Slide resonator questions-HELP!!

darylcrisp · #1 01-19-2011, 05:18 PM

Recently i've become very interested in acquiring a resonator and learning some bluesy songs using fingers and a slide. My problems are these:

1)no local(within 2 hours)store stocks resonators
2)i know 0 about all this
3)i need guidance to research-need help to start

The types of music i'm interested in are not bluegrass type or swing, more blues type and i'm not gigging or playing in a group so loud or projection is not of utmost importance. I just recently acquired the Mike Dowling DVD set and i like some of those type songs. I also think i would like a wood body versus a metal body(just for a woody sweeter type sound and less weight)-but i'm not sure. I play a little weissenborn, its all mahogany and i keep it dropped into C pretty much. So this resonator will be played like a guitar-not lap style and i want a nice comfortable round neck.
$ limits would be around $1500-i can go up a little but not a whole lot. Definitely prefer used over new. If you know of a shop that has a good selection of used please pass that on to me.

The two i've researched and saw video are:
http://acousticguitarmagazine.com/ar...rticleid=25634
and
http://acousticguitarmagazine.com/ar...rticleid=24096

I like both of these, and the Triolian has grabbed my attention on looks for sure-and cost.

I know nothing about the difference between a single cone or tri-cone. So any education is highly appreciated-and or guidance to website with info.

Lastly, exactly what is the big difference between a Dobro and a resonator-sound? build/construction?

thanks
daryl

blue · #2 01-19-2011, 05:59 PM

Go to the national site and see the demos. Steel is what it is. very brash and in your face. You've selected night and day tone wise for the two you're looking at. There is lots of middle ground between the two of them.

Rather than repeat myself more see here http://www.acousticguitarforum.com/f...d.php?t=205200 for info from a few national players. Oh, and volume comes with the territory. Its pretty much why they were invented.

darylcrisp · #3 01-19-2011, 08:16 PM

blue

thanks for the link and all the info contained.

daryl

azimmer1 · #4 01-19-2011, 08:20 PM

I make my own, but they are inspired by the old wooden bodied Nationals. If you are looking for a Delta blues roundneck resonator, (played like a regular guitar) you can't go wrong with the Nationals. I would lean toward the single cone biscuit bridge type. They were built for that blues style. The M1 M2 and El Trovadors are excellent choices. It is certainly a matter of preference. As recommended check out their site and listen to the clips

BTW Dobro is a brand. It is short for the Dopyera Brothers. They invented the resonator and started National Guitars. In todays world most think of Dobro with bluegrass style.(Jerry Douglas) It is long story, but most Dobros are actually spider cones. There are 3 common types of resonator cones used today.
1. Single inverted cone spider bridge 2. Single cone biscuit bridge 3. Tricones. All are resonators. Some are played lap style (square neck) and some are played like a regular guitar (roundneck) If you are interested there is a nice book on the history of National Guitars.

Mycroft · #5 01-19-2011, 08:57 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by darylcrisp

Recently i've become very interested in acquiring a resonator and learning some bluesy songs using fingers and a slide. My problems are these:

1)no local(within 2 hours)store stocks resonators
2)i know 0 about all this
3)i need guidance to research-need help to start

The types of music i'm interested in are not bluegrass type or swing, more blues type and i'm not gigging or playing in a group so loud or projection is not of utmost importance. I just recently acquired the Mike Dowling DVD set and i like some of those type songs. I also think i would like a wood body versus a metal body(just for a woody sweeter type sound and less weight)-but i'm not sure. I play a little weissenborn, its all mahogany and i keep it dropped into C pretty much. So this resonator will be played like a guitar-not lap style and i want a nice comfortable round neck.
$ limits would be around $1500-i can go up a little but not a whole lot. Definitely prefer used over new. If you know of a shop that has a good selection of used please pass that on to me.

The two i've researched and saw video are:
http://acousticguitarmagazine.com/ar...rticleid=25634
and
http://acousticguitarmagazine.com/ar...rticleid=24096

I like both of these, and the Triolian has grabbed my attention on looks for sure-and cost.

I know nothing about the difference between a single cone or tri-cone. So any education is highly appreciated-and or guidance to website with info.

Lastly, exactly what is the big difference between a Dobro and a resonator-sound? build/construction?

thanks
daryl

A Dobro is basically a type of resonator, while as a trademark it only idetifies Dobro brand instruments, it is semi-generic as it also identifies a type of construction.. All resonators use a vibrating metal cone as a part of their amplification system, giving them a characteristic tone. A Triolian is a single cone, that is, it uses a single cone, while the Resophonic is a tri-cone: 3 cones. Dobros are typically wood construction, having a sweeter tone, while the National-style are primarily metal bodied, ranging from steel to brass to german silver. They are brasher, sometimes harsher.

Neither is better; both are great. Both can be used for blues. Depends on what you are looking for

Try:

http://www.resohangout.com/

http://www.reso-nation.org/

Some of what is there is orientated towards playing lap-style, but not all.

TW

Dotneck · #6 01-19-2011, 09:38 PM

Do you have a trip to Raleigh coming up? I've got a couple Tricones you can demo...a Vintage Steel and an M1 (mahogany body)....

zombywoof · #7 01-19-2011, 09:41 PM

Yeah, Dobro has pretty much become like Coke or Clorox - the name being generically used to refer to any wood body resonator with a spider bridge.

Dobro, of course, also made metal body guitars. In the 1930s they were built using a different technique than Nationals and had a different style cone as well as the spider bridge. When the family re-aquired the Dobro name after Mosrite (which owned the Dobro moniker) went belly up 1970 they began making metal body guitars again. I believe you could get them with a spider or biscuit bridge. Sometime in the early to mid-1990s Gibson acquired the name.

I have played a couple and do not think they were as well built as the new Nationals are - OMI guitars were put togther on a pretty tight budget- but you can also score many of the 1970s-1990s guitars at pretty nice prices.

darylcrisp · #8 01-20-2011, 03:59 PM

folks
thanks for the info and direction, i've got to research and learn what a spider cone and biscuit are.

Dotneck, we may be headed to Raleigh sometime in spring-we've talked before and i think you were wanting to see the 00012c Beneteau-if so i would bring it for you to handle while i check yours out.

Thanks for the offer-hey, do you go by Harrys much? i seem to remember he had some resonators last time i was there-any other shops you think of in that area with a stock of them?

thanks again
daryl

Mycroft · #9 01-20-2011, 05:22 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by darylcrisp

folks
thanks for the info and direction, i've got to research and learn what a spider cone and biscuit are.

Dotneck, we may be headed to Raleigh sometime in spring-we've talked before and i think you were wanting to see the 00012c Beneteau-if so i would bring it for you to handle while i check yours out.

Thanks for the offer-hey, do you go by Harrys much? i seem to remember he had some resonators last time i was there-any other shops you think of in that area with a stock of them?

thanks again
daryl

With a biscuit, the cone faces downward with the saddle resting on a "biscuit" at the small end. With a spider, the Dopyera brothers had sold that patent when they sold the National company, so they came up with an alternative with the cone facing up (or out) and the spider is on top of that.

Here is a good place to start:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/John_Dopyera

cke · #10 01-20-2011, 05:41 PM

The country-western records mostly use Dobro's (spider bridge). Sweet and whiny. Are used for blues too.

The blues players mostly use biscuit bridge single resonators - harsher growly sound.

Tricones were the first and sound like a smoother more resonant biscuit bridge type.

knuckle · #11 01-20-2011, 05:49 PM

Tricones also have a t-bar type handle which makes them for me more difficult to find a comfortable hand positioning for muting which is integral for the stuff I play. I got rid of my tricones and not just have single cone nationals.

Now if your serious, I'd recommend finding a used national single cone. That is if you want to play blues. If you buy Chinese, your probably not going to be happy. Do it right the first time. National.

darylcrisp · #12 01-20-2011, 06:12 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by knuckle

Tricones also have a t-bar type handle which makes them for me more difficult to find a comfortable hand positioning for muting which is integral for the stuff I play. I got rid of my tricones and not just have single cone nationals.

Now if your serious, I'd recommend finding a used national single cone. That is if you want to play blues. If you buy Chinese, your probably not going to be happy. Do it right the first time. National.

thank you all for the continued info-this is great stuff as its all new to me.

I remember reading in the thread postings about someone mentioning the T-bar handle, i didn't know exactly what that was but after you pinpointed that out knuckle-i looked and see what it is now. on the weissenborn i am learning to mute with both hands(fingers) so i'm sure i'll want to do this on a resonator-especially the stuff i want to play, so it appears my attention needs to be directed towards the single cone.

my nomenclature is not up to speed with this new music venture so i'll best describe what i've come up with so far-i checked most of the soundclips on the national website and i find myself liking the sound of a wood body and a brass body. the brass sounds really nice-i'm sure those are heavy as lead though but thats how it is.

so i'll be playing this like a guitar-not lap style. are there any resonator forums out there?

thanks
daryl

Dotneck · #13 01-20-2011, 06:38 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by darylcrisp

folks
Dotneck, we may be headed to Raleigh sometime in spring-we've talked before and i think you were wanting to see the 00012c Beneteau-if so i would bring it for you to handle while i check yours out.

Thanks for the offer-hey, do you go by Harrys much? i seem to remember he had some resonators last time i was there-any other shops you think of in that area with a stock of them?

thanks again
daryl

Yes...we've talked before...and if you come down this way I at least owe you a beer for the Lawrence Juber tickets! So yes...give me a shout when you are down here.

And yes, I was at Harry's on Monday. He did have a Dobro...and I believe he's had it for a while. And that is certainly going to be le$$ pricey than a Tricone. Not sure if that's the sound you're looking for though...the dobro sound is pretty much associated with country and bluegrass. Or, maybe that is the sound you're looking for....

Dotneck · #14 01-20-2011, 06:42 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by darylcrisp

so i'll be playing this like a guitar-not lap style. are there any resonator forums out there?l

the IGS Guitar Seminars board seems is my favorite....its not really a "resonator board" but has the biggest perventage of reso players who know their stuff. I'm a member but usually just lurk and learn.....

http://www.guitarseminars.com/gs/index.php

darylcrisp · #15 01-20-2011, 06:43 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dotneck

Yes...we've talked before...and if you come down this way I at least owe you a beer for the Lawrence Juber tickets! So yes...give me a shout when you are down here.

And yes, I was at Harry's on Monday. He did have a Dobro...and I believe he's had it for a while. And that is certainly going to be le$$ pricey than a Tricone. Not sure if that's the sound you're looking for though...the dobro sound is pretty much associated with country and bluegrass. Or, maybe that is the sound you're looking for....

Oh, i think it was the Mayes i had back in the summer you really wanted to try-it was the "dirty" burst amber with lutz and mahogany-a great guitar, but i traded that due to the scale just not fitting me well. You'll have to see/play the Beneteau though-its cool.

Not wanting country or bluegrass sound so i'm dialing it into a National and right now figuring a wood body or brass body. I'll definitely keep in touch if we get to come that way and would love to see yours-and just meet you in person.

thanks
daryl