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  #46  
Old 01-04-2017, 08:36 AM
JGinNJ JGinNJ is offline
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When I learned the basics of jazz guitar years ago, the Mickey Baker book others have mentioned was a starting point- along with having a good teacher.
Essentially you have to learn chords and scales up and down the neck, and apply them to playing jazz tunes & standards such as in the "Real Book". To put all this in context, listen to the whole range of jazz even if you emphasize gypsy jazz and guitarists.
If you can find another guitar player on the same path, it will help tremendously to play together.
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  #47  
Old 01-05-2017, 07:31 PM
Davis Webb Davis Webb is online now
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Originally Posted by Mandobart View Post
Long time musician (43 years). Long time guitar player (40 years). I mostly play bluegrass, folk, Americana and blues. I've recently got hit by the gypsy jazz (and jazz in general) bug. I feel totally lost with the jazz chords - its like learning to play guitar all over from scratch.

I listen to a lot of GJ to develop an ear and feel for the genre. I have downloaded the Django Fakebook which has over 200 GJ/swing tunes. I still feel lost and confused on jazz - it seems like learning the basic cowboy chords for bluegrass, folk, Americana etc. was so much easier all those years ago.

Does anyone have speific suggestions for books, web sites, tools etc. to help someone trying to pick up jazz chords and progressions? Thanks.
The problem with Jazz is that you need to be able to read music to make any progress in it in a reasonable amount of time.

Can you site read?
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  #48  
Old 01-05-2017, 08:04 PM
Mandobart Mandobart is offline
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Originally Posted by Davis Webb View Post
The problem with Jazz is that you need to be able to read music to make any progress in it in a reasonable amount of time.

Can you site read?
I can read site maps and site plans. And yes I can sight read sheet music.
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  #49  
Old 01-05-2017, 09:31 PM
funkymonk#9 funkymonk#9 is offline
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I learned the same way Wes Montgomery did....i take the guitar out of the case and throw a slab of meat in the case, that's what it likes and the guitar plays heartlily.
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  #50  
Old 01-06-2017, 07:49 AM
MC5C MC5C is offline
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I'm going to say that being able to read music, and sight read charts, is almost irrelevant to playing jazz except in a few situations. For every icon who was highly educated musically (say Miles Davis) there is another guy who couldn't read music at all (Wes Montgomery, Django Reinhardt). But understanding harmony, by ear or by rote, is almost the root of jazz. That, and time sense - swing. On guitar, sight reading is complicated by the extreme variation of how to place notes on the fretboard to best effect - many notes have three or four places they can be played on the fretboard. Piano - one place per note. A friend of mine was completing a Masters degree in Guitar Performance - so a highly skilled and trained classical guitarist. In one blog post she complained about how guitarists always let the side down when asked to sight-read charts in a band setting. Later in the same post she commented on how she had transcribed a classical piece three months earlier and was now starting to get to grips with how to actually play it on the instrument. The dichotomy struck me - complaining about lack of sight reading expertise (in some of the most highly trained guitarists you will ever find) and needing three months to figure out how to play a piece that she transcribed.
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Last edited by MC5C; 01-07-2017 at 06:25 AM.
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  #51  
Old 01-06-2017, 05:03 PM
Davis Webb Davis Webb is online now
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mandobart View Post
I can read site maps and site plans. And yes I can sight read sheet music.
If you can read sheet music then you are golden. Just download a few Jazz standards. They are free on the internet.
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  #52  
Old 01-06-2017, 08:28 PM
Mandobart Mandobart is offline
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Originally Posted by Davis Webb View Post
If you can read sheet music then you are golden. Just download a few Jazz standards. They are free on the internet.
Yes, that's what the Django Fakebook is. Melodies are the easy part. As I stated in my original post "I feel totally lost with the jazz chords - its like learning to play guitar all over from scratch." The chord melody type of accompaniment is the tough part that I'm slowly learning.
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  #53  
Old 01-07-2017, 06:28 AM
MC5C MC5C is offline
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I found this article interesting when thinking about chord-melody playing: http://www.guitarplayer.com/artists/...joe-pass/13697

In particular the analysis of the chord structure used. At the beginning of each paragraph is a little clickable box with the notation of the section being discussed. Thus; http://www.guitarplayer.com/Portals/...11Pass.Ex2.jpg
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Brian Evans
1935 Dobro model 25 resonator
1943 Paramount (made by Kay) mandolin
1946 Epiphone Zephyr electric archtop
1957 Hofner Senator archtop
1962 Gibson Melody Maker electric
1963 National Dynamic lap steel
1996 Landola jumbo
1998 Godin Artisan TC electric
2003 Epiphone SG electric
2010 GoldTone PBR-CA resonator
2015 Evans electric archtop
2016 Evans archtop

Last edited by MC5C; 01-07-2017 at 06:38 AM.
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  #54  
Old 01-07-2017, 12:58 PM
Davis Webb Davis Webb is online now
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mandobart View Post
Yes, that's what the Django Fakebook is. Melodies are the easy part. As I stated in my original post "I feel totally lost with the jazz chords - its like learning to play guitar all over from scratch." The chord melody type of accompaniment is the tough part that I'm slowly learning.
I hear ya. I spent years listening to Montreal and Toronto jazz legends, Herbie Spanier and I were friends, he was my older mentor. Although a trumpet player, he jazz comped with chords on the piano in a way that made it hurt.

The basis of it is still melody, its having a melody in your head which you express with chords instead of notes, so leading notes and changes do the work. The only way I have seen anyone learn that is learning all inversions of chords up the neck then, instead of using a note (think about the opening phrase of "somewhere over the rainbow"), use the chord pattern to state the melody. There are a couple notes in every chord that will propel the melody forward, its simplifying the chords to their basic triads then adding tonal color with 9ths, 11ths, 13ths.

I wish you luck on this journey. I use chordal melody combined with lead work solo, one-man band stuff and I can only work well in certain keys. Mastering that fretboard is something that takes, I would say, personal instruction. I do not think it can be learned on your own. You need to copy experts. Copy....copy...copy..

Good luck! I only entered this discussion because I spent a lot of money on jazz classes over the years and without putting even MORE time into it, I had to stop. Country seems to work me well. I admire your drive. Yer gonna make it.
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  #55  
Old 01-08-2017, 05:18 AM
MC5C MC5C is offline
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A friend of mine is starting to publish some of her PhD work on learning jazz guitar on a new web page, released today. I thought some of you might like to follow it, although it's early days yet. https://thescientificguitarist.wordpress.com/

You can sign up to be part of her research on-line in the "current studies" tab.
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Brian Evans
1935 Dobro model 25 resonator
1943 Paramount (made by Kay) mandolin
1946 Epiphone Zephyr electric archtop
1957 Hofner Senator archtop
1962 Gibson Melody Maker electric
1963 National Dynamic lap steel
1996 Landola jumbo
1998 Godin Artisan TC electric
2003 Epiphone SG electric
2010 GoldTone PBR-CA resonator
2015 Evans electric archtop
2016 Evans archtop
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  #56  
Old 01-08-2017, 07:37 PM
Davis Webb Davis Webb is online now
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MC5C View Post
A friend of mine is starting to publish some of her PhD work on learning jazz guitar on a new web page, released today. I thought some of you might like to follow it, although it's early days yet. https://thescientificguitarist.wordpress.com/

You can sign up to be part of her research on-line in the "current studies" tab.
Wow, that is a great link! Thanks so much.
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