Bone saddle in my Martin broke my Aura+?

martingitdave · #1 05-04-2016, 08:06 AM

Hello Sports Fans,

An interesting thing happened last night. I have been contemplating a bone saddle for my new Martin HD28E Retro. It comes with a factory Tusq saddle, and I already have 6 sizable indentations in the top of the from the strings resting on it. So, I ordered an unbleached compensated bone saddle and set about changing it.

After some alone time with my sandpaper and 90 degree sanding jig, I came away with what is probably the most perfectly fitted bone saddle I've had. Just enough room to slide in and not wiggle. Pretty much the same as the Tusq from the factory. The bottom of the factory and replacement saddle was perfectly flat. Very happy with myself, as you can probably tell. ;-)

However, much to my dismay, after fitting the new saddle, stringing it up and giving it a play, the tuner and electronics no longer worked. There was ZERO output from the system when amplified and the tuner displayed a single vertical line. My heart went straight to my stomach because I already has the system replaced once before for the same problem.

I was extremely careful with the UST and I knew for certain I had not damaged any of the electronics. And, 5 minutes before, everything worked. So, I started loosening the strings to remove the saddle and check the UST. But, something told me to try the tuner again with the strings slackened some. Bingo! The system worked again.

I removed the bone saddle, replaced the Tusq, strung it up, and sure enough it worked.

So, there is some issue with the bone saddle and/or the pressure associated with it causing the system to fail. This is very strange.

Fortunately, there is a happy ending. The Tusq actually sounds better. The bone did not produce as much low end.

I know that when a saddle was binding in the slot there could be weak signal, but ZERO signal makes no sense.

Any ideas?

Petty1818 · #2 05-04-2016, 08:09 AM

Interesting, I am wondering the same thing about the bone saddle I had installed with my Anthem (see my current thread on it). With the Anthem plugged in, I can't hear the bass of the UST or even a hint of that piezo tone. I am wondering if the bone is just not matching well with the UST. I don't have any suggestions but it's interesting to hear of a similar situation.

SpruceTop · #3 05-04-2016, 12:30 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by martingitdave

Hello Sports Fans,

An interesting thing happened last night. I have been contemplating a bone saddle for my new Martin HD28E Retro. It comes with a factory Tusq saddle, and I already have 6 sizable indentations in the top of the from the strings resting on it. So, I ordered an unbleached compensated bone saddle and set about changing it.

After some alone time with my sandpaper and 90 degree sanding jig, I came away with what is probably the most perfectly fitted bone saddle I've had. Just enough room to slide in and not wiggle. Pretty much the same as the Tusq from the factory. The bottom of the factory and replacement saddle was perfectly flat. Very happy with myself, as you can probably tell. ;-)

However, much to my dismay, after fitting the new saddle, stringing it up and giving it a play, the tuner and electronics no longer worked. There was ZERO output from the system when amplified and the tuner displayed a single vertical line. My heart went straight to my stomach because I already has the system replaced once before for the same problem.

I was extremely careful with the UST and I knew for certain I had not damaged any of the electronics. And, 5 minutes before, everything worked. So, I started loosening the strings to remove the saddle and check the UST. But, something told me to try the tuner again with the strings slackened some. Bingo! The system worked again.

I removed the bone saddle, replaced the Tusq, strung it up, and sure enough it worked.

So, there is some issue with the bone saddle and/or the pressure associated with it causing the system to fail. This is very strange.

Fortunately, there is a happy ending. The Tusq actually sounds better. The bone did not produce as much low end.

I know that when a saddle was binding in the slot there could be weak signal, but ZERO signal makes no sense.

Any ideas?

Are you absolutely sure the bone saddle was actually sitting on top of the Matrix UST? As a result of the sanding, there could be some increasing taper of the saddle's thickness from top to bottom or bottom to top. If you have some mics or digital calipers handy, take several measurements of the saddle's thickness from top to bottom, along the saddle's length, to see if there's any widening of the front-to-back saddle thickness.

Also, have you put both saddles on a flat surface and checked it to see if you can see light shining through along their bottoms? This can show you if there are any arcs along the bottom. I have a method for getting saddles flat and square along the bottom.

I like Tusq, especially when it comes to UST pickups!

simondylan · #4 05-04-2016, 01:00 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by martingitdave

Hello Sports Fans,

An interesting thing happened last night. I have been contemplating a bone saddle for my new Martin HD28E Retro. It comes with a factory Tusq saddle, and I already have 6 sizable indentations in the top of the from the strings resting on it. So, I ordered an unbleached compensated bone saddle and set about changing it.

After some alone time with my sandpaper and 90 degree sanding jig, I came away with what is probably the most perfectly fitted bone saddle I've had. Just enough room to slide in and not wiggle. Pretty much the same as the Tusq from the factory. The bottom of the factory and replacement saddle was perfectly flat. Very happy with myself, as you can probably tell. ;-)

However, much to my dismay, after fitting the new saddle, stringing it up and giving it a play, the tuner and electronics no longer worked. There was ZERO output from the system when amplified and the tuner displayed a single vertical line. My heart went straight to my stomach because I already has the system replaced once before for the same problem.

I was extremely careful with the UST and I knew for certain I had not damaged any of the electronics. And, 5 minutes before, everything worked. So, I started loosening the strings to remove the saddle and check the UST. But, something told me to try the tuner again with the strings slackened some. Bingo! The system worked again.

I removed the bone saddle, replaced the Tusq, strung it up, and sure enough it worked.

So, there is some issue with the bone saddle and/or the pressure associated with it causing the system to fail. This is very strange.

Fortunately, there is a happy ending. The Tusq actually sounds better. The bone did not produce as much low end.

I know that when a saddle was binding in the slot there could be weak signal, but ZERO signal makes no sense.

Any ideas?

I've worked on more guitars than I can remember and with just about every pickup available at one time or another. I promise you, this is not a bone saddle issue! It's a fluke of some sort. The different saddles will have different tone and string balance results, even output to some degree but that's the extent of it. You've got some sort of intermittent thing going on.

martingitdave · #5 05-04-2016, 01:14 PM

I agree with the above. It makes no sense, so the obvious answer is that the saddle didn't make a good connection. However, since the system and UST were completely replaced, I wonder the same thing happened before with the Tusq saddle. Is it possible that the Aura + system, since it is digital, will completely kill all output from the UST if the input is not spot on? If it were analog, I'd at least get something. But, if it is truly digital, then maybe not?

SpruceTop · #6 05-04-2016, 01:27 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by martingitdave

I agree with the above. It makes no sense, so the obvious answer is that the saddle didn't make a good connection. However, since the system and UST were completely replaced, I wonder the same thing happened before with the Tusq saddle. Is it possible that the Aura + system, since it is digital, will completely kill all output from the UST if the input is not spot on? If it were analog, I'd at least get something. But, if it is truly digital, then maybe not?

You should be getting something as long as some part of the bottom of the saddle is making contact but if it's hanging up on one end or the other, you may not get any signal. Try thinning the bone saddle's thickness (front-to-back) a bit more so it slides in and out of the saddle slot with a bit of wiggle. It's best to have some cheap digital calipers (Harbor Freight $10 - $15) handy when doing this as it's easy to take more stock off in some areas than others.

martingitdave · #7 05-04-2016, 02:00 PM

Good suggestion on the calipers.

Sent from my SM-G930V using Tapatalk

SpruceTop · #8 05-04-2016, 02:09 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by martingitdave

Good suggestion on the calipers.

Sent from my SM-G930V using Tapatalk

These are currently selling for $17.99 but if you have a coupon or if they're on an even better sale, you can get them for about $11.95.

http://www.harborfreight.com/6-inch-...per-47257.html

martingitdave · #9 05-04-2016, 03:30 PM

I spoke with tech support. You all are correct. He said the solder joint is likely getting pinched in the slot hole based on the way the wire comes through the hole. If that happens, the whole element shorts out and you get ZERO signal. So, the wire probably need to be moved a bit. Something in the way I shaped the saddle was causing the pinching. Loosening the strings, and it subsequently working, was the giveaway.