How do you justify the cost?

[Mikeleric]

In March of this year I started taking classical guitar lessons once a week from a guy who teaches at a small guitar store. I am not a professional musician, I work as a librarian for a living. My guitar is a Washburn c5ce classical guitar which only cost me $150 + $80 for the case + tax. It has a cutaway. Otherwise it has the "standard" dimensions of a classical guitar. I had the guitar repair guy at the store put end pins put on my guitar and I practice standing with a guitar strap but I sit most of the time I am with the teacher. Otherwise I play the way I am taught or the way you are "supposed to" play classical or classical style.

Before I consider buying a higher end guitar I would have to really justify the expense. How would I justify buying another guitar when what I have "does the job ok"? How do you avoid feeling so guilty about yourself for spending more money than necessary on something you "don't really need"?

I can hear that notes played low on the neck are out of tune compared to the same notes played higher on the neck. The action may be too high even considering that the action is supposed to be rather high at the 12th fret. Part of the bridge or saddle that the strings rest on is not lined up right with the part under it. The case is warped and part of the padding onside of it is peeling away. But I haven't decided whether I should care about any of this yet.

If the only difference between the low and high end classical guitars were the tone, and if notions about what is good and bad tone are arbitrary, then in theory why wouldn't you just declare that the tone of the low end guitars is ideal while the tone of the high end guitars is what is inferior? Yes my questions are silly but I feel I need to really justify the expense before I consider trying other guitars.

[Bluemonk]

Originally Posted by Mikeleric

If the only difference between the low and high end classical guitars were the tone, and if notions about what is good and bad tone are arbitrary, then in theory why wouldn't you just declare that the tone of the low end guitars is ideal while the tone of the high end guitars is what is inferior? Yes my questions are silly but I feel I need to really justify the expense before I consider trying other guitars.

Arbitrary and subjective are not the same thing. If you don't like liver, suddenly declaring that you do will not make it go down any easier.

[Dave T]

You have described a number of issues that are "wrong" with your Washburn. If they don't bother you (and as Mike said, declaring they are OK doesn't change the fact that they are wrong) then don't waste your money. When they bother you get a better guitar.

I can hear that notes played low on the neck are out of tune compared to the same notes played higher on the neck.

And, being out of tune is not "arbitrary".

Dave

[Ceabeceabe]

Glad you admit that your questions are silly

For example, you didn't really "need" the case you bought, and you could have got a guitar for less money than you paid.

You haven't even explained why you "need" the guitar you did purchase.

It sounds like as far as you are concerned you are not ready to get an upgrade, which is fine. Maybe the problems you mention can be solved by a new setup. But it also seems like an upgrade might improve your playing ability as well as the sound (as you hear and enjoy it). (Side note - guitars that are hard to play and produce unpleasant sounds will discourage the owner/player eventually.)

Finally, an upgrade need not be the top of the llne super expensive model that breaks your bank. It could simply be a lateral move to a specific guitar that is less banged up, sounds better, and is easier to play than the current guitar.

Good luck!

[brucefulton]

You have a rather low end classical guitar. You could continue your studies with it, but the fact that you are beginning to recognize some of its deficiencies means that you could improve and work on more advanced musical concepts with a better instrument. Unless, of course, it is the teacher who is pointing these things out and is working on commission for the store.

You will still be able to progress with what you have if you cannot afford one or choose not to upgrade at this time, at least for now. But sooner or later, if you want to advance, you will want to upgrade your instrument.

[Earwitness]

Originally Posted by brucefulton

Unless, of course, it is the teacher who is pointing these things out and is working on commission for the store.

That's kind of funny....

The main question, really, is whether you are going to keep up your new-found guitar hobby. Are you pretty motivated to play and practice? Do you see yourself still playing a year or two from now? If so, spending $800 to $1000 on any hobby--whether riding a bike or hiking or fishing or hunting or gardening or cooking or anything--is pretty normal, and you should not feel guilty, unless you flat out cannot afford it. No reason to feel guilty, plus you can resell the guitar if needed.

Not every $1000 guitar will sound and play 6X better than every $150 guitar (to you), but at the higher budget, if you choose well (for what works for you), you can get an instrument that will inspire you to practice and play much more, and more enjoyably. Money well spent, if indeed it is an every-day hobby for you.

[ocmcook]

do you analyze all your decisions? do you ever just say i like this better and i am going to buy it for myself.

[Mikeleric]

Originally Posted by Ceabeceabe

Glad you admit that your questions are silly

For example, you didn't really "need" the case you bought, and you could have got a guitar for less money than you paid.

You haven't even explained why you "need" the guitar you did purchase.

It sounds like as far as you are concerned you are not ready to get an upgrade, which is fine. Maybe the problems you mention can be solved by a new setup. But it also seems like an upgrade might improve your playing ability as well as the sound (as you hear and enjoy it). (Side note - guitars that are hard to play and produce unpleasant sounds will discourage the owner/player eventually.)

Finally, an upgrade need not be the top of the llne super expensive model that breaks your bank. It could simply be a lateral move to a specific guitar that is less banged up, sounds better, and is easier to play than the current guitar.

Good luck!

Originally Posted by ocmcook

do you analyze all your decisions? do you ever just say i like this better and i am going to buy it for myself.

I make as much money as one can expect to make after working as a librarian for two years, but when car insurance goes up to $4,319 every 6 months and you have more debt than school cost you think five times before you buy anything, although I make my payments and still manage to buy what I need or "need".

My guitar teacher didn't say anything about my guitar until I asked whether the strings are too far away from the fretboard. He said that, yeah, they could be a little lower but for now it won't make that much difference.

It is hardly worth it to pay $50 to set up a guitar that only cost $150. I started on a Gibson j50 steel stringed guitar which my dad's parents bought him when he was 13, it cost my grandparents $175 in 1962 but you have to account for inflation... but he let me have it because he had lost interest in playing but I did research and tried out some classical guitars and decided that my dad's guitar was inadequate for my "need", the highest two strings on the steel stringed guitar were too rough on my fingers and I am not aware that the classical guitar's neck is too wide. In fact now I think the steel stringed guitar's neck is too skinny and it night not have enough space between the strings. I played clarinet a little in school band as a kid and I did research and found out that my clarinet, the same model, new, in a music store, as of May, costs $1,299 or $1,300 + tax. I practice guitar almost everyday (the exact amount and of time I practice varies but I always fit in time to play, I don't have kids or cable TV), I was planning to play indefinitely.

[Bax Burgess]

Originally Posted by Mikeleric

Part of the bridge or saddle that the strings rest on is not lined up right with the part under it.

For my own edification, would you please restate that another way?

[Earwitness]

Originally Posted by Mikeleric

It is hardly worth it to pay $50 to set up a guitar that only cost $150.

Hey, I hate debt more than anything, so, especially since it seems to be a stress point for you right now, it seems like reducing debt will give you more life improvement than a better guitar. So, you convinced me.

It absolutely can be worth paying $50 to set up a $150 guitar. A lot of what makes a guitar a $150 guitar in the first place is that no one has sat down and worked with it specifically to make it playable. I bought a $150 guitar (used) for a nephew, and spend $80 (or something) on a set up and new saddle, and it definitely was worth more than when I started, especially to the one who has to be pushing those strings down.

[H165]

"How do you justify the cost? "

Easy. There is no cost ($0) the way I do it.

You can easily find a used guitar that you can buy for less than you will be able to sell it for later. There are plenty of undervalued and break-even instruments out there.

My favorite nylon is the versatile old (cypress wood) blonde Cordoba thinline Gypsy Kings. I like this ORIGINAL cypress version, and the old rosewood version. Forget the maple "reissue". This "crossover" style is increasingly popular. Here's a link to one:

http://www.vivoflamenco.com/02_Cordoba.html

As for steel strings,

There are a zillion "break even" guitars in all ranges. The much-maligned Martin D-28 and D-35 from the '70s are examples. It's true there can be some minor problems with these guitars, but if you find a used one that has been corrected and set up by Bryan Kimsey, it will still be a "break even" guitar and likely be undervalued to boot.

A large number of used Martin "16" series guitars are $0-cost guitars. They are practical, in demand, and priced right. More important, they hold their value on the used market.

[paullouisf]

How about a Cordoba C5? It seems to be well made, and I think it plays and sounds good - For $300. I am considering buying one as a first guitar for classical music.

[AcornHouse]

The bottom line is:
A better guitar is easier to play than one with issues.
A better guitar will sound better than a lesser quality one.
A better guitar will make you WANT to play it more.

With the availability of so many guitars from so many marketplaces (AGF, 'Bay, Reverb, CL, etc...), it is much easier to find a better guitar in whatever budget you have.

But, if you don't feel comfortable with spending the $, then the time isn't right, yet.

[jdmulli]

Why not? If you like playing and you can afford a nicer instrument, why not buy one? If you can afford an upgraded guitar and aren't shirking away from other financial responsibilities, why not? I do not subscribe to the "you only live once" as an excuse to do stupid things, but you do only live once -- you might as well play a nice guitar. (That's what I tell my wife, anyways.)

[Rodger Knox]

Originally Posted by Mikeleric

Before I consider buying a higher end guitar I would have to really justify the expense. How would I justify buying another guitar when what I have "does the job ok"? How do you avoid feeling so guilty about yourself for spending more money than necessary on something you "don't really need"?

As long as that second sentence is true, you can't really justify the expense.
At some point, as your skills improve, your idea of "does the job ok" will require a better instrument.