is probably preferable.
I think the rest, in this case, shows the break in the melody line. To my eyes it just reads better this way. I agree that either would be okay. It's a preference thing at that point.
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  #27  
Old 10-26-2017, 12:15 AM
mistertomlinson mistertomlinson is offline
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I love you guys. Iím away from home right now but Iím gonna do another mock-up today and post anymore questions I might have. Then Iím planning to talk to the artist Friday night for consultation, just to make sure he understands what I want. Then, if all goes well, Iíll be getting it done next Friday.

I really appreciate every... single... contribution you guys have made.
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  #28  
Old 10-26-2017, 02:14 AM
Guitar Slim II Guitar Slim II is offline
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Just want to acknowledge what mistertomlinson said earlier, Jon did the work here and deserves most of the thanks. And DupleMeter, for his contribution. By the way, what software did you use? Finale? Sibeleus?

All I did was nit-pick the score. Scoring is a bit of a craft all it's own, and my comments and corrections were certainly not a criticism of the work done by others. Again, Jon deserves the real thanks here...

And it's really special to be involved in this project even in a small way. I don't have any tattoos, but if I ever heard of a great reason to get one ... and a cool one to get ... this is it. Of course, it's not my skin, is it?

Last edited by Guitar Slim II; 10-26-2017 at 03:04 AM.
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  #29  
Old 10-26-2017, 05:54 AM
JonPR JonPR is offline
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Originally Posted by Guitar Slim II View Post
Just want to acknowledge what mistertomlinson said earlier, Jon did the work here and deserves most of the thanks. And DupleMeter, for his contribution. By the way, what software did you use? Finale? Sibeleus?
Sibelius
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Originally Posted by Guitar Slim II View Post
Of course, it's not my skin, is it?
Mine neither.
I have no tattoos either. Thats just a sign of my inability to commit to anything. Typical guy, right?

If I did have a musical tattoo, it would be this:



As it is, I can't even get round to putting it on a t-shirt...

(Of course I would put ©JonPR on it too.... As long as no one else has copyrighted silence, I should make a fortune.... John Cage only owns 4'33" of it.)
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Last edited by JonPR; 10-26-2017 at 06:02 AM.
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  #30  
Old 10-26-2017, 07:45 AM
mistertomlinson mistertomlinson is offline
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Originally Posted by JonPR View Post
Sibelius Mine neither.
I have no tattoos either. Thats just a sign of my inability to commit to anything. Typical guy, right?

If I did have a musical tattoo, it would be this:



As it is, I can't even get round to putting it on a t-shirt...

(Of course I would put ©JonPR on it too.... As long as no one else has copyrighted silence, I should make a fortune.... John Cage only owns 4'33" of it.)
You have to tell me what that means.
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