Taylor ES2 - Clink/Squeak on D and G string

[mtm]

Hey everyone,

though overall I like the sound of the ES2, I can hear a very unpleasant "clink" or "squeak" like noise when playing the open d or g string. (I'm not sure about the right word to describe the noise; not an English native speaker).

I wanted to do a video but luckily just stumpled upon a video of someone else whose guitar to my ear has the exact same problem:



The guy demos the BodyRez pedal. You can ignore that. Starting at 1:00 he does a little strumming with an E chord, with hammer-ons. Each time he lifts the fingers and plays the open d string, I clearly notice this unpleasant high frequency noise/squeak/whatever. Am I the only one to hear this? Is this typical for the ES2?

As said before, I hear this noise on my guitar mostly on the open d and g string. I'm not completely sure if I can hear it when not amplified (I actually think it's not there unamplified, but the longer I look for it, the more my brain might want to think it is there when it is not ;-) ). However, it is clearly more pronounced through the ES. Acoustically, the guitar has a very pleasant tone. Amplified, I get this strange noise.

Any thoughts? Do some of you notice the same on their ES2-equipped guitars?

[SpruceTop]

I wasn't able to view the video but perhaps I know what you're referring to regarding the sound you're describing. I tend to get a twangy tone on the G- and D-strings of several guitar brands when I'm playing sitting down. The tone almost sounds like the string is loose and vibrating another tone on top of the usual tone of those strings. I think it has to do with the angle my flatpick hits the strings when I'm seated. Usually, regardless of the guitar brand and pickup/preamp system, you'll likely hear this extra twanginess when playing unamplified as well as amplified. Perhaps, changing your body position or the height or angle at which you hold your guitar will help?

[Nick84]

I've had similar problems with my ES-B pickup (same pickup just different preamp). Have you tried adjusting the 3 piezos with a .50 hex key? Try backing them off a little see if that helps.

I only have the noise when I tune down so I've not bothered adjusting mine.

[Vancebo]

For what it's worth. I tried many Guitars fitted with the ES2. I must have tried 40 or so guitars of the various models available. I found the ES2 to be very acoustic sounding but the downside was that it was very inconsistent. Now, specific to your question I remember noticing on a few guitars, maybe 3-4 in all had the problem you described. I can't say that it was specific to the 2 strings that you mentioned. I do remember first noticing the sound while plugged in. Then after unplugging it, I still heard the sound. The amplification made it more noticeable. Most guitars I tried did not have this problem.

[Petty1818]

Originally Posted by Vancebo

For what it's worth. I tried many Guitars fitted with the ES2. I must have tried 40 or so guitars of the various models available. I found the ES2 to be very acoustic sounding but the downside was that it was very inconsistent. Now, specific to your question I remember noticing on a few guitars, maybe 3-4 in all had the problem you described. I can't say that it was specific to the 2 strings that you mentioned. I do remember first noticing the sound while plugged in. Then after unplugging it, I still heard the sound. The amplification made it more noticeable. Most guitars I tried did not have this problem.

I too found the ES2 to be inconsistent. I think it's a clever design but it needs a bit of an update in order to sounds its best in all guitars. I almost feel as though they should get rid of the adjustment screws and try to attach the transducers the same way on all saddles. I know some will argue that the adjustment screws are necessary but I am sure they could find the perfect amount of pressure that would work.

[SpruceTop]

Has anyone been able to view the video the OP tried to embed in his OP? I haven't seen it yet and I've used two different browsers. I could write down the referenced YouTube address but c'est la vie ...

[martingitdave]

I listened to the video, but I don't hear an es2 squeak. I'm wondering if you only hear this plugged in, or acoustically too? Try adjusting the middle screw 1/4 turn.

Sent from my SM-G930V using Tapatalk

[SpruceTop]

Originally Posted by martingitdave

I listened to the video, but I don't hear an es2 squeak. I'm wondering if you only hear this plugged in, or acoustically too? Try adjusting the middle screw 1/4 turn.

Sent from my SM-G930V using Tapatalk

Dave, Can you supply me with the correct address fro the OP's video? The address I've gotten from any available information I've extracted from the embedded player is: 542vbMSslARY28yZ

I went directly to Youtube, entered the above code but it couldn't find the video. I may be able to help the OP if I knew what he is referring to with the noise he's hearing from his ES2. Thanks!

[martingitdave]

Hi Spruce,

Here is what showed up on Tapatalk. If you have an iPad, it's a great way to view this forum.

https://youtu.be/5o5JsOXzpbU


Sent from my SM-G930V using Tapatalk

[SpruceTop]

Without hearing the video, I'm speculating that what the OP is referring to is the tinny overtone I described in my post earlier in this thread. I hear this noise from the G and D strings of many guitars of different brands; most recently on my returned Gibson J-35 with LR Baggs Element VTC, and I have a slight tinniness on the G-string of my just-received Taylor 322ce ES2. There's a new Martin HD-28 (no pickup/preamp system) at my local dealer that has this sound, and it's very pronounced, on its G-string. This tinniness can be heard on all these guitars when they're played acoustically. Amplification of those so equipped just makes it easier to hear this tinniness coming from those strings.

My theory is: The usage of COMPENSATED SADDLES over the last several years is a cause of this tinniness, especially on the G and D strings, because of the fairly sharp saddle edge these strings ride on on top of the saddle. I don't recall this tinniness being as prevalent when saddles were the uncompensated, traditional style with a rounded top along the entire top of the saddle. Regardless of the brand of guitar and its pickup/preamp system, the tinniness is more noticeable when amplifying a guitar even though it's there all the time.

[SpruceTop]

Originally Posted by martingitdave

Hi Spruce,

Here is what showed up on Tapatalk. If you have an iPad, it's a great way to view this forum.

https://youtu.be/5o5JsOXzpbU


Sent from my SM-G930V using Tapatalk

Thanks Dave, it works and I'm watching the video right now!

[martingitdave]

Originally Posted by SpruceTop

Thanks Dave, it works and I'm watching the video right now!

Great. Let me know if you can hear what he is describing. I'm on my phone today and can't hear it.

Sent from my SM-G930V using Tapatalk

[SpruceTop]

I just watched the video and what I think I'm hearing is what I've been describing: a slight tinny overtone when the G and/or D strings are played open for a fraction of a second. The tinniness goes away after the strings are fretted. I find on the guitars that this occurs on, I only get this tinniness when these strings are played open. This can and does occur on all brands of guitars whether they're a Taylor with an ES2 or not and I feel it's related to the sharper edges of the top edge of the compensated bridge-saddles now being used on most acoustic guitars. On various guitars you'll hear only the G-string or the D-string or both and sometimes neither exhibiting these tinny overtones. So, why or why not are these two strings usually the culprits with the tinny overtones? I think it may have something to do with the size relationship of their core-wire and wrap-wire. What's the solution? Maybe rounding the top of the saddle these strings are riding on or trying a different string-gage set. Another consideration that can contribute to the tinny overtones is the guitar's nut, which needs to be well-cut and finished.

Please comment on whether you feel I've described the problem the OP is relating to us, and if my theory as to its cause has any merit. Are you hearing the same thing I am and do you get this tinny effect on any of your guitars, especially on the G and D strings?

[mtm]

Hey everyone,

thanks for your replies and sorry for me taking so long to get back to you!

Originally Posted by SpruceTop

a slight tinny overtone when the G and/or D strings are played open for a fraction of a second. The tinniness goes away after the strings are fretted.

Yes, I think this is the thing I'm hearing. I'll try to do a recording myself to compare the guitar through the pickup and via microphone.

The "tinny overtone" might be there acoustically (I'll check that again), but it is nowhere as pronounced as when played through the pickup. It never bothered me when playing unplugged or recording with a microphone, but it feels like the ES is super-sensitive to the overtone's frequency.

I do not have the same problem with any of my other guitars (mostly equipped with K&K mini and similar PUs). But of course that very well could be because of them not producing the tinny overtone in the first place.

What I tried so far:

• Adjusting the hex screws: Went all the way down to not hearing any picked up signal at all. The overtone was always there.
• Tuning down: I had the impression that tuning down improved the situation a bit. But could have been wishful thinking. I did not "measure" it. Anyhow, that overtone was still there.
• Using medium strings instead of HD lights: Same as with tuning down. Maybe a little improvement, but nowhere near "fixed".

I'm not really experienced in doing any adjustments on the saddle or nut myself.

I'm wondering why you, SpruceTop, are tending more towards a problem at the saddle. I think you could be right that the tone is always there (and just overly amplified when plugged in). Since the tone goes away when fretting, wouldn't be the nut the first thing to look at? Since fretting more or less removes the nut from the equation?

[Bear Davis]

Yes... and that is exactly why I ordered my latest Taylor with no electronics. The ES2 (played through 4 different amps) sounds like I am using a jagged rock as a pick.

I have a Bose L1 Compact and 9 out of 10 of my guitars with electronics of any kind, from any manufacture, sound amazing. My 1 guitar that sounds awful through it is my 614ce with ES2. Even playing finger style it sounds terrible.

Here is a video I did when I first got the guitar. Should be pretty obvious.

https://www.facebook.com/10001018855...type=2&theater

I have a 712ce-N and it sounds incredible, and I also have a DN7 with a Matrix Infinity that sounds 10 times better than my 614ce.