Why aren't new guitars set up properly?

[HodgdonExtreme]

Originally Posted by cmd612

I had an S35, and while the nut slots felt like they were half a mile too high at first, it was surprisingly easy to play after a setup. It worked the way it was supposed to, the intonation was good all the way up the neck, and the frets were level. I think I paid almost $100 for it, and it was a good buy. I ended up giving it to a beginner to learn on and did not feel like I was doing a disservice by giving her something unplayable.

I could say almost the exact same thing! I gave $120 for mine back in the year 2000. Played it for several years before I knew enough about guitars to realize it could be improved.

Gave it to my niece to start playing and didn't feel like I was giving her a complete turd...

[Big Band Guitar]

Originally Posted by HodgdonExtreme

Are there folks that prefer a high action and/or fret buzz???

I prefer a high action and the heavy side of Medium strings.

[smurph1]

Originally Posted by HodgdonExtreme

Hope I'm not starting a poop storm here, and I'm certainly not brand bashing - but I've noted that LOTS of brand new (high end guitars) at the store have a piss poor setup.

I understand that a $70 Jasmine S35 can't be expected to have a sweet setup out of the box (or ever), but it seems many guitars (even at $1000, $2000 or $3k+) have setups that leave a lot to be desired.

I was recently at GC and they were pulling a new Martin HD28 out of the box. I was kind of drooling so they handed it to me check out. The setup was terrible and the action was worse than my Jasmine was when it was new!

Generally Martins are setup a bit high at the factory because a lot of bluegrass player use them, and they strum hard. Even my little Gibson needed a bit of the bridge shaved to satisfy me. Manufacturers have to guess what a players needs are and try to find a compromise.

[RustyAxe]

A perfect setup is highly subjective. What you might love, I might hate. So ... they set them to a factory spec. To make it yours, get it set up to your specification.

[Sonics]

If you're dropping serious coinage on an instrument, then the assumptions are:

1. You know what you're doing.
2. You're VERY picky about your setup.

So you take your favorite guitar down to your tech and they will take measurement and reproduce the same setup on the new guitar. If you're thinking of spending 2K or more on an instrument, then a couple of hundred for a setup is chump change AND a good investment.

I should also add that most new guitars are shipped with a shim or shims under the saddle. So setting the action is easy. Ovations are shipped with three shims of various thickness giving, if I have my math correct, eight permutations of string height.

[fazool]

define "properly".

I am certain my guitars are set up completely opposite of others' guitars

[Jambi]

Aren't Martin's known for 'higher' action for more volume, and let's be real... their reputation as traditional guitars? I thought that was part of the Taylor appeal when they hit the market, their reputation for great playability.

I would imagine the only plus really is the increase of volume with higher action.

[Rev Roy]

Originally Posted by RustyAxe

A perfect setup is highly subjective. What you might love, I might hate. So ... they set them to a factory spec. To make it yours, get it set up to your specification.

Yep. This. I think all of the Big Three (Martin, Gibson, Taylor) PLEK now...so it's not like you are getting some haphazard setup from the factory. Then you can tweak it to your personal preference...if needed. Makes sense to me.

[Silly Moustache]

Originally Posted by Jambi

Aren't Martin's known for 'higher' action for more volume, and let's be real... their reputation as traditional guitars? I thought that was part of the Taylor appeal when they hit the market, their reputation for great playability.

I would imagine the only plus really is the increase of volume with higher action.

Yes, that was always my understanding - plus - a higher action is always easier to lower than the other way around.

I use Collings guitars who state the set up upon delivery. They are remarkably consistent.

This is what their website says:

String Height (measures top of fret to bottom of string):
Bass-side string height at 12th fret: 3/32"
Treble-side string height at 12th fret: 2/32"

Relief (measures distance from top of fret to bottom of string while fretting the 1st and 15th fret):
Relief at 5th Fret: .005" (a post-it note folded in half is about .005")

We consider these measurements to be a "medium" action height. You should have some room to lower the action from these measurements, but keep in mind that an ultra-low action usually requires lighter playing or adjusted technique to prevent buzzing. Feel free to give us a call if we can be of any help.

My first action upon getting most of mine was to have the action raised.

Martin are high volume makers - thousands pour out of their factories - there will be variations.

Also, guitars are made of wood (revelation) wood moves - esp. on new guitars. It is not unreasonable to expect a guitar to be in good order out of the box, but it is also not unreasonable to expect the necesiuty for some adjustment.

Again, without Brand bashing - I have also seen some unplayable new American made guitars "out of the box". Stopped me looking at that brand.

[Steadfastly]

From what I have seen, most music stores include a setup with the sale. Online sales, of course, can't do that.

[Rev Roy]

Originally Posted by Steadfastly

From what I have seen, most music stores include a setup with the sale. Online sales, of course, can't do that.

Actually, I've bought several guitars online that included a setup. Those were purchased from "mom & pop" stores that also sell online. My preference, though, is to play a new guitar for a week or two - and try different strings if necessary - before deciding what needs done in a setup. But when it's a freebie from the shop I just give them my standard specs...

[lowrider]

I can understand why guitars leave the factory with really high action. What I can't understand is why they leave the guitar store that way. I got my Martin X from a guy who bought it from Guitar Center and couldn't get anywhere with it. Of course he couldn't, it had a whopping 8/64 at the 12th fret. This guy was a banker in NYC. He could afford all the guitars he wanted. If GC had given him a guitar he could play, he probably would have been back for an HD28.

If I owned an independent guitar store, I'd have a big sign in the window saying ''All instruments sold here will be personally set up to your playing preferences. Come in and ask about it.''

I would set up everything from a $80 beginner guitar to a $8000 custom. Because the person buying the $80 guitar might someday come back for an $8000 guitar some day.

[Lovcom]

Sorry for sounding cynical, but could it be that guitar manufacturers are shipping non-set up guitars to retailers as an inducement to retailers to make a bit more profit by selling set ups?

[Monsoon1]

Originally Posted by HodgdonExtreme

Are there folks that prefer a high action and/or fret buzz???

this. it's an odd notion to think it would be preferred if for no other reason than how much it changes the intonation.

[Monsoon1]

Originally Posted by RP

It makes sense to me that an HD-28 is generally going to be purchased/played for bluegrass and other hard strumming applications where higher action would be desirable...

lower action doesn't prevent one from whaling away.