Taylor es2

[Bernieman]

http://www.themusiczoo.com/product/1...atural~~~Used/
(you might have to replace the ~ by the usual in between 2 words small line coz this does not work on my computer), but there is a 814C at a good price there (who knows, maybe your chance since they don't make them anymore it seams)....

Bernie.

[Bernieman]

Otherwise petty1818, what comes to my mind as far as acoustics with a cut~away are concerned, would be Gipsy Jazz guitars where that is the standard way still...But a whole different approach all together...Different concept, and different sound too...
I don't know much bout' who makes acoustics with cut~aways & no built~in electronics these days...Maybe a Martin Laurence Juber for instance ? Luthiers end up being quite expensive, and Custom made guitars too...
There must be some makes to do some however : maybe Furch, quite renown in Europe, but not frequently seen otherwise it seems...

[Bernieman]

Originally Posted by SpruceTop

The tone of the Taylor ES2 and Trance Audio Amulet M Dual Mono M-VT is excellent and both are top-notch quality, American-made systems. Of course, for your Martin D-28 Marquis (you have excellent taste!),

Good taste, don't know about that but yes great guitar...

Originally Posted by SpruceTop

the Trance system would be a good choice. The ONLY alteration you'd have to make to install one is to ream the end-pin hole to accept the system's 1/2-inch end-pin/jack/preamp. The system is completely removable should you want to do so, and without any damage to your guitar or the Trance's transducers.

Yes that's an important point, thanks...

Originally Posted by SpruceTop

Jackson Browne and other top artists use M Dual Mono and the stereo Trance systems.

Thanks for this too, and for your answer to Mbroady all very interesting : I would definitely use one of these non intrusive systems if i would have one set up on the marquis...It would still worry me a bit though...
I might try the DPA goose mike some day...

[Petty1818]

Originally Posted by Bernieman

Otherwise petty1818, what comes to my mind as far as acoustics with a cut~away are concerned, would be Gipsy Jazz guitars where that is the standard way still...But a whole different approach all together...Different concept, and different sound too...
I don't know much bout' who makes acoustics with cut~aways & no built~in electronics these days...Maybe a Martin Laurence Juber for instance ? Luthiers end up being quite expensive, and Custom made guitars too...
There must be some makes to do some however : maybe Furch, quite renown in Europe, but not frequently seen otherwise it seems...

Thank you for the replies. I was actually just using the 814 as an example. It is a model that I want but I am not set on a cutaway. I was just pointing out that on the Taylor website, the 814c only comes with electronics; unless you do a custom order. You can get a non-cutaway or 810 without electronics but I have yet to see an 810 without the ES2 and for some reason, I haven't liked the non-cutaway 814's that I have tried. The 814 you posted is also an older model which I don't like the sound of. Theree are many companies that offer cutaway models without electronics (Martin, Larrivee, Gibson etc.), I was just making the point that Taylor guitars generally ship with electronics.

[Bernieman]

Originally Posted by Petty1818

The store I go to is actually the largest Taylor dealer in Canada. They have a massive room that's covered in Taylor guitars. You would think that you were at the Taylor booth at NAMM the way the room is decorated. At any given time they have at least 100 Taylor guitars in stock.
With that said, I have yet to see a single one without electronics.(...) The thing is, the guitar is about $400.00 cheaper without the pickup so I wish that was an easier option.

So in addition to what you just wrote, at least you had a chancre to try a 814.., with no ES2...(!?)

I don't know much of the difference between the newer ones and the ones before...Thinner finish and different braces I've read & heard, but never played any (never played any of the elder 814 either ~ only a 812ce once...).
But if you plan to play live sooner or later, or if you already do, the extra 400 dollars to pay for ES2 sound worth the money to me...
Very useful for live acts, and doesn't help from using external mikes for perfecting the act...I'd go for it if i planned to get a new guitar i think...

[SpruceTop]

Originally Posted by Bernieman

So in addition to what you just wrote, at least you had a chancre to try a 814.., with no ES2...(!?)

I don't know much of the difference between the newer ones and the ones before...Thinner finish and different braces I've read & heard, but never played any (never played any of the elder 814 either ~ only a 812ce once...).
But if you plan to play live sooner or later, or if you already do, the extra 400 dollars to pay for ES2 sound worth the money to me...
Very useful for live acts, and doesn't help from using external mikes for perfecting the act...I'd go for it if i planned to get a new guitar i think...

Typically, the extra $400 for the Expression System at retail price is really about $300 at MAP price. The ES2 is a good system and it's already integrated in the guitar. Acoustic-guitar amplified tone isn't going to get much better for a long time than what currently available systems from manufacturers have to offer. I firmly believe that the Expression System is about as good as it gets.

[Bernieman]

Agree I think...
Thanks SpruceTop
Bernie

[Groberts]

Originally Posted by SpruceTop

Typically, the extra $400 for the Expression System at retail price is really about $300 at MAP price. The ES2 is a good system and it's already integrated in the guitar. Acoustic-guitar amplified tone isn't going to get much better for a long time than what currently available systems from manufacturers now have to offer. I firmly believe that the Expression System is about as good as it gets.

In terms of onboard acoustic Pickup systems with Vol, bass and treble controls that are elegant and easy to use, the ES2 so far is one of the best, if not the absolute best I've heard. Why? It is the most natural sounding. it achieves the goal of offering an authentic acoustic tone 'amplified'. Other systems exhibit sonic artifacts, such as piezo quack, or unnatural tonality. I tried a Martin D18 Retro yesterday with the onboard Fishman Aura system. I did not like it. The highs were very metalic and unnatural sounding, regardless of Aura preset (based on a brief demo).

That said, I also played a Gibson J185 yesterday with LR Baggs "Anthem". My God it was mind blowing. SOOOOOO natural. It is harder to adjust volume with the control inside the soundhole, but once dialed in, I have found that I leave the controls alone. The Anthem blew me away. Truly exceptional.

I briefly tried a Taylor 614CE (2015 model w/ES2). I could not get nearly as good amplified tone, but some of that was the inherent midrange of the 614CE.

[Vancebo]

A lot of us on this forum talk a lot about "natural" sounding. We all seem to have different definitions of NATURAL. That's expected. In the real world of amplified music as it applies to acoustic guitar when your amplified sound sounds natural it will be no doubt the first thing to get buried in the mix. For this reason a lot of the UST installed in guitars already have the EQ built into it. This gives us a brilliant sounding high end and just enough lows to make it believable. That actually works for use in a live band. In solo or smaller ensembles it sounds hideous. The more NATURAL sound is preferred.

Bottom line, I would like to start with a more natural sound and let my Session and if needed Venue work it's magic to get a sound that still sounds natural but cuts through the mix better. The ES2 does sound very natural but it could come with it's faults and obstacles as well just like any other system. You just have to work around them like anything else.

[Groberts]

Originally Posted by Vancebo

A lot of us on this forum talk a lot about "natural" sounding. We all seem to have different definitions of NATURAL. That's expected. In the real world of amplified music as it applies to acoustic guitar when your amplified sound sounds natural it will be no doubt the first thing to get buried in the mix. For this reason a lot of the UST installed in guitars already have the EQ built into it. This gives us a brilliant sounding high end and just enough lows to make it believable. That actually works for use in a live band. In solo or smaller ensembles it sounds hideous. The more NATURAL sound is preferred.

Bottom line, I would like to start with a more natural sound and let my Session and if needed Venue work it's magic to get a sound that still sounds natural but cuts through the mix better. The ES2 does sound very natural but it could come with it's faults and obstacles as well just like any other system. You just have to work around them like anything else.

GREAT post! Points well taken about band mixes versus more intimate solo/duo settings. It's all about choosing your poison, using the right tool for the job.

[Groberts]

Bernieman, I made some new demo recordings of the Taylor 814CE ES2 without looping. Hope this is helpful.

[Bernieman]

Thanks Gary : but you didn't have to do this...I had been convinced by the ES2 the second time I listened to your videos. Now I kind of feel somehow a bit embarrassed...
Still it is more clear this way as the two guitars do not interfere with one an other, and we get a chance to hear a fuller tone.
Many thanks...
Enjoy the guitar...

Bernie

[Groberts]

Originally Posted by Bernieman

Thanks Gary : but you didn't have to do this...I had been convinced by the ES2 the second time I listened to your videos. Now I kind of feel somehow a bit embarrassed...
Still it is more clear this way as the two guitars do not interfere with one an other, and we get a chance to hear a fuller tone.
Many thanks...
Enjoy the guitar...

Bernie

Not a problem. It was a pleasure my friend! I hope it helped give a more clear answer for you. :-) Happy Holidays!

[TaylorByron]

Nice Gary! I have a 816ce and the Loudbox Artist AND not one
but two mini Loudboxes. Fantastic amps! (As is the Taylor!)

But my style does a lot of sliding chords. I can't seem to eliminated
the STRING SQUEEK! Elixer ND Nano Web 13-53's on her.

I have tried to dial down the .050 allen on the PU's but really to
no avail.!

Next I am going to try a set of: D'Addario EFT17 Phosphor Bronze
FLAT TOPS in medium guage 13-56. To See if this helps.

Although Andy Powers has the RIGHT String chosen for this line!

Any other thoughts?

[Groberts]

Originally Posted by TaylorByron

Nice Gary! I have a 816ce and the Loudbox Artist AND not one
but two mini Loudboxes. Fantastic amps! (As is the Taylor!)

But my style does a lot of sliding chords. I can't seem to eliminated
the STRING SQUEEK! Elixer ND Nano Web 13-53's on her.

I have tried to dial down the .050 allen on the PU's but really to
no avail.!

Next I am going to try a set of: D'Addario EFT17 Phosphor Bronze
FLAT TOPS in medium guage 13-56. To See if this helps.

Although Andy Powers has the RIGHT String chosen for this line!

Any other thoughts?

I totally agree. String squeak is prominent with the ES2. You might see if you can
adjust the tension of the ES2 Piezo against the back of the bridge. the tightness might add a little string squeak. But you also get detail that is very musical. You might be stuck with it. I also use elixir HD gauge. That doesn't really help.

Perhaps a call or message to Taylor is in order?