Standard vs. Alternate Tunings

[Davis Webb]

Originally Posted by jpd

Great post and even greater responses. J.D.

Absolutely. This is AGF at its finest, very informative question and responses.

[JoeCharter]

Originally Posted by donh

:-)

I am done with teachers at this point, finding that so many of them spent more time limiting me by telling me what I *had* to do or what I *shouldn't* do or how things *have* to be played. Good teachers open doors rather than close them.

When I walked away from standard tuning for a while I found I could go chasing how to play things musically and with fun - I had also walked away from the crappy-teacher limitations.

Last Sunday evening I played all night in standard and had a ball. First time I'd done that in about a year - strange the paths we take, eh? Open tunings open doors for me, your mileage may vary.

For classical music you probably want a more conservative teacher -- but otherwise I agree that the teacher should approach the student with an open mind. As evidenced by the diversity of guitar music, there are so many different playing styles. The steel string guitar is (and should be) one of the most "open minded" instruments -- and it's a great thing.

The deeper one goes into the musical journey, the more one understands that being opinionated about certain topics (such as this one) is counter productive. As long as the end result is satisfying to the player, and pleasant to the audience, nothing else matters.

[JonPR]

EADGBE is a compromise tuning that's evolved to make most things reasonably easy, and not too many things too difficult. Nothing is particularly easy in EADGBE, but neither is much very difficult.

The fact that it's in 4ths (with one major 3rd) is to enable every note of a scale to be within reach in any one position. Ie, wherever you are, you have 3 scale notes per string (2 on one), and can run up and down a scale without having to move your hand or stretch too far.

It's related to (and probably evolved from) lute tuning, which has the major 3rd between the middle 2 strings, but is otherwise in 4ths. (Lute has a shorter scale length, but the 3-scale-notes-per-string would also have dictated that tuning.)

(Smaller instruments like violin and mandolin are tuned in 5ths, because they're short enough to let you stretch to 4 scale notes on one string.)

The reason for that major 3rd (which bedevils guitarists trying to learn scale patterns) is no doubt to make the outer strings the same note (E on guitars), and to aid tuning by ear. It also makes barre chords practical, because more strings at the same fret will be in the same chord, so can be held by the index.
(Tuning all in 4ths makes scale patterns regular and simple, but makes chords harder, because full barres are less practical. Tuning in 3rds makes most chords a lot easier - because chords are built in 3rds of course - but limits the scale notes available in any one position; you only have 2 per string.)

Alternate tunings are always about making just one (or maybe two) keys much easier, and putting up with the others becoming more difficult (hence the popularity of capos ).
Sometimes - as with arrangements of classical pieces written for other instruments - they are about making one piece easier to play.

They also make for a good deal of open string resonance, which is one of the main attractions. You won't find people in alternate tunings using barre chords nearly as much as those in EADGBE; because they want to maximise that beautiful resonance of open roots and (usually) 5ths. (An exception would be open chord tunings, like open D or G, where easy 1-fret barres produce other major chords.)

Those resonant open strings also encourage the invention of new chord forms, unusual harmonies, often using 2nds and 4ths rather than 3rds. (Eg, John Martyn)

[clintj]

This thread has been a delightful read. One more common use I can think of for alternate tunings is slide work, for the same reason that was mentioned above: easy access to chords using a barre (or slide) across the fretboard.

[RevGeo]

Whoever it was that stuck that major third interval between the 3rd and 2nd string deserves our undying gratitude. As was stated earlier, tuning in straight fourths makes for easy scale runs, but that major third sure makes chords one hell of a lot easier to finger. It also facilitates blues runs and licks, which have been extremely popular since the late 1890s or so.
Personally I think the beginning guitarist should learn standard tuning first and then go to the open tunings - probably open D and then open G. To me those tunings are specialty tunings that make slide playing w-a-a-y easier and are great for country, bluegrass and folk tunes. And, of course, just about every cool Keith Richards lick since '68 or so.
One of the beautiful things about fretted stringed instruments is their ability to be played very musically with a variety of tunings. One could spend a lifetime on standard tuning alone, but open tunings literally open a whole new world of guitar playing.

Rev George

[callouses]

I can't add any more knowledge to this discussion, I read a lot of good stuff that I agree with, but I just wanted to add that many players have influenced my playing a great deal. I had a teacher for 2 yrs, back in '65 or so, Tommy Flint, who wrote the Mel Bay books. I believe I heard somewhere that he was Merle Travis' cousin. Anyway, he taught me fingerstyle, solo chording, scales, modes, etc. Then I wanted to learn from listening to Clapton, Page, Duane,etc.Thanks to my early training, I could figure out a lot of what I was hearing, but not everything. I have to work hard for every bit of progress I make. So standard is usually enough of a challenge for me. Sometimes I dabble with open g or drop d, but I'm mainly a standard guy. Doesn't stop me from admiring Mckee, or Dufore, they are simply amazing. What I'm saying is, I think we can all learn from each other, if we pay attention, and don't let ourselves be close-minded.

[RappahannockRag]

Originally Posted by geordie

OK, here's what I do when making (writing) and “placing” a piece of music on the guitar.
1} Come up with a melody – this might mean adjusting the intervals between the strings the melody is on. This may suggest a “tuning” for step {2}
2} Decide where i'm going to play the melodic line, which strings and where on the f/board.
3} Start to figure out what harmonies / suite the melody (mood), these can be simple open -ringing strings and retune these strings to “fall in” with what you require and what's doable.
4} Work out bass / drone / pedal notes and retune as step {3}
Steps 2 / 3 don't always HAVE to be played together or separately, it's what “fits” the overall mood and feel of what you want the effect of the piece to be.
5} Work at bringing it all together. This can come together almost by it's self, more so with experience of working this way or it may require “moving” the whole tuning towards the treble side or toward the bass, the simplest example to explain this is to think of a tune you might play in Open D but the fingering / intervals available don't give you enough bass so you would “move” the intervalic relationship toward the treble side, the fingering / chord shapes remain the same only one string over and it gives an extra bass note to work with, I did this with “Sovay's Tune” I play on youtube.

Thanks for sharing this. When it comes to writing (or "composing" if I can embelish my abilities a little!) in open tunings I have always used the opposite approach of tuning up and THEN exploring to find melodies, riffs, and licks that fit the tuning. Certainly nothing wrong with that, and it can generate a lot of ideas. But, coming up with a melody first and THEN fitting or modifying the tuning to it just makes so much sense.

[JoeCharter]

Originally Posted by JonPR

Those resonant open strings also encourage the invention of new chord forms, unusual harmonies, often using 2nds and 4ths rather than 3rds. (Eg, John Martyn)

That pretty much covers it.

The key word here is "encourage". Yes, one could potentially play anything in any tuning (or almost) -- but different tunings do "encourage" different harmonies indeed.