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Old 04-10-2017, 10:47 PM
N K Forster N K Forster is offline
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Default Bam vs Visesnut vs Hiscox

I had three different cases in the workshop this week, so I made a short video comparing them:



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Old 04-10-2017, 10:48 PM
N K Forster N K Forster is offline
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Default Bam vs Visesnut vs Hiscox

I had three different cases in the workshop this week, so I made a short video comparing them:



Nigel
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Old 04-11-2017, 03:36 AM
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Thanks Nigel,

Almost got a Bam a few years back and now I am glad I did not!

I appreciate your comments about good support near the headstock. I also looked at the handles on the cases in your video - nice to see at least one handle with square rings linking it to the case...my Ameritage case has a replacement handle after the original one broke for the simple reason that they used C shaped rings, which stressed the handle until it ripped.

Off topic, but which part of the UK are you from? To this uncultured Aussie your accent sounds a bit like that of Ross Nobel, one of my favorite comedians.

Col
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Old 04-11-2017, 05:59 AM
jmagill jmagill is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by colins View Post
Almost got a Bam a few years back and now I am glad I did not!
I appreciate this video, since I've had no experience with the Visesnut and Hiscox cases, but as to the comments about the BAM cases, any comparison like this depends on what features you're willing to accept in order to get others you place a greater value on. Nigel's (unstated) objective here was to determine which case gives the maximum protection, and of course there will be trade-offs, and increased protection may cost you in weight, bulkiness, interior space and/or price. It would have been nice if Nigel had included relative cost in his evaluation.

When I was gigging full-time back in the early 80's I used Mark Leaf cases for my guitars and mandolins. They were the standard for maximum instrument protection at the time and they were built like a tank. I remember standing on my case to demonstrate this to a fellow musician. They were also expensive, thick and bulky and really heavy. Those were the trade-offs.

Nowadays, my gigging is mostly within a day's drive and I almost never fly.

Since my house is humidified and my instruments never leave my care, I don't need maximum protection anymore. After 40 years playing music the qualities I now value most in a case are a light weight, a slim design, sturdiness and convenience.

For my three guitars and two mandolins I use a Calton, two Hoffees and my favorites, two BAM cases.

If I was still playing full-time and needed maximum protection, Calton and Hoffee still set the standard, but for a light but sturdy, easy-to-carry-around case it's hard to beat BAM.

Yes, it doesn't have a neck support at the head, but when the accessory bag under the neck is full of my picks, capo, strings, tuner, string-changing tools, etc. it provides some support, and an old t-shirt to wipe down the guitar wadded up under the headstock provides more. Nigel indicates the accessory bag is for a strap, which I suppose it could be used for, but I seldom use one, and if I do it can be coiled and placed in the space created by the guitar's cutaway, or if the guitar doesn't have a cutaway, folded in half and placed in the shallow cavity between the guitar back and the case. The accessory bag is actually pretty useful since I don't have to keep rummaging in the case for a capo, picks or a tuner. I simply take the bag out and have it next to me while I'm playing.

The main selling point for the BAM cases for me is their feather-light weight with a slim profile and acceptable sturdiness. My Bashkin 00 in its BAM case with all accessories tips the scale at just 11.2 lbs.(!) My Circa OM in its BAM case weighs 12.6 lbs. For comparison, my relatively light Buendia in its Hoffee case weighs in at 20.2 lbs.

8 or 9 lbs. difference may not sound like much, but if you've ever had to carry a bulky 20+ lb. case through a big airport or across the grounds of a festival or from a parking deck four blocks from your gig, 20 lbs. can feel like 50 in a hurry, especially the older you get. The Hoffee's great for traveling, but for day-to-day use the BAM wins hands-down.

The main drawbacks for the BAM is their scarcity here in the states, a price tag up around $800, and the fact their guitar case sizes only come in dreadnaught, classical and manouche (gypsy guitar). However, I've found that a 00 will fit in the classical case and an OM will fit in the manouche.
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Last edited by jmagill; 04-11-2017 at 01:45 PM.
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Old 04-11-2017, 06:06 AM
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iim7V7IM7 iim7V7IM7 is offline
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Nigel, thanks for posting the video. I saw the BAM cases this weekend at the Artisan Guitar Show and was not impressed.

I own cases by Amertage, Hiscox (both Pro II and Artist), Hoffee and Visenut. If I was a traveling musician (which I am not) and looking for robust protection, I believe the Hoffee cases to be the most robust of these four cases to rough baggage handling. That said, it comes at a price.

The Visenut is about 1/3rd lighter than either the Hiscox and Hoffee. My Hiscox and Hoffee cases are about 5.5 kg and the Visenut is about 3.6 kg. For someone who mostly transports their guitars by car and carries their guitars onto an airplane I think the Visenut is a brilliant system. I do know some classical players who swear by their Visenut cases and use them as flight cases (with their covers). Another aspect of the Visenut is it does not have TSA compliant locks so you cannot lock the case on an airplane. The work around when using the padded cover is to buy a TSA complaint lock to couple the two zippers.
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Old 04-11-2017, 07:51 AM
philjs philjs is offline
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Thanks, Nigel. The lack of head support in the Bam case IS a complete deal breaker (pun!). I'd never heard of Visesnut before so it was interesting to see. Like you I'm not too impressed with the soft accessories bin lid but I did like the idea that it was completely removable and fastened in at the one end with Velcro.

My one complaint with Hiscox cases (FYI, all of my instruments have Hiscox cases...they're the only cases I've found that can be easily modified to suit instruments with less traditional shapes, including those with Manzer wedges) is that the glue that they use to fasten the lid fabric invariably comes loose and the bin lid flops around every time it's opened...I've taken to using a staple gun, inside the bin pocket, to fix those suckers down!

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Old 04-11-2017, 08:01 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by philjs View Post
My one complaint with Hiscox cases (FYI, all of my instruments have Hiscox cases........ is that the glue that they use to fasten the lid fabric invariably comes loose and the bin lid flops around every time it's opened...I've taken to using a staple gun, inside the bin pocket, to fix those suckers down!

Phil
My gripe too - but I use carpet adhesive to re-glue the fabric instead of staples.

I have another gripe about Hiscoxes (like you, I have all my instruments n Hiscox cases) which is the tendency of the Latch-Spring to break/fly out. Although the latch still works to some degree, it doesn't feel as secure. Hiscox are very good at supplying replacement latches, but there's drilling and pop-riveting involved. OK for someone technically-inclined, but a problem for a Johnny Five-Thumbs like me!
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Old 04-11-2017, 08:39 AM
Tony Burns Tony Burns is offline
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another case to consider is the access case( use on larrivees )
thou its tough to get info on it -
have though about removing the lettering on a larrivee case
but feel it may damage the case ( if you know how to do it -im all ears )
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Old 04-11-2017, 09:00 AM
ocarolan ocarolan is offline
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As I said on "another" Forum, excellent video Nige -thanks!

Quote:
Originally Posted by JayBee1404 View Post
My gripe too - but I use carpet adhesive to re-glue the fabric instead of staples.

I have another gripe about Hiscoxes (like you, I have all my instruments n Hiscox cases) which is the tendency of the Latch-Spring to break/fly out. Although the latch still works to some degree, it doesn't feel as secure. Hiscox are very good at supplying replacement latches, but there's drilling and pop-riveting involved. OK for someone technically-inclined, but a problem for a Johnny Five-Thumbs like me!
Another vote for carpet adhesive! Copydex (in UK) is good. This flap thing seems to be a common problem - the glue they use seems to deteriorate fairly rapidly into balck powdery stuff.

It really isn't difficult to replace the latches, nor do you need to be technically minded. The drilling is very quick and easy, the pop rivets take a little longer, but if you've strong hands then a cheap rivet tool will suffice. Just takes a few minutes per catch. Doing the first one is the psychological barrier, then you'll be away! Instructions are sent with the catches and rivets.

As you say, Hiscox are a good firm to deal with - I've had a set of catches, rivets and some extra velvet-covered foam pads from them on request, and free of charge.

Keith
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Old 04-11-2017, 09:06 AM
N K Forster N K Forster is offline
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For years all I used was Calton cases - that's when Keith Calton made them in the UK. His trade price was excellent as were the cases. No issues. When Keith sold up and all production moved over to the US that was the end of it - $750 + VAT and no trade discount is enough to get you looking elsewhere. If a customer really wants one, I give them the guitar dimensions and they order it themselves, handle all the paperwork then send it to me.

So this video is about some of the alternatives that are easy to get here in Germany. Hiscox I buy direct still (not through their German dealer) and they are superb to deal with. Peter who handles sales for Hiscox s brilliant. Good customer service is a big plus.

Bam and Visesnut both have distributors in Germany. So there is no messing about with import duties - importing from outside the EU is a P.I.T A. in this country so I'm happy for others to do it on my behalf. So that rules out Hoffee and Karura, both excellent cases but neither have European distributors as far as I am aware.

The purpose of a case varies according to the owner. For some, it's a vital working tool. For others, it's something to keep the guitar in the house. For others still, it's something to show off.

The Bam isn't a terrible case, but for the money, it's not good enough. If it was half the price I'd still not be happy about the string box or the lack of head support. But I'm sure they have their fans. Hopefully, they will come across this thread some time and think again about the design.

The Visesnut is a very good case. No heavier than the Bam, but much more robust. You could rely on it for a few years. The Hiscox is a good working tool. In the end, none are a Calton, but getting one isn't really an option these days.


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Old 04-11-2017, 09:54 AM
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Copydex - that's the stuff, Keith!
I have some spare latches, but I can't figure how to get between the internal padding and the shell, which I'm guessing I'd need to do in order to put the new rivets in. Do you know of any videos that demonstrate how to do it?
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Old 04-11-2017, 12:14 PM
N K Forster N K Forster is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by colins View Post
Thanks Nigel,

Off topic, but which part of the UK are you from? To this uncultured Aussie your accent sounds a bit like that of Ross Nobel, one of my favorite comedians.

Col
Yes, he's from Northumberland, same as me. He's from Cramlington which is about 15 miles north of Newcastle whilst I'm from Hexham about 20 miles west. Well done for spotting it.

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Old 04-11-2017, 05:07 PM
jljohn jljohn is offline
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Thanks for the video and analysis. I've been looking at BAM, Visesnut, Hiscox, and a couple of other cases, and this is very helpful.

One thing I'll note about the BAM is that their Hightech line of cases don't have support above and below the neck at the nut, but they have an angled pad above the headstock (much like the Hoffee) to address whiplash breakage. I'm not sure it's a great solution, but it's something.

Last edited by jljohn; 04-11-2017 at 08:49 PM. Reason: Cleanup
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Old 04-11-2017, 09:44 PM
N K Forster N K Forster is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jljohn View Post
Thanks for the video and analysis. I've been looking at BAM, Visesnut, Hiscox, and a couple of other cases, and this is very helpful.

One thing I'll note about the BAM is that their Hightech line of cases don't have support above and below the neck at the nut, but they have an angled pad above the headstock (much like the Hoffee) to address whiplash breakage. I'm not sure it's a great solution, but it's something.
That approach just doesn't convince me I'm afraid. For traveling, I pack above and below the head anyway. But I do prefer case makers who understand issues rather than look for what they can omit to make production easier or quicker. And that is something I see in the BAM case. It's a very nice looking object, and it looks like it would be very quick to make. But it doesn't perform the function I would like. But as a shiny fashion object, it's fine.

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Old 04-12-2017, 06:47 AM
jonnymosco jonnymosco is offline
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Great vid Nigel.

I've owned two BAMs and only used them for light use, A-B in the car or walking around town (as you do) as they weigh virtually nothing. I wouldn't expect them to be sturdy enough for flying - I'd compare a BAM to a Miata/MX-5 and wouldn't criticise that it's not capable of going off road, I don't think it was designed for that.

Having said that, I have a friend who carries his Smallman in a BAM on international flights regularly, a bit crazy, especially as it's his profession and only guitar.

Hiscox Artist I've also owned, best value and strength for money, but not the slickest styling.

I'd happily buy a Visesnut next time.

Jonny
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