Red Eye / Grace Bix / Rupert Neve RNDI

[Riles]

It is active with a battery fyi

[jimmorgan]

I don't think a DI is going to solve your hum problem.

First, you don't need a DI to plug into your Schertler Jam 400, as it already has high impedance instrument inputs, so whether your pickup is active or passive, it should plug in just fine.

Second, your guitar probably isn't what's causing the hum. Ground loops come from two sources plugged into two different ground points, the hum comes from the differential in electrical charge between the two. If your guitar isn't plugged into some kind of external device before the amp that has it's own power supply, and that power supply isn't plugged into a separate circuit with a separate ground from your amp, you won't get a ground loop.

DI's with ground lifts or transformer isolation are designed to prevent ground loops, but I don't think that's your problem.

Most likely what's happening is you are plugging into an outlet with no ground at all. If that's the case your amp is going to hum unless you plug it in somewhere else, or you fix the grounding scheme of the circuit/building your are plugging into.

I live in an old house where half the outlets are grounded and half aren't. If I plug into the wrong outlet I'll get hum on some equipment no matter what.

[lschwart]

Originally Posted by jimmorgan

I don't think a DI is going to solve your hum problem.

First, you don't need a DI to plug into your Schertler Jam 400, as it already has high impedance instrument inputs, so whether your pickup is active or passive, it should plug in just fine.

Second, your guitar probably isn't what's causing the hum. Ground loops come from two sources plugged into two different ground points, the hum comes from the differential in electrical charge between the two. If your guitar isn't plugged into some kind of external device before the amp that has it's own power supply, and that power supply isn't plugged into a separate circuit with a separate ground from your amp, you won't get a ground loop.

DI's with ground lifts or transformer isolation are designed to prevent ground loops, but I don't think that's your problem.

Most likely what's happening is you are plugging into an outlet with no ground at all. If that's the case your amp is going to hum unless you plug it in somewhere else, or you fix the grounding scheme of the circuit/building your are plugging into.

I live in an old house where half the outlets are grounded and half aren't. If I plug into the wrong outlet I'll get hum on some equipment no matter what.

Unless it is a ground loop, yup.

Also, with an active pickup you don't really need a preamp to plug into that amp (probably not with a passive one for that matter). Get one only if you need it for features you don't have on the amp or features you'd like to have at your feet if the amp is some distance away from you on stage or the controls hard to get at on the fly. One (or at least a DI) might be useful if you need to split the signal between the amp and a house PA, but others just plug in and enjoy that nice amp!

Louis

[rockabilly69]

Originally Posted by lschwart

The key questions are whether or not it uses a battery and whether or not it's a mic, a piezo element of some kind, or a magnetic pickup. If it does use a battery, that means it's active, has it's one onboard preamp, and can be more or less plugged into anything. If it does not and it uses a piezo element, it's going to need an input with a high input impedance (1 megOhm or higher). The inputs on your channels 4/5 and 6/7 on the Jam 400 are probably adequate for this. Unless you're unhappy with the tone your'e getting, I'd think a ground tester and maybe a simple DI box that would let you run a balanced signal into one of the mic inputs would be more useful in the face of the hum problem than an EQ unit like the Empress--as good a unit as that is.

Louis

If the hum problem was there with three different guitars, and mogami instrument cables (which are shielded great) the problem is most likely not his guitar, but some bad grounds at the wall, bad power cable, or an internal problem with the Jam 400. No DI is going to help it. I have never needed a DI with my JAM 400, and have run all sorts or pickups, passive and active into my Jam 400 with no ill effect. Same with my JAM 200. The best would be to plug his JAM 400 into a known good grounded outlet to start the tests!

What we know....

The ground lift on the amp is not fixing the problem. And it won't if the outlets are missing the ground!!!

Most likely it's not his guitar (three guitars have been tested).

Although the cable used was a Mogami it could still be defective, if it was the only one used. Pretty low chance of this though because Mogamis are pretty thoroughly tested! I run at least 100 of them in my studio without a single failure!

The pickup in his guitar is active (it uses a battery). So let's take that out of the equation.

But the best explanation for these problems is as Jim Morgan posted, BAD GROUNDS AT THE WALL!!!!

[rockabilly69]

Originally Posted by Riles

I will check out Empress especially with your real world experience with the Jam. Curious if you have a default settting to start. Also ground tester seems like a great idea. Do you search for a good outlet and bring extension cords as needed? Are you the one who added short pole mount to Jam I saw?

About the Empress! No default setting, as each different guitar/pickup combo has different needs but if you PM after getting one I can give you a little tutorial.

Yes I was the one who added the short pole mount setup, and was the one who posted thorough reviews of both the JAM 400, and the Jam 200.

[lschwart]

Originally Posted by rockabilly69

If the hum problem was there with three different guitars, and mogami instrument cables (which are shielded great) the problem is most likely not his guitar, but some bad grounds at the wall, bad power cable, or an internal problem with the Jam 400. No DI is going to help it. I have never needed a DI with my JAM 400, and have run all sorts or pickups, passive and active into my Jam 400 with no ill effect. Same with my JAM 200. The best would be to plug his JAM 400 into a known good grounded outlet to start the tests!

What we know....

The ground lift on the amp is not fixing the problem. And it won't if the outlets are missing the ground!!!

Most likely it's not his guitar (three guitars have been tested).

Although the cable used was a Mogami it could still be defective, if it was the only one used. Pretty low chance of this though because Mogamis are pretty thoroughly tested! I run at least 100 of them in my studio without a single failure!

The pickup in his guitar is active (it uses a battery). So let's take that out of the equation.

But the best explanation for these problems is as Jim Morgan posted, BAD GROUNDS AT THE WALL!!!!

Yes. I didn't mean to confuse the issue of balancing the signal with the fact that this hum is probably caused by a problem "in the wall." The reason I asked about the pickups is to see if Riles needed something going into the amp at all (strictly speaking, he doesn't). And I wanted to underline the fact that Riles should only look into something like the Empress if he's having trouble shaping his tone the way he likes it with the EQ available on the Jam 400. The Empress won't even balance the signal, if that were what he needed, so the only reason to get it is for it's very elaborate EQ shaping abilities. Probably overkill, but that's up to him.

Louis

[rockabilly69]

Originally Posted by lschwart

Yes. I didn't mean to confuse the issue of balancing the signal with the fact that this hum is probably caused by a problem "in the wall." The reason I asked about the pickups is to see if Riles needed something going into the amp at all (strictly speaking, he doesn't). And I wanted to underline the fact that Riles should only look into something like the Empress if he's having trouble shaping his tone the way he likes it with the EQ available on the Jam 400. The Empress won't even balance the signal, if that were what he needed, so the only reason to get it is for it's very elaborate EQ shaping abilities. Probably overkill, but that's up to him.

Louis

Louis,

Hopefully you realize I didn't mean any disrespect to you, or that I am being argumentative, as the reason I quoted your post is I felt you, although well meaning, were sending him down a rabbit hole advising him to use a DI which will not correct a defective ground situation. To fix his problem he has to make sure those outlets were not defective before he goes any further. And now with your latest post I see that you and I agree on this. And then when he finds a known good outlet, he can find out if his JAM 400 has a problem And that may very well be the case, as I haven't experienced any problem like his (other than one time in a nightmare of bar electrical system with no GROUNDS at the outlet), and my Jam 400 has at least 600 gigs on it.

And your description of pickup impedance, while very good and informative to people, was not applicable to the Jam 400, as it inputs can handle pretty much any impedance thrown at it.

My advise to use the EMPRESS Para EQ with the JAM 400 comes from dealing with using the JAM 400 almost every day, and it has two extremely weak links, and one is SPECIFIC to his situation...

First, the EQ, which he has none of on his guitar. With no onboard guitar EQ at any kind of volume, and the JAM 400 can get very loud, he will definately have problems shaping his tone! The only EQ control semi-useful on the JAM 400 is the resonance contro, but it really isn't that powerful in the ability to remove low end resonance, and the fixed mid and high tone controls are set with odd center points and frankly don't shape tone all that well. I have many acoustic guitars, and have used the Empress with most every brand pickup mentioned on these pages, and I can say without a doubt that it has always made every pickup easier to dial with the Schertler. So the Empress fixes that problem, that's why I recommended it to him. Along with the fact he was looking to beef up a thinner tone, and the Empress has 30db of clean gain on tap. So the Empress has the ability to do what he wants, but surely it won't fix the hum problem.

The second weak link is the FX section, as I feel it has only two good settings, preset #1 which can be set to approximate a fairly good slapback tight echo for roots rock - country style settings, and #7 which is a long hall type reverb which in lower mix settings can sound fairly natural in rooms that require a bit of reverb. But you don't really need any other FX, it's just that the other 6 presets are pretty much useless that's why I call it a weak link!

[lschwart]

Originally Posted by rockabilly69

Louis,

Hopefully you realize I didn't mean any disrespect to you, or that I am being argumentative, as the reason I quoted your post is I felt you, although well meaning, were sending him down a rabbit hole advising him to use a DI which will not correct a defective ground situation. To fix his problem he has to make sure those outlets were not defective before he goes any further! And now with your latest post I see that you and I agree on this. And then when he finds a good outlet he can find out if his JAM 400 has a problem And that may very well be the case as I haven't experienced any problem like his (other than one time in a nightmare of bar electrical system with no GROUNDS at the outlet), and my Jam 400 has at least 600 gigs on it.

And your description of pickup impedance, while very good and informative to people, was not applicable to the Jam 400, as it inputs can handle pretty much any impedance thrown at it.

My advise to use the EMPRESS Para EQ with the JAM 400 comes from dealing with using the JAM 400 almost every day, and it has two extremely weak links, and one is SPECIFIC to his situation...

First, the EQ, which he has none of on his guitar. With no onboard guitar EQ at any kind of volume, and the JAM 400 can get very loud, he will definately have problems shaping his tone! The only EQ control semi-useful on the JAM 400 is the resonance contro, but it really isn't that powerful in the ability to remove low end resonance, and the fixed mid and high tone controls are set with odd center points and frankly don't shape tone all that well. I have many acoustic guitars, and have used the Empress with most every brand pickup mentioned on these pages, and I can say without a doubt that it has always made every pickup easier to dial with the Schertler. So the Empress fixes that problem, that's why I recommended it to him. Along with the fact he was looking to beef up a thinner tone, and the Empress has 30db of clean gain on tap. So the Empress has the ability to do what he wants, but surely it won't fix the hum problem.

The second weak link is the FX section, as I feel it has only two good settings, preset #1 which can be set to approximate a fairly good slapback tight echo for roots rock - country style settings, and #7 which is a long hall type reverb which in lower mix settings can sound fairly natural in rooms that require a bit of reverb. But you don't really need any other FX, it's just that the other 6 presets are pretty much useless that's why I call it a weak link!

That's all understood--and very good specific information on using that amp. As I said, I didn't meant to confuse matters, although in piling up too many things in the post I realize I did.

I just wanted to make sure Riles understood that there was a difference between ways of reducing different kinds of unwanted noise (balancing on the one hand and electrical system issues on the other) and issues with tone. Since it's clear he doesn't need a balanced line--or for that matter something to match his impedances--he does not need a preamp/EQ unit unless its a matter of tone (or maybe feedback). His problem with the electrical systems he's plugging into is a separate matter.

Louis

[rockabilly69]

Originally Posted by lschwart

That's all understood--and very good specific information on using that amp. As I said, I didn't meant to confuse matters, although in piling up too many things in the post I realize I did.

I just wanted to make sure Riles understood that there was a difference between ways of reducing different kinds of unwanted noise (balancing on the one hand and electrical system issues on the other) and issues with tone. Since it's clear he doesn't need a balanced line--or for that matter something to match his impedances--he does not need a preamp/EQ unit unless its a matter of tone (or maybe feedback). His problem with the electrical systems he's plugging into is a separate matter.

Louis

I hope we didn't overload him with info

[spoonmeyer]

Just to chime in, here's a new video of a D-18 with a K&K pure mini recorded through the BiX. The audio is a mix of the DI out from the BiX and the line out into a QSC k10, miked (just to give a sense of what it sounds like through a PA). there's no miked acoustic in the audio, it's all sound straight off the pickup.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mEqNkxJDMVA