Guitar Decision: Quality vs Value

[phavriluk]

Dunno about 'tone'. Everybody hears different from everybody else, and has values unique to the individual.

But with all the chatter about 'neck resets', and their attendant costs in time and cash, that particular problem doesn't exist for a Taylor. Changing strings takes more time than resetting a Taylor NT neck (only slight exaggeration). And on a used guitar, that constructional feature makes a Taylor, in my opinion, a less risky purchase. Ain't nothing involving neck angle that's any kind of a problem.

[Brucebubs]

Originally Posted by phavriluk

Dunno about 'tone'. Everybody hears different from everybody else, and has values unique to the individual.

But with all the chatter about 'neck resets', and their attendant costs in time and cash, that particular problem doesn't exist for a Taylor. Changing strings takes more time than resetting a Taylor NT neck (only slight exaggeration). And on a used guitar, that constructional feature makes a Taylor, in my opinion, a less risky purchase. Ain't nothing involving neck angle that's any kind of a problem.

And yet I've read that some consider Taylor guitars from the mid 90's - pre NT neck - to be their best.
Go figure.

[RP]

Originally Posted by Brucebubs

And yet I've read that some consider Taylor guitars from the mid 90's - pre NT neck - to be their best.
Go figure.

But I believe that most tout the Andy Powers era guitars as Taylor's best. I can only dream about what my 714, 814 and 810 will sound like in 20 years and hope that my arthritic fingers and senile mind will still be able to make them sing...

[PhilNBend]

Congratulations on your recent DRS1 purchase. I will add the following considerations for other new players who trying to figure out what to buy.

1) Once you've made the decision that you like playing the guitar, get the best one you can reasonably afford. Relatively, the guitar is a difficult instrument to learn - it takes years. Don't let anyone tell you otherwise. So motivation is important. You want to get a guitar that you enjoy playing. I've played for over 50 years and can make a $200 Alvarez sound like a Taylor - but it is work. I do not practice on an Alvarez. I am more motivated to practice on a Breedlove parlor, which is much more fun play. So get any guitar that motivates you to play.

2) String scale length is important. Gibson and Epiphone generally use a shorter scale, resulting in slightly less finger stretch and more easy fingering. You can get shorter string scale on other brands, but they may be difficult to find. It may be a small difference, but it is a difference that can matter. Also, string spacing can matter. If you want to play finger style, you may want a slightly wider spacing. Bottom line is that there are subtle differences in each guitar that should be noted and considered.

3) Look for a great fretboard and first-rate fret wire material. And a fretboard that fits your hand. Now days, the fretboard and intonation should be close to perfect, even on lower priced guitars. You should also remember that guitar manufactures (even the expensive ones) will set the string action slightly high to avoid possible cut off notes resulting in product returns. On any quality guitar (regardless of price), the action can be set lower without significant fret filing or cost.

4) Take your time in buying unless it is a great bargain on a guitar that you already know you want. When you buy new, be sure to confirm the guitar is first quality and the seller is an authorized retailer for the brand. If you buy used, be sure to ask if the guitar was first quality when new. They don't have to be first quality to be a great sounding and playing guitar, but you want to know that information when you price your purchase.

5) Warranties. Warranty is a function of cost. The cost is added to a new guitar by the manufacturer to cover warranty returns. The warranty generally cannot be transferred to a used buyer. If you have warranty work that is covered, you usually have to pay for shipping, which can be more than the cost of the work needed to repair.

[Tico]

Value is quality vs. price.
Value is the goodness of what you get for a given price.

Since quality is already factored into the term value, 'Quality vs. value' makes no sense.

[SecondCity]

Originally Posted by PhilNBend

Congratulations on your recent DRS1 purchase. I will add the following considerations for other new players who trying to figure out what to buy.

1) Once you've made the decision that you like playing the guitar, get the best one you can reasonably afford. Relatively, the guitar is a difficult instrument to learn - it takes years. Don't let anyone tell you otherwise. So motivation is important. You want to get a guitar that you enjoy playing. I've played for over 50 years and can make a $200 Alvarez sound like a Taylor - but it is work. I do not practice on an Alvarez. I am more motivated to practice on a Breedlove parlor, which is much more fun play. So get any guitar that motivates you to play.

What does "best" mean in this context? I'm not trying to be snarky at all, just curious. What if you are a doctor or lawyer who starts playing at the prime of your career, or a retired venture capitalist or something, such that cost is simply not a real issue. Is it really worth spending $10,000 on a Santa Cruz when you've been playing 18 months, or should you get something like a Martin D-18 -- solid standby, generally accepted tone, nothing unusual -- until you've developed an ear to allow you to choose the special type of guitar you prefer?

I've not shopped in the deep end of the ocean, but I gather that at price point (well below $10,000) upgrades stop being about playability and start being about tone preferences. As in, if you buy a super high end guitar, you might prefer the guitar, but someone else might prefer a less expensive instrument.

[vindibona1]

You wanted opinions. Here's one more. Similar to the others, but different.

1) BUY USED. Think about this. Used guitars (often in near mint condition) go for approximately 60% of new. Think of it as the first owner giving you another 40% more money in your budget for the privilege of him owning it first.

2) Don't be in a hurry. Play a TON of acoustics and really take your time to do it. Play guitars of all price ranges, even those, especially those you know you'll never be able to afford. Especially play those expensive ones. That's the only way you'll learn to identify the true gems and guitars of real value in your price range. And they are out there. But if you're going to find your "keeper" in your budget.

If I may use my own situation to make a point... In the photo below. The guitar on the right is a 1972 Martin D-35. I won't tell you how much I paid for it, but new D-35's are going for $2800. Next to it is a guitar that looks very similar. It's a 1981 MIJ Epiphone. The MIJ model was built with solid spruce top and solid rosewood back and sides (the USA model was laminate). The quality of build is equal to the Martin, while it sounds like a Martin D-28. I found it "accidentally" on Craigs List. What do you think I paid for it? I paid all of $150 for it, INCLUDING a hardshell case AND a Shure SM58mic, all in excellent condition.

I was only looking for a "beater" and came across this and had the experience an good sense to know what I had when I held it in my hands. Go play a ton so you can find your own hundred dollar wonder.

[PhilNBend]

Originally Posted by SecondCity

What does "best" mean in this context? I'm not trying to be snarky at all, just curious. What if you are a doctor or lawyer who starts playing at the prime of your career, or a retired venture capitalist or something, such that cost is simply not a real issue. Is it really worth spending $10,000 on a Santa Cruz when you've been playing 18 months, or should you get something like a Martin D-18 -- solid standby, generally accepted tone, nothing unusual -- until you've developed an ear to allow you to choose the special type of guitar you prefer?

I've not shopped in the deep end of the ocean, but I gather that at price point (well below $10,000) upgrades stop being about playability and start being about tone preferences. As in, if you buy a super high end guitar, you might prefer the guitar, but someone else might prefer a less expensive instrument.

To clarify, the "best one you can reasonably afford" would mean something that you would look forward to spending the hours of practice time holding in your lap in order to become able to play in a proficient manner. Tying this in with your comment about playability, I do believe that $3000 new and used (some people may rationally disagree) is about the price point where a guitar stops being a functional instrument and it starts becoming about something else - like brand status or inlay or "this rare, illegal wood." Don't get me wrong, I do believe that a great guitar can be purchased for well under $2000, even under $1500, provided you buy used and know exactly what you are looking for, but I would not expect someone new to the instrument to be able to do this. There are people out there that will pay a lot for a guitar, but they probably pay a lot for their cars and houses as well. My comment was not directed at these folks.

Oh and that Epiphone above looks really great!

[Kitkatjoe]

Let your ears guide you. What sounds the best to you?

[Mr. Jelly]

Can you hear the difference between a refined guitar sound and one that isn't? If not then you have something about guitars you can learn about. But if you don't know the difference it doesn't mean it isn't there.