Larrivee closing the Vancouver factory

[The Growler]

Originally Posted by JohnW63

Have you SEEN the tax burden businesses have in California ?! Many are leaving for other states. I think Texas is the one the bulk go to. If the current trends keep going, all the money will be in other states and all the government program people will be sitting in Cal wondering what happened. Of course, there might be a group formed called, PETT... People for the Ethical Treatment of Trees, and taking a saw to any tree, living or dead, will be a crime. You may laugh, but would NOT be surprised to hear that the governor signed a law to make any business that uses WOOD as part of the product pay some "Carbon Credit" to replace the trees they killed to do it.

Yes, California taxes and regulation are nuts, but governments will erase that and some to get you to move in and open or expand shop.

[epaul]

Originally Posted by JohnW63

... You may laugh, but would NOT be surprised to hear that the governor signed a law to make any business that uses WOOD as part of the product pay some "Carbon Credit" to replace the trees they killed to do it.

I'm assuming this is a hypothetical projection on your part, but, for the record, harvesting trees for guitars (and furniture and homes, etc), results in a net reduction of CO2 in the atmosphere. All plants, (which includes trees) capture and store CO2 as part of their growth process. The CO2 is stored in the roots (below ground) and in the stems, trunks and leaves (above ground). It is roughly a 50/50 split of stored CO2 above and below.

If the ground that contains the roots is not tilled aggressively, the CO2 stored in the roots remains sequestered (stored/locked up) in the ground. If the top growth is not burned or processed/decomposed, the CO2 stored in the plant's above ground tissue will also remain sequestered. And if/when fast growing young plants begin life in the space vacated by the mature plant, the consumption and storage of C02/carbon continues, often at a faster pace.

In the case of a harvested tree, if the ground containing the roots is not worked up, all the CO the tree stored there in its roots over the long course of its growing life will remain rooted in the ground. If the top growth is used as lumber (for guitars, furniture, houses) the CO2 stored in that top growth will remain sequestered in the wood itself.

Your guitar, and your table, are holding the CO2/carbon they captured during their years of growth. And as long as you don't burn or compost your guitar or table, that CO2/carbon will remain sequestered.

Granted, the harvesting of the tree releases some CO2 (chainsaws and trucks). And the twigs and scrap wood left in the woods will decompose, which will send some CO2 up to the atmosphere, but this left over litter will also pack the ground and allow a lot of the CO2/Carbon to be absorbed into the earth. And if/when a new tree (or plant of any type) begins to grow in the space vacated by the harvested tree, that vigorously growing young plant will begin sucking CO2 like a thirsty elephant.

When all is said and done, harvesting a tree will result in a net reduction of atmospheric CO2, if the ground is not aggressively tilled, if the harvested wood remains intact, and if new plant growth (of any type) occurs in the space vacated by the now gone tree.

[D35burst]

Canada's the greatest country in the world; its sad to hear youre leaving us. Good luck / Bon chance

[530]

As many have noted, this is sad news indeed. Jean Larrivee has had a profound influence on many Canadian luthiers, and a great impact on the industry as a whole in this country. Still, it probably makes sense from an economic point of view.

[Wade Hampton]

Originally Posted by Guitarfish

Well my only comment regarding Larrivee's is this, every time I've perused a Larrivee craigslist ad, I was hoping to find a made in Canada sticker. Not that I know much about Larrivee, but more so that I'm a transplanted canuck and would like a home country git..

Well, look for a "3 Series" Larrivee, then, because up to this point they've all been made in Vancouver (I don't think Jean made any of them in his previous factory location in Victoria.)

Which leads me to my next point - I can understand the regrets many of us, including me, have expressed at hearing the news that Larrivee is closing down their Vancouver plant. But before Larrivee guitars were built in Vancouver they were built in Victoria, and before that they were built back in eastern Canada somewhere, in Toronto, perhaps.

So in all fairness, Chris, comparing this to Martin leaving Nazareth, Pennsylvania is not all that apt a comparison. Those of us who've met Jean Larrivee know that, first and foremost, he's a successful businessman who's never afraid to move on. He's not a particularly sentimental guy; on the contrary, he's a clear-sighted business and creative genius.

I've stood beside him as he engaged in business discussions with people in the tonewood business and watched as he calculated what he could afford to sell individual guitars for based on what his raw material costs would be for a container-load or shipload of uncut lumber. It's like standing beside one of those mathematical geniuses who can count the cards when six decks are in use at a blackjack table in Las Vegas. He's that fast and that impressive.

So for him it's a business decision, pure and simple.

Frankly, after he opened the plant in Oxnard, I was surprised that he kept the Vancouver plant going for as long as he did, especially since he no longer had the business relationship with Guitar Center that had expanded his production numbers so dramatically during the 1990's. When that agreement was terminated there was an inevitable downturn in the number of Larrivee guitars sold, and when they aren't as many being sold, there aren't as many that need to be built, either.

Anyway, I'm hugely fond of the Larrivee guitars I own and have owned, and also very fond of every member of the Larrivee family that I've met (I never really met John Junior, though he sort of grunted at me in passing the time Matt introduced me to him.) But they're a great group of people making some fine instruments. I wish them all the best of luck but have no doubt that they'll do very well, whatever business decisions they make.


Wade Hampton Miller

[lmacmil]

Why is there nothing about this in the Vancouver newspaper or on the web via a Google search? I'm not saying it's not true, just wondering what the source of the story is.

[tadol]

I've visited both the Vancouver and Oxnard facilities, and if I had to choose a place to build and live, I'd choose Oxnard. Much more stable temp and humidity levels, and still within easy access to alot of great outdoor areas. I think most of the family is in that area, too -

I can't imagine that they're moving their tonewood operation as well. I'd guess that its just a question of getting all the building into one location. The simplicity in logistics alone should be a major cost savings. I don't think this will have any negative impact on the quantity or quality of instruments they make - it may even improve them. And they have trained so many highly regarded luthiers - there will be a very long legacy of outstanding luthiers in and around Vancouver for many decades, at least.

I'm very sure this was a well thought out decision, and I continue to wish them success, wherever they are -

[Jwills57]

Hey, Guitar Friends--I bought several Larrivee guitars in the early 1990s, really nice instruments, to keep as "keepers" so to speak. I still have them all, all made in the Vancouver factory. What fantastic guitars these are, as good as any boutique instruments being made today by anybody. At that time I think Jean and Wendy were still intimately involved with production and it shows in the quality of the wood and the the inlays and the general level of craftsmanship. My personal opinion, which I admit is probably just a prejudice, is that these earlier Larrivees are somewhat better than the later ones made in California. When my family and I visited the Vancouver factory sometime in the late 1990s, Jean was there carving braces on an OM, as I recall. He came over, greeted us warmly, and arranged a tour on the spot. We started in the inlay room, which I think was really Wendy's office, got to meet her and see her actually in the process of producing a headstock inlay. This was before all the CNC stuff, so she was sitting at a design table with a veritable toolbox of small gouges and chisels in front of her. Quite a sight. She was a lovely woman. I'm sad to hear the Vancouver factory closing, though business is business as they say. Best, Jack

[murrmac123]

Originally Posted by lmacmil

Why is there nothing about this in the Vancouver newspaper or on the web via a Google search? I'm not saying it's not true, just wondering what the source of the story is.

I was wondering exactly the same thing. Maybe the OP can enlighten us as to the source of his information ?

[Glennwillow]

Originally Posted by Jwills57

Hey, Guitar Friends--I bought several Larrivee guitars in the early 1990s, really nice instruments, to keep as "keepers" so to speak. I still have them all, all made in the Vancouver factory. What fantastic guitars these are, as good as any boutique instruments being made today by anybody. At that time I think Jean and Wendy were still intimately involved with production and it shows in the quality of the wood and the the inlays and the general level of craftsmanship. My personal opinion, which I admit is probably just a prejudice, is that these earlier Larrivees are somewhat better than the later ones made in California. When my family and I visited the Vancouver factory sometime in the late 1990s, Jean was there carving braces on an OM, as I recall. He came over, greeted us warmly, and arranged a tour on the spot. We started in the inlay room, which I think was really Wendy's office, got to meet her and see her actually in the process of producing a headstock inlay. This was before all the CNC stuff, so she was sitting at a design table with a veritable toolbox of small gouges and chisels in front of her. Quite a sight. She was a lovely woman. I'm sad to hear the Vancouver factory closing, though business is business as they say. Best, Jack

Jack,

Thanks for sharing this... Really great post!

- Glenn

[spitco]

This is just business, sometimes you have to let things go. I just hope they can keep prices down on the California made entry level Larrivee guitars. I recall all the specialty 03s being made in California anyway.

I'll put my California made Larrivee against the best of the best from any manufacturer. It holds its own.

This also might be a great time to score a Vancouver guitar on closeout.

[3 chord]

Originally Posted by D35burst

Canada's the greatest country in the world; its sad to hear youre leaving us. Good luck / Bon chance

The greatest?

[JohnM2001]

Originally Posted by 3 chord

I was born and raised in Vancouver and now live and work in the USA. I have a better standard of living here in the USA..... Canada is a nice place but I sure don't miss the taxes....

Wow, from what I've heard about the high tax burden in CA, I'm shocked that you feel that taxes are lower there than in BC. Probably just a special deal to attract their business to CA, then they'll get creamed in taxes later, when that deal runs out. I worry about much higher prices on their CA guitars, especially the 03 series.

[bmc]

Originally Posted by 3 chord

The greatest?

It's a great country. I'm proud to be from there. But, there is no "greatest" country. he should live in a few others before making such a claim.

Back on topic, I wish them well. Always sad to see a guitar manufacturer move production to another country.

[dneal]

Originally Posted by lmacmil

Why is there nothing about this in the Vancouver newspaper or on the web via a Google search? I'm not saying it's not true, just wondering what the source of the story is.

Originally Posted by murrmac123

I was wondering exactly the same thing. Maybe the OP can enlighten us as to the source of his information ?

It's on Larrivee's Facebook page.

Don't know if This link will work or not.