858 Grand Orchestra 12-string or Guild F512?

[bones4fido]

Taylor 858 Grand Orchestra 12-string or Guild F512? Any experience with either of these models? I got it narrowed down to these 2. I live a long ways from anywhere to try these out. Just gathering information

[mcduffnw]

Hi bones4fido...

I have owned two, and still own one Guild F-512. I have also owned 12 strings by Breedlove, Takamine, and luthier Robert Steinegger...and I have played many many more brands and models of 12 string...including Taylor...through my 47 years of playing guitar. I started playing 12 string in 1975, with a Takamine F-400.

The Guild jumbo 12 strings...The F-212XL, F-412, and F-512, are IMO, the absolute "Gold Standard" of 12 strings. Their looks, tone, volume, playability and response are the stuff of very deserved legend, and they have been very very consistent in their looks, tone, volume, playability, and response through the years, even as the company has changed ownership hands, and even as the location of manufacture has changed now 6 times, counting the brands newest owners Cordoba.

You would/could absolutely NOT go wrong with a Guild jumbo 12 string, whichever model you choose.

That said...the new 18 series jumbo 12 string guitars from Taylor are also truly fantastic guitars by all the same measurement criteria as Guilds...looks, tone, volume and playability. They have a different tone than the Guilds. The Guilds are, to me, more "clear bell like ringing" and the Taylors perhaps a bit more "complex/chiming". Both have equally good bass and power/volume.

It is a really tough choice there, pretty much 6/5 pick'em. The one thing I would note, is the Guilds might possibly have a better re-sale ability, being again, the iconic 12 string brand in the folk/rock/country world of music.

One other thing to note is that both the Guild and Taylor are very BIG guitars physically, and some folks find the body size tough to handle over a long period of time.

Because of this...I would also suggest you might take a look at the Taylor GS body style 12 strings. The GS body is a slightly smaller jumbo size, but they are my favorite Taylor body style by far. They look great, and feel great, a bit easier on some folks shoulders, elbows, and wrists...and they also sound fantastic, right in the with the jumbo Guilds, and full size jumbo Taylors.

If...as you mention...it is super difficult for you to have any access to try any guitars...then the ultimate safest route for you to go would be the Guilds...and particularly the Guild F-512. You just can not go wrong with the mighty Guild rosewood 12 string tone, and any of the versions made...Hoboken NJ, Westerly RI, Corona CA, Tacoma WA, Hartford CT, and now soon to be Oxnard CA, are just terrific instruments.

Good Luck in your search
duff

[Brucebubs]

Great post above.
Yes you should also know that there are no new Guild F-512's available at the moment.
The last F-512's were made in 2014 in New Hartford, Connecticut before Guild was sold to Cordoba and moved to California.
Production of F-512's is scheduled for the end of this year with deliveries expected early next year.
Elderly Instruments do list them; https://www.elderly.com/acoustics/ac...-with-case.htm

[bones4fido]

Thanks for the response and information. That helps a lot. I was kind of leaning towards the Guild. I wish they came with a pickup system in them though.

[rwmct]

I like to think that this clip of David Gilmour (who certainly has used Taylors on stage) says a lot. When asked "Why a 12 string" he reached for the Guild and said "listen to that":

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FQ0nPBRbXLM

of course, in classic 12 string fashion, he had to spend some time tuning it . . .

[JohnW63]

I wouldn't rule out an F-512 with a DTAR pickup being out there. If it's a "multi-source" version, that would be awesome.

I'll ask at LetsTalkGuild.com to see if they came that way.

[Athens]

If you're serious about it, it's gotta be the Guild. The standard by which all others are judged.

[Brucebubs]

Where are you?
I have a Martin Grand J12-40E Special with D-Tar dual source pick-up.
I'm the original owner but I'm in Australia.

[bones4fido]

I'm in Montana lol! Shipping would probably be an issue

[Brucebubs]

Originally Posted by bones4fido

I'm in Montana lol! Shipping would probably be an issue

Big Sky Country!
Yep, shipping would be big too.

Hey this rosewood jumbo Guild 12 string was just listed on ebay.
Nice older model.
Needs a bridge re-glue which isn't a huge job for a pro, you could have a pick-up of your choice installed at the same time?

http://www.ebay.com.au/itm/1997-Guil...sAAOSwrlRZyb-H

[AZLiberty]

I got a chance to play one of the Taylors last year.

It's a really big guitar. Really big. I'm assuming Andy Powers must be 7 ft tall or something.

A 17" Guild Jumbo is much more comfortable for me than the new Taylor body size.

[Brucebubs]

Originally Posted by AZLiberty

I got a chance to play one of the Taylors last year.

It's a really big guitar. Really big. I'm assuming Andy Powers must be 7 ft tall or something.

A 17" Guild Jumbo is much more comfortable for me than the new Taylor body size.

Strange that the Taylor should feel so big.

The newer Grand Orchestra size is 16 3/4" wide and 5" deep.
The old Taylor jumbo was 17" wide and 4 5/8" deep.

So the new shape is just 1/4" narrower and 3/8" deeper.

Specs for a Guild jumbo are 17 1/4" wide and 4 1/2" deep..... so 1/2" wider than the new Taylor and 1/2" shallower.

I'm guessing from that it's the new Taylor GO increased body depth you seem to have noticed most?

[AZLiberty]

Originally Posted by Brucebubs

Strange that the Taylor should feel so big.

The newer Grand Orchestra size is 16 3/4" wide and 5" deep.
The old Taylor jumbo was 17" wide and 4 5/8" deep.

So the new shape is just 1/4" narrower and 3/8" deeper.

Specs for a Guild jumbo are 17 1/4" wide and 4 1/2" deep..... so 1/2" wider than the new Taylor and 1/2" shallower.

I'm guessing from that it's the new Taylor GO increased body depth you seem to have noticed most?

Taylor is pretty notorious for their published specs being fairly far off. It's a really thick/deep guitar though.

[Ted @ LA Guitar Sales]

Originally Posted by bones4fido

Taylor 858 Grand Orchestra 12-string or Guild F512? Any experience with either of these models? I got it narrowed down to these 2. I live a long ways from anywhere to try these out. Just gathering information

Tough call, but that 858 is one awesome 12-string.

[00045]

Originally Posted by Ted @ LA Guitar Sales

Tough call, but that 858 is one awesome 12-string.

+1; love my GO 12 string and just ordered a 856 without ES system