Why are so many bluegrass songs in G

[TomcatToo]

I have a bluegrass fake book (The Real Bluegrass Book) and I would say around 70 to 80% of the songs are in the key of G, so I looked in some other blluegrass books and they also have a lot of the songs in G and then there are all the "G" runs in books; why? I find it easier to play in either A or E but there has to be some reason for using G.

Thanks,
Tom

[JonPR]

Originally Posted by TomcatToo

I have a bluegrass fake book (The Real Bluegrass Book) and I would say around 70 to 80% of the songs are in the key of G, so I looked in some other blluegrass books and they also have a lot of the songs in G and then there are all the "G" runs in books; why? I find it easier to play in either A or E but there has to be some reason for using G.

Thanks,
Tom

IMO most guitar players would say G is easier.
Bluegrass-type licks in particular make lot of use of the open strings,
and a lot of classic ones are played around an open G shape. They just sit under the fingers naturally.
Also, in G all the open strings are in key. In key of A, the open 3rd string is out of key, and in E, both 3rd and 4th are.
Key of G also has no barre shapes among the common chords: I, IV, V, vi and ii are all open shapes. In keys of C and D (where all the open strings are also in key), two common chords are barres: F (IV in C) and Bm (vi in D).
G is also a much easier key for mandolin than either A or E.

[tomj]

I always assumed it's because G's a friendly key for banjos.

[posternutbag]

You learn songs in G and C and then use a capo to transpose into a key that is friendly for the vocalist. Notice that it is mostly vocal songs that are in G. Fiddle tunes are often in D or A.

But it is an old bluegrass joke:
Someone asks a bluegrass guitarist, "What is the subdominant chord in C?"
The guitarist replies, "I thought C was subdominant!"

[jcmccorm]

I think the ol G C D is easier. Like someone said, lots of open strings in G (and it is indeed easier for the banjo).

If it's a fiddle tune, and a lot of those are in A, then the guitar player capos up to the 2nd fret and plays the whole thing with the G C D shapes

Cary

[TomcatToo]

LOL, looks like I need to just concentrate on getting really comfortable with G & C and quickly moving my capo!

Thanks for the replys,
Tom

[wcap]

Originally Posted by tomj

I always assumed it's because G's a friendly key for banjos.

Yes.

I'm not a bluegrass guy really (so I don't know the answer for certain), but I am a long-term 5-string banjo player. The most common standard tuning on 5-string banjo is an open G tuning, and given the unique nature of the 5-string banjo with its short 5th string tuned to a G (and often used sort of as a drone string), the key of G is a pretty special key for banjo. Really good banjo players (e.g. Bela Fleck) play in most any key of course, and even mediocre banjo players probably play some things in C or D, but a LOT of stuff tends to get played in G on 5-string banjos. Or in A with a capo.

I suspect this is a good part of the answer to your question.

[HHP]

Because when you pay for six strings, you want to use all six strings to get your money's worth.

[TomcatToo]

I think WCAP got it right, at least that idea makes a lot of sense to me.

Thank You,
Tom

[waveform]

Not sure about the rest of you but I like the acoustic guitar for its open chords.
Finger picking is really fun on open notes, flat picking for that matter. Arnt there more scales available that are played with a lot of open notes? So if you take something like a Em scale it works well with G, like that can be the tonic? I really don't know what I am talking about. It just seems when you play in the key of G there are a lot of open notes at your disposal, giving you that blue brass sound.

[Mtn Man]

A capo is a tool, just like a pick or a guitar strap. It’s required in flatpicking more than any other style, so get used to using one. Banjos use a capo just as much as the guitars do, by the way. Maybe even more.

A lot of flatpickers also like to play out of D, which allows them to use drop D tuning for a really cool sound. Go on YT and find Dan Tyminski playing Man of Constant Sorrow, or any flatpicked version of Reuben’s Train, for a good idea of what drop D sounds like in a flatpicking context. Dan Crary loved drop D and used it all the time.

Playing out of these positions also gives you a certain sound that is recognizable, in other words “traditional,” which is important if you’re looking to capture a traditional sound. My son can usually listen to a guitar player and figure out what position he’s playing out of, even if he’s capo’d up to an odd key. There are G runs, C runs, and D runs that are commonly used in these positions that are very recognizable.

Using a capo also makes the frets a little closer together. You might say, that’s cheating, but look at the instruments the average flatpicker is competing with. The mandolin and fiddle both have much shorter scale lengths, and the banjo relies mostly on rolling through chord shapes, so there’s not as much stretching involved. Flatpicking an acoustic guitar requires a tremendous amount of strength, speed, and dexterity just to keep up with an appropriate amount of volume. Most flatpickers will tell you that it’s much easier to play lead on a mandolin, due to the tuning (fifths instead of fourths) and the smaller scale length. The mandolin also cuts through much better than the guitar due to its inherently greater volume and the fact that it’s tuned to a higher register. Making the guitar fretboard just a little smaller helps equalize these differences somewhat and gives the flatpicker a “fighting chance” to keep up.

Here’s a video of Nick playing “Salt Creek” with the capo on 2 for precisely this reason. He chose to capo to the 2nd fret and play it in A because there’s one section in the B part that’s a bit of a stretch for him, and he has a hard time playing it clean at the speed he wanted to play it. Removing the two biggest frets from the fretboard was just enough to where he could make that stretch. Luckily, this tune is almost always played in A, so no one questions why he’s capo’d for a contest.

Salt Creek

The other thing a capo does is it raises the pitch of the instrument, which can help you cut through in a noisy environment or provide contrast with other guitars. Norman Blake is famous for playing instrumentals in odd keys like Eb, “Because I like the way it sounds up there.” It essentially makes the guitar more mandolin-like. David Rawlings is also famous for capo’ing way up the neck. I think he does this to provide a better counterpoint to Gillian Welch, since they both play guitar the majority of the time, and things can get muddy (or boring) when you have two guitars playing in the same register all night.

[waveform]

Thats great little dude with big guitar, big dude with little guitar. Sound great together. My dad said my relatives played a lot so important to family. Man I wish I could play with my dad like you do your son.

[Mtn Man]

Originally Posted by waveform

Thats great little dude with big guitar, big dude with little guitar. Sound great together. My dad said my relatives played a lot so important to family. Man I wish I could play with my dad like you do your son.

Thanks! I actually don't play with him much anymore, I just can't keep up with him. He pulled me out of retirement for this one. He said, "I need a mandolin player to back me up, but since I don't have one you'll have to do."

[Davis Webb]

Originally Posted by Mtn Man

A capo is a tool, just like a pick or a guitar strap. It’s required in flatpicking more than any other style, so get used to using one. Banjos use a capo just as much as the guitars do, by the way. Maybe even more.

A lot of flatpickers also like to play out of D, which allows them to use drop D tuning for a really cool sound. Go on YT and find Dan Tyminski playing Man of Constant Sorrow, or any flatpicked version of Reuben’s Train, for a good idea of what drop D sounds like in a flatpicking context. Dan Crary loved drop D and used it all the time.

Playing out of these positions also gives you a certain sound that is recognizable, in other words “traditional,” which is important if you’re looking to capture a traditional sound. My son can usually listen to a guitar player and figure out what position he’s playing out of, even if he’s capo’d up to an odd key. There are G runs, C runs, and D runs that are commonly used in these positions that are very recognizable.

Using a capo also makes the frets a little closer together. You might say, that’s cheating, but look at the instruments the average flatpicker is competing with. The mandolin and fiddle both have much shorter scale lengths, and the banjo relies mostly on rolling through chord shapes, so there’s not as much stretching involved. Flatpicking an acoustic guitar requires a tremendous amount of strength, speed, and dexterity just to keep up with an appropriate amount of volume. Most flatpickers will tell you that it’s much easier to play lead on a mandolin, due to the tuning (fifths instead of fourths) and the smaller scale length. The mandolin also cuts through much better than the guitar due to its inherently greater volume and the fact that it’s tuned to a higher register. Making the guitar fretboard just a little smaller helps equalize these differences somewhat and gives the flatpicker a “fighting chance” to keep up.

Here’s a video of Nick playing “Salt Creek” with the capo on 2 for precisely this reason. He chose to capo to the 2nd fret and play it in A because there’s one section in the B part that’s a bit of a stretch for him, and he has a hard time playing it clean at the speed he wanted to play it. Removing the two biggest frets from the fretboard was just enough to where he could make that stretch. Luckily, this tune is almost always played in A, so no one questions why he’s capo’d for a contest.

Salt Creek

The other thing a capo does is it raises the pitch of the instrument, which can help you cut through in a noisy environment or provide contrast with other guitars. Norman Blake is famous for playing instrumentals in odd keys like Eb, “Because I like the way it sounds up there.” It essentially makes the guitar more mandolin-like. David Rawlings is also famous for capo’ing way up the neck. I think he does this to provide a better counterpoint to Gillian Welch, since they both play guitar the majority of the time, and things can get muddy (or boring) when you have two guitars playing in the same register all night.

Best summary of bluegrass guitar yet. Thanks for the info. Now you got me inspired to work on some.

[waveform]

So is that it?, mandolin is tuned to GDAE, banjo in open g G-D-G-B-D, then guitar would sound good in key of G.