How much do you believe in guitar player "naturals"

[Mandobart]

Those that don't believe in natural ability are a mystery to me. Maybe its the hope that if we just put in more time, or get the right teacher, or buy the right books, video, pick, strings, guitar etc. then we too can reach our goal of being as "good" as xyz.

Anyone who has ever taught anything to a group recognizes there are quick studies, slow studies and no studies. It doesn't matter if the subject is athletics, mathematics, physics or music. Some of us are as good as we're ever going to get. Some of us have unlimited potential. There are 1000's of potentially amazing guitar players around the world who for a variety of circumstances will never pick up a guitar. There are many of us who are nowhere near as good as we think we are. But there are many more who undervalue our skill because we don't measure up to a personal yardstick.

[min7b5]

I don't believe in the idea of "naturals" at all. I know for myself I have worked very hard all my life at learning and practicing music. And every pro player I know went through a period of almost total immersion (most live there permanently) where they played six or more hours a day, which of course is not unlike any other serious pursuit in life.

I'm sorry, but I think the idea of "naturals" is often perpetuated by people that work on things less than an hour a day, or they're switching gears all the time, and after many years maybe they're not where they want to be. There is nothing wrong with that at all, everyone has different goals... But it doesn't mean that people that did take it to another level got there because it fell out of the sky.

If I wanted to drop everything and start cold and become, say, an ophthalmologist or practice corporate law, and I put an hour a day, how long before I can honestly expect to established in those fields? I would not assume the people that are successful in those fields were just "naturals." I would assume they worked at it very hard for a long and concentrated period of time.

Furthermore, as a guitar teacher for thirty two years, I have seen no evidence of people just being "naturals" that was easily explained. The young people I've had that have excelled were given tools by family to be hard working and less susceptible to distraction... Just my two cents.

[Texsunburst59]

Originally Posted by min7b5

I don't believe in the idea of "naturals" at all. I know for myself I have worked very hard all my life at learning and practicing music. And every pro player I know went through a period of almost total immersion (most live there permanently) where they played six or more hours a day, which of course is not unlike any other serious pursuit in life.

I'm sorry, but I think the idea of "naturals" is often perpetuated by people that work on things less than an hour a day, or they're switching gears all the time, and after many years maybe they're not where they want to be. There is nothing wrong with that at all, everyone has different goals... But it doesn't mean that people that did take it to another level got there because it fell out of the sky.

If I wanted to drop everything and start cold and become, say, an ophthalmologist or practice corporate law, and I put an hour a day, how long before I can honestly expect to established in those fields? I would not assume the people that are successful in those fields were just "naturals." I would assume they worked at it very hard for a long and concentrated period of time.

Furthermore, as a guitar teacher for thirty two years, I have seen no evidence of people just being "naturals" that was easily explained. The young people I've had that have excelled were given tools by family to be hard working and less susceptible to distraction... Just my two cents.

I guess in all those years you've never had a TRUE gifted student.

My son had only been taking guitar lessons for a year and a half.

The next year he went into the 6th grade and was part of their jazz band.

The band had NEVER had a guitarist because no one in the 6th grade had ever been able to play guitar well enough, and much less play a bunch of jazz chords.

My son was able to any jazz standard they threw at him.

GOD GIVEN TALENT. Enough said!!!

[bitraker]

Glenn Campbell
Stevie Ray Vaughan
Jimi Hendrix
Paul McCartney
John Lennon

all pure naturals - none could read music - they just played, and were blessed with the gift - yeah, I believe

[guitar george]

Originally Posted by bitraker

Glenn Campbell
Stevie Ray Vaughan
Jimi Hendrix
Paul McCartney
John Lennon

all pure naturals - none could read music - they just played, and were blessed with the gift - yeah, I believe

I believe too. Truly great and talented people show up in every activity you can think of. It's in their genes.

[Zissou Intern]

I have been a professional coach and educator for 33 years. I was a collegiate athlete before that. There are definitely naturals in all human endeavors, phenoms, who are predisposed for success, blessed with God given talent...call it what you will but they walk among us. This doesn't mean that they don't or didn't have to work hard and smart and dedicate themselves to reach their full level of potential, but they are better than the average Joe out of the gate.

Some of us, with an equal or higher level of dedication, can also rise to a certain level of mastery, but people like Tony Rice, Norman Blake, Stevie Ray Vaughn, Wayne Gretzky, Emily Dickenson, Michael Jordan, Thelonious Monk, Ingemar Stenmark, Fausto Coppi, Eddy Merckx, Fabiana Luperini, Jeannie Longo, Jackie, Joyner Kersee, Usain Bolt, Pablo Casals, W. Eugene Smith, etc., etc., etc are THE greats for a reason. And it wasn't just hard work that got them there, though doubtless, there were countless hours poured into their passions.

[Al Acuff]

It seems some folks here are saying, "I'm not a natural on guitar and I've never met one personally so there is no such thing."

I have met and worked with musicians who are naturals. They are real!

Well, I'm not a natural and I'm proud of it. There's no shame in the fact that I've had to practice and study a lot to get where I am. I wish my fingers learned faster without the endless mindless repetition but the guitar has taught me the value of perseverance and made me a better person.

I'm inspired by the guitar greats like Merle Travis, Chet Atkins, and Doc Watson. Players like that are a gift from God to the rest of us.

I'm also inspired by Hank Williams, Johnny Cash, Maybelle Carter, Pete Seeger and Woody Guthrie. They successfully used their limited guitar abilities and became great entertainers. Most of us here can already play guitar at least as well as Woody Guthrie and Pete Seeger and look at what they accomplished! Their music changed the world!

[Rmz76]

Originally Posted by Al Acuff

It seems some folks here are saying, "I'm not a natural on guitar and I've never met one personally so there is no such thing."

Well, I'm not a natural and I'm proud of it. I've had to practice and study a lot to get where I am. It's taught me the value of perseverance and made me a better person. AND I have met and worked with musicians who are naturals. They are real!

I'm inspired by the guitar greats like Merle Travis, Chet Atkins, and Doc Watson. Players like that are a gift from God to the rest of us.

I'm also inspired by Hank Williams, Johnny Cash, and Woody Guthrie. They successfully used very limited guitar chops and were great entertainers. Most of us here can already play guitar at least as well as Woody Guthrie and Pete Seeger and look at what they accomplished! Their music changed the world!

True!

But those guys did a lot more than just play the guitar!

To his credit, Woody Guthrie's playing for his time was actually quite good but their playing wasn't the focus. it was the remarkable songwriting. Although Pete Seeger and Dylan are not great vocalist by classical standards, they both had/have very unique voices... Their talent was not just in their playing but in their ability to use their songwriting skills, vocals and playing to deliver something remarkable. Their composite talent just as rare as the exceptional player who's primary sell as an entertainer is exclusively in their playing.

[Al Acuff]

Originally Posted by Rmz76

True!

But those guys did a lot more than just play the guitar!

To his credit, Woody Guthrie's playing for his time was actually quite good but their playing wasn't the focus. it was the remarkable songwriting. Although Pete Seeger and Dylan are not great vocalist by classical standards, they both had/have very unique voices... Their talent was not just in their playing but in their ability to use their songwriting skills, vocals and playing to deliver something remarkable. Their composite talent just as rare as the exceptional player who's primary sell as an entertainer is exclusively in their playing.

Amen!

In an interview Brian Wilson once said that you don't need to be a great singer or have a wonderful voice. He said that what counts the most is having a unique, recognizable voice. I'll go out on a limb and say that the same is true for playing guitar. Look at Willie Nelson for example. You hear three notes played on Trigger and you know it's Willie. Same for Wes Montgomery. Link Wray too.

[rick-slo]

Of course natural (genetic) talent varies, for music and everything else.
If at all interested in classical music read the link about Felix Mendelssohn - amazing.
http://www.classicfm.com/composers/m...ssohn-prodigy/

[TBman]

As I said earlier, physical attributes can really make the difference and pave the way for a "natural."

But that said, I know that if I were to alter my practice routine to include scale drills that emphasize correct right hand work and speed burst routines, both in arpeggios and chord changes, (full barres, other chords, triads and intervals) I'm sure my musical journey would benefit greatly.

Probably some analysis of our practice routines and non-avoidance of what we really should be working on would benefit us all. Easy to say though. I know I can bang out repeat measures a 100 or more times when a section of a song needs it at one seating, but after a while, even though there is great progress, its boring and not very entertaining. It also risks over use injuries in players my age.

Further to this, most of us are naturals in some respect, otherwise we would have given up after the first month due to lack of progress. I think many of the members who are taking lessons and complain about their lack of progress aren't short on ability, they just aren't being taught how to practice. If they were their natural abilities would be given a chance to take hold and expand.

Guitar playing and music is one of those things where youthful speed, agility and flexibility are always entertaining, but there are plenty of beautiful melodies that can be played at 100 beats a minute and less. We don't all have to be track stars or "naturals" to enjoy this.

[Jeff Scott]

I'm a natural.

[flaggerphil]

I personally know two people who are naturals. One is related to me and we both play in a trio (I am NOT a natural at guitar by any means), and the other currently tours with two '60s bands (and has his own local group), and has been a sessions musician and toured with other rock bands in the past. He has played professionally since before he graduated high school in '67.

[Lauren710]

I haven't posted yet but I keep coming back to this thread?

How does one KNOW they are a natural? How do we define "natural"?

I'm asking purely for selfish reasons, lol. I'm certainly not a top 1% kind of prodigy, but I have a good ear. I can hear when things sound wrong and I can figure out how to make them sound "right". I have the dexterity and long slender fingers. I'm no stranger to work and I've been putting it in, but maybe I lean a little bit more toward natural than not.

Where I always stumble is making mistakes and moving past that to get to the good stuff, which is where I always stumbled playing saxophone too - some interesting thoughts on why this mindset is so prevalent in women in jazz in particular, as a "traditionally masculine" type of music here (blog post) and here (article). I played alto sax in marching, concert, and jazz band in high school, but I could never solo in jazz band because I was too afraid of sounding bad and screwing up in front of people - even in practice with the band, and even just with my family around at home. I didn't play much in college because I lived in a dorm and couldn't deal with the thought of people hearing me play badly while learning. Makes me wonder if I could have been more of a natural if I'd just gotten over that fear of embarrassment earlier in life.

[LarryVe]

I am firm believer that the greats in any entity practice a ton to achieve their level of skill. Michael Jordan practiced relentlessly more than anyone. Kobe Bryant shot thousands of free throws to improve his shot.

It's like Michelangelo once said, "If people knew how hard I worked to get my mastery, it wouldn't seem so wonderful at all.

Tommy Emmanuel seems to practice a ton.