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Old 09-19-2017, 10:51 AM
ii Cybershot ii ii Cybershot ii is offline
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Default Adjusting to an new/unfamiliar neck shape?

I have had my Martin OMC-18e for a little over a month now. Somehow I did not notice this in the store, but at home it has been causing me thumb pain. Both the first knuckle and base joint knuckle start hurting even within playing it for 5 minutes! This has never happened to me before with any guitar and I've played guitar for almost 20 years. I truly love the guitar in every way. The balance, tone, smell, playability... all incredible. But this darn hand pain! I even took a whole week off of playing any guitar at all while on vacation, didn't touch one. When I came back I picked up the Martin and low and behold within a short time the pain had returned.

My question is, has anyone else had trouble adjusting to a new neck shape? Did you ever experience hand pain from a neck that went away over time?
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Old 09-19-2017, 11:13 AM
vindibona1 vindibona1 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ii Cybershot ii View Post
I have had my Martin OMC-18e for a little over a month now. Somehow I did not notice this in the store, but at home it has been causing me thumb pain. Both the first knuckle and base joint knuckle start hurting even within playing it for 5 minutes! This has never happened to me before with any guitar and I've played guitar for almost 20 years. I truly love the guitar in every way. The balance, tone, smell, playability... all incredible. But this darn hand pain! I even took a whole week off of playing any guitar at all while on vacation, didn't touch one. When I came back I picked up the Martin and low and behold within a short time the pain had returned.

My question is, has anyone else had trouble adjusting to a new neck shape? Did you ever experience hand pain from a neck that went away over time?
I have not experienced the same level of discomfort that you have for an extended period of time, but I do have a parallel example: I've played a LOT of Strats. I currently own 4, 2 MIM's a Squier and a MIA Deluxe. No problems with any of them in spite of differing neck shapes. I was excited to try out the new Fender PROFESSIONAL Stratocasters that they recently came out with to replace the MIA Standards. Let me tell you, I was feeling discomfort and fatigue 30 seconds into playing. The way the neck shape was displacing my thumb just employed the wrong muscles in my hand. I knew immediately that the MIA Pro and I didn't get along. All it took as 30 seconds. I'm sure that in your case the mismatch was far more subtle that you played it long enough to want to bring it home.

I have a second anecdote more similar to what you're experiencing... Years ago I was a professional event photographer. I used Hasselblad cameras exclusively and I regularly used a bracket to mount the flash (Metz 60's at that time if you remember em). I went to a seminar (Denis Reggie, btw) and he was hawking his "professional" flash bracket for the Hasselblad. $150 (a lot of money back then). So I bought it and began using it. Gradually pain started happening in my left forearm near my elbow. As I continued to work it got worse and worse and worse. It became chronic. I ended up with at the doc's office, got a steriod shot, changed back to my old home-made, tried-and-true bracket. The pain went away and I learned how to carry the camera differently to avoid any future episodes. So what's this got to do with your guitar, you're wondering?...

It is my non-professional opinion that you are employing the wrong muscles or technique to compensate for a neck shape that isn't quite suited to you for long terms playing; at least in the manner that you are used to. So I have a few recommendations:

1) For the moment stop playing this guitar, and probably all guitars for a time to let the inflamation subside.

2) Ice. Your thumb area is inflamed. You need to cool it off while it (hopefully) recovers.

3) If you don't feel better in 2 weeks go see your ortho, preferably a hand specialist.

4) Once your hand is normal again revisit the neck and see if you can determine what isn't working. I'm guessing that you weren't meant to play on this neck. If that is the case then your options are then sell the guitar or visit a luthier to determine what works and let him reshape the neck. I'm sorry if that's the case. I know how much we want to fall in love and stay in love with our guitars.

So those are my thoughts concerning your condition. I feel your pain and know what you're going through. I hope your thumb heals quickly without further issues.
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Old 09-19-2017, 11:13 AM
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I had an HD-28 several years back that was unbelievable. One of those 1 in 1000 guitars you run into in your life that you have to buy on the spot. I did so, despite the 1 11/16 nut and 2 1/8 string spacing that I've never ever gotten along with. Sure enough, within 2 months, I started playing it poorly, then the hand cramping started. The Low Profile neck is simply too shallow top to bottom for my larger hands. Sold the guitar, had no choice.

Some people can adapt to various neck profiles, but I'm not one of them. I'm sorry to hear of your troubles, but given my past experience, I'm not going to lie and say everything will be alright with this guitar.

All the best to you.
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Old 09-19-2017, 11:23 AM
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I had the exact same experience with a Collings D2H that I truly loved. Everything about that guitar was spot on, except that I could not play it for more that 20 minutes without my fretting hand getting numb.

I had no problems what so ever with my Martin D-18 or any of my Taylors.

The thing is, it took me a couple of months before I realized that the Collings was the problem. Which implies that I could not adapt to the guitar. I do believe it was the modified V neck that was causing me the problem.


So, begrudgingly, I made the decision to get rid of it. But things do work out, and I now have this killer D-28 that I never would have looked at had I not experienced the problem with the Collings.

My take away is that if you cannot play the thing, what good for. There are always other guitars out there that will wow you. You just have to find them.

fwiw

D
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Old 09-19-2017, 11:29 AM
geoawelch geoawelch is offline
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I had a very similar experience with a 2010 Martin 00-18V, both thumb and middle finger pain. No issues with any of my other guitars.

It was too bad because, that aside, I loved everything else about that guitar.

Peace,

George
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Old 09-19-2017, 11:40 AM
roylor4 roylor4 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by brencat View Post
I had an HD-28 several years back that was unbelievable. One of those 1 in 1000 guitars you run into in your life that you have to buy on the spot. I did so, despite the 1 11/16 nut and 2 1/8 string spacing that I've never ever gotten along with. Sure enough, within 2 months, I started playing it poorly, then the hand cramping started. The Low Profile neck is simply too shallow top to bottom for my larger hands. Sold the guitar, had no choice.

Some people can adapt to various neck profiles, but I'm not one of them. I'm sorry to hear of your troubles, but given my past experience, I'm not going to lie and say everything will be alright with this guitar.

All the best to you.
I agree with this. I had a Larrivee L that caused severe hand cramps. Traded it and problem gone.

Not all neck profiles work for everybody IMHO.
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Old 09-19-2017, 12:06 PM
mr. beaumont mr. beaumont is offline
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Sadly, yes, I have owned a guitar like this...and it just didn't get better, so I sold it.

It's a bummer sometimes...it was a great guitar. Just not for me.
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Old 09-19-2017, 12:21 PM
s2y s2y is offline
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I play all sorts of guitars and basses from old school baseball bat neck to a flat, thin, and wide 7 string bass. A lot of this has to do with "proper" technique. I have to put this in quotes to avoid an angry PM. I have small hands, so I don't have a choice but to use ergonomic technique with my fretting hand or I suffer. That being said, I can handle anything but a V neck and that one will be hitting the classifieds soon.
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Old 09-19-2017, 01:53 PM
ii Cybershot ii ii Cybershot ii is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by vindibona1 View Post
I was excited to try out the new Fender PROFESSIONAL Stratocasters that they recently came out with to replace the MIA Standards. Let me tell you, I was feeling discomfort and fatigue 30 seconds into playing. The way the neck shape was displacing my thumb just employed the wrong muscles in my hand. I knew immediately that the MIA Pro and I didn't get along. All it took as 30 seconds. I'm sure that in your case the mismatch was far more subtle that you played it long enough to want to bring it home.

It is my non-professional opinion that you are employing the wrong muscles or technique to compensate for a neck shape that isn't quite suited to you for long terms playing; at least in the manner that you are used to. So I have a few recommendations:

1) For the moment stop playing this guitar, and probably all guitars for a time to let the inflamation subside.

2) Ice. Your thumb area is inflamed. You need to cool it off while it (hopefully) recovers.

3) If you don't feel better in 2 weeks go see your ortho, preferably a hand specialist.

4) Once your hand is normal again revisit the neck and see if you can determine what isn't working. I'm guessing that you weren't meant to play on this neck. If that is the case then your options are then sell the guitar or visit a luthier to determine what works and let him reshape the neck. I'm sorry if that's the case. I know how much we want to fall in love and stay in love with our guitars.

So those are my thoughts concerning your condition. I feel your pain and know what you're going through. I hope your thumb heals quickly without further issues.
Yea I agree with you. Something about the neck shape just doesn't jive right now, which is why I'm hoping it might go away over time. However the responses in this thread seem to imply that this probably won't happen. I think the pain is less muscular and more having to do with the joint or tendons of the thumb. I know what muscle fatigue feels like and this feels different.

Quote:
Originally Posted by brencat View Post
I had an HD-28 several years back that was unbelievable. One of those 1 in 1000 guitars you run into in your life that you have to buy on the spot. I did so, despite the 1 11/16 nut and 2 1/8 string spacing that I've never ever gotten along with. Sure enough, within 2 months, I started playing it poorly, then the hand cramping started. The Low Profile neck is simply too shallow top to bottom for my larger hands. Sold the guitar, had no choice.

Some people can adapt to various neck profiles, but I'm not one of them. I'm sorry to hear of your troubles, but given my past experience, I'm not going to lie and say everything will be alright with this guitar.

All the best to you.
Quote:
Originally Posted by geoawelch View Post
I had a very similar experience with a 2010 Martin 00-18V, both thumb and middle finger pain. No issues with any of my other guitars.

It was too bad because, that aside, I loved everything else about that guitar.

Peace,

George
Quote:
Originally Posted by dhodgeh View Post
I had the exact same experience with a Collings D2H that I truly loved. Everything about that guitar was spot on, except that I could not play it for more that 20 minutes without my fretting hand getting numb.

I had no problems what so ever with my Martin D-18 or any of my Taylors.

The thing is, it took me a couple of months before I realized that the Collings was the problem. Which implies that I could not adapt to the guitar. I do believe it was the modified V neck that was causing me the problem.


So, begrudgingly, I made the decision to get rid of it. But things do work out, and I now have this killer D-28 that I never would have looked at had I not experienced the problem with the Collings.

My take away is that if you cannot play the thing, what good for. There are always other guitars out there that will wow you. You just have to find them.

fwiw

D
Thanks for the replies! Sorry to hear you all had to part ways with your guitars.
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Old 09-19-2017, 02:00 PM
ii Cybershot ii ii Cybershot ii is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by geoawelch View Post
I had a very similar experience with a 2010 Martin 00-18V, both thumb and middle finger pain. No issues with any of my other guitars.

It was too bad because, that aside, I loved everything else about that guitar.

Peace,

George
Quote:
Originally Posted by roylor4 View Post
I agree with this. I had a Larrivee L that caused severe hand cramps. Traded it and problem gone.

Not all neck profiles work for everybody IMHO.
Quote:
Originally Posted by mr. beaumont View Post
Sadly, yes, I have owned a guitar like this...and it just didn't get better, so I sold it.

It's a bummer sometimes...it was a great guitar. Just not for me.
Tough luck, and yes a total bummer to lose a guitar!

Quote:
Originally Posted by s2y View Post
I play all sorts of guitars and basses from old school baseball bat neck to a flat, thin, and wide 7 string bass. A lot of this has to do with "proper" technique. I have to put this in quotes to avoid an angry PM. I have small hands, so I don't have a choice but to use ergonomic technique with my fretting hand or I suffer. That being said, I can handle anything but a V neck and that one will be hitting the classifieds soon.
You're right, I could try to change my technique, but that's a very long, slow process. Also that road is a dubious one. I think my technique is just fine as I've never had any hand pain or injury in 20 years of playing a lot of guitar. Changing that technique could cause more issues than it solves.
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Old 09-19-2017, 02:35 PM
lowrider lowrider is offline
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Could it possibly be the strings and not the neck shape? Maybe try different strings before you give up on the guitar.
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Old 09-19-2017, 03:36 PM
ii Cybershot ii ii Cybershot ii is offline
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Originally Posted by lowrider View Post
Could it possibly be the strings and not the neck shape? Maybe try different strings before you give up on the guitar.
I'd be surprised, they are John Pearse 600L which I've used for years on most of my guitars.
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Old 09-19-2017, 04:27 PM
The Bard Rocks The Bard Rocks is offline
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First, I'd stop playing for a bit to allow some healing. Then I'd play another guitar, one that you never had problems with in the past. If you don't, you will never know for sure that it is the neck that is the culprit.

If it is the neck as we all suspect, then find out what it will cost to get it reshaped. Changing that should not make discernible difference in how it sounds. Only then can you decide to reshape the neck or to sell the guitar.
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Old 09-19-2017, 04:57 PM
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I’ve been very fortunate in this regard. There are guitars that are more comfortable than other. However, I have yet to play a guitar that was uncomfortable to a point it impacted my playing. I have fairly big hand/long fingers and a thumb that is willing and able to adjust to different shapes.
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Old 09-19-2017, 05:05 PM
ii Cybershot ii ii Cybershot ii is offline
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Originally Posted by The Bard Rocks View Post
First, I'd stop playing for a bit to allow some healing. Then I'd play another guitar, one that you never had problems with in the past. If you don't, you will never know for sure that it is the neck that is the culprit.

If it is the neck as we all suspect, then find out what it will cost to get it reshaped. Changing that should not make discernible difference in how it sounds. Only then can you decide to reshape the neck or to sell the guitar.
Yea I've done exactly this, took a whole week off. Actually even if my hand hurts and I switch to another guitar right away it stops hurting. I'm hoping that my body naturally adjusts, based on the pain feedback it receives, and somehow I just adapt!

Quote:
Originally Posted by Haasome View Post
I’ve been very fortunate in this regard. There are guitars that are more comfortable than other. However, I have yet to play a guitar that was uncomfortable to a point it impacted my playing. I have fairly big hand/long fingers and a thumb that is willing and able to adjust to different shapes.
Yea I hadn't either until now!
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