Baby Buggie - NAD - UPDATE!

[Steve DeRosa]

Those of you who've been hanging around the Electric Guitar forum for a while know that I'm a major fan of the Bugera V22 - still my go-to play-out amp and one of three (V22, '65 Super RI, Frontman 212R) in my regular practice rotation; I'm also a major fan of low-buck/low-tech DIY mods that bring out the oft-hidden tones in an already-good piece of equipment - and with a bit more time on my hands since retirement, I've had my eye on a few project platforms...

Found ourselves out shopping today when I popped into GC to check out some of the "extended" Presidents' Day sales - long story short, my V22 has a new baby brother in the form of a V5 Infinium. Hooked up my P-90 LP and gave it a short workout this evening, and while there's a lot of good things happening already - the V-Series DNA is all there - there are still a few tweaks that'll bring out the real magic; here's a quick overview:

• Construction: One of the things that most impressed me (and the tech who helped me with some of the mods) about the original V22 was its rock-solid construction - cabinetry that I'm convinced could withstand a direct thermonuclear assault, with small details like machine-screw assembly that most of the big brands (and more than a few of the boutique names) don't even use; at an advertised 22+ pounds this one will be around for your great-grandchildren - and their great-grandchildren - to enjoy...
• Controls: Simple, straightforward, four-knob key to tonal heaven - Gain, Tone, Master Volume, Reverb - a three-way attenuator (5/1/0.1W) on the back panel for those who like to shred at 3 AM without incurring the wrath of their S.O. ("Go back to sleep, Lorena - I'll be in shortly..." ), and a headphone out for when even the 0.1W setting is too much ("The sharpener - it's in the left-hand drawer, dear..." ). Quite frankly, if I were still teaching I'd have every one of my students get this amp, period: the controls are simple, intuitive, and effective enough that even a ten-year-old can draw out a shopping-bag full of cool tones with little effort - the way it was done back in the day, and IMO a whole lot more fun than pushing a button for instant gratification...
• Tone: While I doubt the Infinium self-monitoring/self-biasing is the overarching reason (single-ended class-A circuits are self-biasing by design) this one's a definite step up from the first-run "blue-light" model; the upgrade Turbosound speaker is to my ears richer (some might say "darker") than its in-house Celestion-clone predecessor, and while unquestionably British in its overall tonality a '70s-rock or country player would still find much to like. The single tone control is, to my ears, wider-ranging than the older version; as I turned it up I noticed not only the expected increase in treble response but also a very subtle "fattening" of the bass - similar to a properly-done "smile" EQ curve and just enough to give my LP a little bit of woodiness as well as clarity. The built-in digi-verb - a couple generations newer/more refined than the already-excellent one in my V22 - is arguably the best you're going to find in any amp less than four times the extremely reasonable price of the V5, and will take you from a subtle "air" around your single-string picking to a 1963 surfy "wash" with few if any of the nasty digital artifacts: not a Leo-era blackface Twin, but better than just about any of the cheap short-spring units you'll find (if you find them at all) in comparably-sized/priced amps and IMO the final nail in the coffin of the "Behringer" stigma...
• Minuses: There are a few - but unlike Frank, not too few to mention. As long as you've got a stable, solid circuit, the heart of any tube amp is - duh - the tubes, and it's in this department that the folks at Bugera are still their own worst enemy; for those who have never tried it, the right tubes can turn an average amp into a great one - and a great amp into a jaw-dropper. While it's understood that these amps are built to a price - and Bugera wisely opted in favor of bulletproof construction and electronic reliability - I'd gladly pay a few bucks more for higher-quality glassware from the get-go; although the Turbosound speaker goes a long way in smoothing out the amplified tone, even on the 5W setting the EL84 brashness comes to the fore when you're using the headphones, and it's nearly impossible to get a really "clean" high-headroom fundamental tone - I wouldn't even think of using this as a DI pedal platform right out of the box. Given the success I had with my V22, first thing baby brother gets is a set of those Preferred Series pre-Glasnost Soviet mil-spec tubes that turned my V22 into a tone monster, maybe an Eminence 820H for a more "American" tonality - and a couple high-buck mini-amps for breakfast...

Updates to follow...

[M Hayden]

It's good to know that there is someone else who uses a Frontman 212R....

If you like the Bugera, the new Carr Mercury V is a treat worth trying, albeit at a much higher price.

[Steve DeRosa]

Originally Posted by M Hayden

It's good to know that there is someone else who uses a Frontman 212R...

Yeah, that's gonna be my surf/oldies "Twin-killer" when I get to it - a set of upgraded speakers (Eminence: either Swamp Thang - which I have in my V22 - or Cannabis Rex which'll be about 6-8 pounds lighter for the pair) and a better reverb tank...

...If you like the Bugera, the new Carr Mercury V is a treat worth trying, albeit at a much higher price.

I'd love to do an A/B with a Carr Mercury - or any other similar amps (Bad Cat, Blackstar, Swart, Victoria, etc.) once I get some new tubes (and possibly an upgraded speaker) mounted to level out the playing field a bit; might have some interesting results...

[M Hayden]

CRex in the 212 is a great clean sound, and gets loud very nicely. Did that after trying other things.....the CR is chimey enough to get the best out of a Strat.

The Carr MV is another thing entirely - it's a great amp, and it's a desert-island amp if you want to replace something equally great like a real DR.

[Steve DeRosa]

Originally Posted by M Hayden

CRex in the 212 is a great clean sound, and gets loud very nicely. Did that after trying other things...the CR is chimey enough to get the best out of a Strat...

Sounds like it's right up my alley - found out in my later years I'm more a mini-bucker (Gretsch/Taylor/Guild/Firebird/Johnny Smith)/P-90 kinda guy at heart - and considering I'm nursing some back issues as I write this, the weight savings over a pair of Swamp Thangs will be more than welcome...

[paulp1960]

Thanks for the review Steve please let us know how you get on with valve upgrades. I'm not sure I could cope with an 8 inch speaker, though. I find 10 inches the minimum for electric guitar.

I could be tempted by one of the Bugera 5 watt heads, particularly the shiny one.

[Salzburg Steve]

I posted earlier on the forum about getting one of these V5 amps.

What I wanted to pick up on is something Steve wrote - "if he was still teaching he would encourage all his students to get tone of these".
As a beginner to electric I second that and would just like to chip in a bit on my experience.

I have played acoustic for a few years but new to electric.
My first experience with electric was how awful you can sound and there is so much to learn about . . . feel and touch.

It is so tempting to look around and find good value amps with x number of amp sounds, buttons for this and that etc, I think you can get bogged down a bit with it.

My first amp was my little yamaha thr - and it is great, but I picked up this Bugera not long after and I am really enjoying it - plug in and concentate on making differnt sounds, experimenting and learning.

I think this learning is also helping me with my acoustic playing as well - relaxing a bit more, touch etc.

Regards
Steve

[maxtheaxe]

Nice breakdown on your amp arsenal and proposed mods going forward. I haven't ever had my hands on one of these Bugera amps...I keep hearing good things about them, though.

Like you, I always seem to dream up ways to squeeze out that little bit extra performance from my various bits of gear, although I am in no way qualified to do any actual electronic work on amps beyond occasionally swapping out tubes or speakers. One item in your post that caught my attention was your idea of perhaps upgrading the speaker in your V5 to an Eminence Swamp Thang. These Eminence guitar speakers that have come out with over the past few years have been nothing short of phenomenal.

The one and only caveat I've noted with those speakers is with regard to their impressive 102dB sensitivity ratings. I actually haven't used that particular model, but a while back I upgraded my BK Butler Tubedriver 100w 1x12 amp with a Texas Heat. Stunning tone, clarity, punch and at 150w pretty much bulletproof in any amp you put it in. However...

Those things are LOUD...I found that trying to get the darn thing warmed up and singing sweetly was almost impossible. The speaker is so efficient that I could never really quite get it broken in...although it tried to 'break-in' my ears. I was too loud FOR THE DRUMMER! It was a really great speaker for huge venues, especially if it meant that I could stand at least 20 feet away from my amp... but in bars or at private events, not so much.

Right about the time I decided that I couldn't take it any more, Celestion released their "V-series" 70 watt speaker, which sells for about the same price as the Swamp Thang...so I swapped again. Celestion bills this as a "modern take" on their V30 and I'd say that's pretty accurate. It sounds very much like a V30, but with a firmer bass response and perhaps less propensity toward 'edge yell'. I really like it as a good substitute for the venerable V30 (of which I have a couple in other amps/cabs) and I can get it warmed up and singing at a sane stage volume. It also doesn't hurt that it's about 50% less expensive than the V30. It pretty much nails the Celestion tone, though.

I've also seen advertised a newer Celestion, the "A-series", which is supposed to be a more "American-sounding" speaker...I'm guessing it's more of a 'Fender-clean' type spkr where the other one is Brit.

Are we having fun yet?

[KevWind]

Originally Posted by Salzburg Steve

I posted earlier on the forum about getting one of these V5 amps.

What I wanted to pick up on is something Steve wrote - "if he was still teaching he would encourage all his students to get tone of these".
As a beginner to electric I second that and would just like to chip in a bit on my experience.

I have played acoustic for a few years but new to electric.
My first experience with electric was how awful you can sound and there is so much to learn about . . . feel and touch.

It is so tempting to look around and find good value amps with x number of amp sounds, buttons for this and that etc, I think you can get bogged down a bit with it.

My first amp was my little yamaha thr - and it is great, but I picked up this Bugera not long after and I am really enjoying it - plug in and concentate on making differnt sounds, experimenting and learning.

I think this learning is also helping me with my acoustic playing as well - relaxing a bit more, touch etc.

Regards
Steve

Since I also am basically new or renew to electric after 47 years of acoustic only. I also ended up taking some of Steve's advice and purchased a Supro Combo and cabinet on a blow out deal he recommended . And I am totally pleased

And took the "less is more" type thinking into my purchase of practice amp as well. After spending four different days in several hour sessions playing just about every practice amp at our local GC and two independant shops . I reached the conclusion that as a re-newbie I was better served just playing as opposed to fiddling, and honestly I did not really like most of the digital simulations in these cheaper practice category amps .

So bottom line is I ended up with an Orange Crush which has only a spring reverb and two channels a clean and "Dirty' overdriven channel. and no simulations
The only straying from the less is more modus, was getting a looper to be able to loop chords to practice leads over ( one of the main reasons I decided to get back into electric ) and a analog drive pedal and loop pedal, to help to have more change from the clean chord tones .

[Steve DeRosa]

Originally Posted by maxtheaxe

...Like you, I always seem to dream up ways to squeeze out that little bit extra performance from my various bits of gear, although I am in no way qualified to do any actual electronic work on amps beyond occasionally swapping out tubes or speakers. One item in your post that caught my attention was your idea of perhaps upgrading the speaker in your V5 to an Eminence Swamp Thang. These Eminence guitar speakers that have come out with over the past few years have been nothing short of phenomenal.

The one and only caveat I've noted with those speakers is with regard to their impressive 102dB sensitivity ratings. I actually haven't used that particular model, but a while back I upgraded my BK Butler Tubedriver 100w 1x12 amp with a Texas Heat. Stunning tone, clarity, punch and at 150w pretty much bulletproof in any amp you put it in. However...

Those things are LOUD...I found that trying to get the darn thing warmed up and singing sweetly was almost impossible. The speaker is so efficient that I could never really quite get it broken in...although it tried to 'break-in' my ears. I was too loud FOR THE DRUMMER! It was a really great speaker for huge venues, especially if it meant that I could stand at least 20 feet away from my amp... but in bars or at private events, not so much...

Actually, Max, I was going to swap an Eminence 820H - kind of a baby brother to the Cannabis Rex - into the V5 to obtain a more "American" tonality, while still maintaining the advantages of compact size and light weight; You got me thinking, though - I've seen some empty 2x12" cabs for sale in the local classifieds, so a couple Swamp Thangs patched into the V5 is well within the realm of possibility...

As far as the efficiency of the Eminence speakers is concerned, it can be used to great advantage in a lower-powered amp and/or if your style tends toward the cleaner side of the electric guitar spectrum (as mine does). When I retrofitted my V22 with the Swamp Thang and NOS Soviet mil-spec tubes, I was specifically looking to capture the "big clean" tones of the Ampeg "key club" Gemini II/B-12XT amps that were the mainstay of the NYC studios in the mid-60's, and place my '64 top-panel/no 'verb Rocket into semi-retirement; in other words, when I approached this project I knew exactly what I was looking for and exactly which components I would need to achieve it, the only variable being the requisite power tube biasing (a former student's father was an electronics tech and 30+ year tube junkie so he helped me with the latter). In short, a (then) $300 Brit-voiced practice amp became a little plug-&-play monster that'll hang with both my (100W) Frontman 212R and (45W) '65 Super RI, handle a 700-seat house with no problem (used to use it for school functions on a regular basis), and sound like nothing else on the market - until you want it to...

Finally, if you like the Eminence tone but have issues with excessive volume you might want to check out their Maverick ("American") and "Reignmaker" ("British"); these are equipped with a built-in attenuator that allows you to roll back speaker efficiency with no effect on your tone (unlike riding the volume/gain in your guitar and/or amp) - sounds like it might be just the ticket if you play a variety of small and large venues...

[Steve DeRosa]

New tubes arrived last Saturday - same ones that turned my V22 into a little monster:

http://www.thetubestore.com/Shop-by-...remium-Package

Installed them earlier this week, initial results look promising...

Full review when I've had the chance to wring them out with all my electrics - stay tuned...

[Steve DeRosa]

Well, I've had a chance to put the now-retubed "Baby Buggie" through its paces with a variety of electrics - with some interesting results...

First off, the Infinium self-monitoring/self-biasing circuit does everything the factory claims it does; inasmuch as I was replacing the cheap OEM tubes with some high-quality Soviet mil-spec glassware - including an ultra-high headroom power tube - I knew that the circuit would need to compensate to some degree. For those of you who own/are considering owning this amp and want to do a tube swap, don't be concerned when you see the front panel light flash briefly as the amp begins to warm up - it's proof positive that things are working according to plan. Depending on the tubes you use, you'll also need to give it a long (really long) warm-up compared to the POS factory tubes for which the Infinium circuit is (unfortunately) optimized; I'm discovering that mine needs a good 10-15 minutes with these MIG fighter-quality tubes before it really comes into its own - but when it does...

I've said it before and I'll say it again: for those of you who own tube amps and have never needed/wanted to do a tube replacement, you have no idea what dramatically different tonal properties tubes with identical nomenclature can possess - and how, if used to advantage, these characteristics can make all the difference in the world to your signature sound. While it still tends toward the darker side of the sonic spectrum - inherent to many class-A EL84 designs BTW, and the impetus for Dick Denney's development of the Vox "Top Boost" circuit in the early-60's - the response is quicker, tighter, and more articulate (in this case primarily a function of the preamp tube - I did some A/B/C comparisons with a few other 12AX7's from my stash), as well as possessing body and depth more akin to an "American" amp (same thing I noticed when I swapped the power tubes in my V22, albeit lacking the low-end impact of the V22's 12" speaker). I'm also noticing a greater degree of interaction between the gain/master controls - as I said, a ten-year-old could draw out a bunch of very useful/musical tones with a minimum of effort; my preferences run toward the cleaner side of things, and at the 5-watt setting it's easy to dial up an Ampeg-like fat, clean tone with no loss of treble, at a level comparable to an acoustic guitar played at bedroom volume. Recently joined a uke club and an acoustic musicians' meetup - looks like this one's not going to be strictly for the home office/music room...

One of the reasons for the popularity of EL84-based circuits is their characteristic "chime," and while somewhat minimized by the high-headroom power tube running straight class-A, this amp clearly favors guitars equipped with single-coils and mini-buckers (Gretsch Filter'tron/Hi-Lo'tron, Gibson Firebird/LP Deluxe/Johnny Smith, Taylor Solidbody, etc.). As previously stated, there's an articulate clarity which, regardless of your preferred playing style, brings out the '50s jazzbox heritage of your P-90 axe - full and fat, with an upper-midrange sweetness reminiscent of a good acoustic archtop - and lends an almost DeArmond-like classiness to a Strat; not to say that it's a one-trick pony - a MIJ Yamaha SSC-500 with OEM tappable single-coils ran the gamut of rock/funk/blues/country/surf, as well as more jazz-oriented tones, depending on the amp settings. The full-size humbuckers in my Epiphone 339 Ultra (comparable to late-80's Gibson PAF reissues) sacrificed the high-end sweetness for thicker, chunkier tones in all positions, still with the aforementioned tight, quick articulation - IMO this would probably make a good recording setup for a mainstream jazz player...

Turning toward the heavier side of things, as tested the re-tubed V5 has more of a baby-Hiwatt flavor than mini-Marshall/Vox: taking a page from the Who, "meaty, beaty, big, and bouncy," with a nice ballsy crunch (albeit limited by the built-in 8" speaker) that can be dialed back to some really sweet bluesy tones, especially through the neck pickup - pack up that modeler and get a good mic on this one for your studio needs. If you're inclined to get your Carlos on once in a while, however, this isn't your combination - you'd be better-served with a Mesa SP-AX7 and a JJ EL844 (a proprietary low-power/low-headroom EL84) - and you'll want one of the better Chinese 12AX7's (yes, Virginia, there really is such a thing) along with a JJ or EH power tube if you're looking for a mini-me Marshall. Caveat when you're swapping preamp tubes: unlike the earlier versions, the current built-in digi-verb is significantly affected by preamp tube type/gain - I'm getting some cool 1963-style surf sounds at around 4 on the dial, that I wasn't getting with the either the OEM or any of my test-mule tubes - so if you prefer onboard 'verb to a stompbox you'll need to take this into consideration...

Finally, I've been debating whether or not to swap out the OEM Turbosound speaker in favor of an Eminence 820H - essentially a scaled-down version of their best-selling Cannabis Rex hempcone 12"; FWIW the TS is a definite improvement over the Celestion wannabe used in the last generation of Bugera V-Series amps (something I've also noticed about the 12" version in the Infinium V22), and I'm not too sure at this point whether the $65 investment - nominal though it may be - will produce the same tonal "wow factor" the Swamp Thang did in my blue-light V22. Might just sit this one out for a while and let it break in a little further...

[rdawsoniii]

I did replace the stock tubes in my V5 with a JAN Phillips 12AT7 and a
Tung-sol EL84.

I think you will be pleased with the Eminence speaker, should you decide to go that route. There is a V-5 thread at tdpri.com, and the Eminence gets rave reviews. Read the posts by soulman69.

[Steve DeRosa]

Originally Posted by rdawsoniii

I did replace the stock tubes in my V5 with a JAN Phillips 12AT7 and a Tung-sol EL84...

You might find these of interest:

http://www.thetubestore.com/12AX7-Tube-Reviews
http://www.thetubestore.com/EL84-Tube-Review