Music Theory, Skipping It

[3notes]

I just posted this paragraph in another thread but thought it to be a good question. What are your thoughts on this...

I personally don't like learning music theory. It racks my brain. That said, I do enjoy learning scales yet, I know very few. Mostly movable scales. But what keeps it interesting for me is thinking of half steps and whole steps. By doing, or thinking in these terms it has helped me discover, for example, one string solos. So when I hit a note in a scale I know I can move up or down by either a half or a whole step and the note will work. And sometimes you can squeeze in a note that is off by a half step but still make it work, which sort of creates tension that can be resolved.

I hope this makes sense to you all. Is this method logical, for lack of a better term.??

I absolutely agree with your approach, it was mine for years.

However, as I have often said and will again, it depends on your goals. If you want to be a studio guitarist, this will serve you minimally depending upon the genre. If you want to play in a Broadway pit band, it wont serve you at all. If you want to accompany your own singing, or play in a rock band or simply for your own enjoyment, sure go ahead.

It does have the additional benefit of forcing you to develop your ear.

[3notes]

Nice reply. But thank God I play for my own enjoyment.!!

Anyone who fully understands theory is an Einstein to me.

The sky is the limit for those who understand it and man, I sure wish I did.

[amyFB]

I propose to say that thinking about note movements in half or whole steps is a component of music theory.
So, like it or not, I think the subconscious picks up at least some of what you consciously skip over.

However you get to your musical goals is really the important point and its different for each of us.

[Mandobart]

I started out learning classical violin as a child and despite what you may think or what is common practice now, I was not taught any theory. The main thing was to learn to read music and where the notes are that the dots describe. And of course follow the conductor and have steady rhythm. I wasn't even really aware that music theory, as a discipline, existed. By the end of junior high I had already learned violin, bluegrass fiddle, guitar and bass guitar well enough to perform publicly. So I completely ignored learning theory specifically for the next 25 years.

When I started studying theory about 10 years ago, two things struck me:
1. The rate at which I could learn and retain new songs tripled.
2. I actually already knew a modest amount of theory, I just didn't know I knew it until I knew what to call it.

[vindibona1]

Music theory has many aspects to it. One thing that I think is essential, either in formal or informal terms is root progressions. Secondarily, it think it is important for any musician to learn the major scales and minimally how many sharps and flats are used for each major key and the corresponding notes on the fingerboard at least in 1st position. Once you know those two elements of music theory everything else can come as second nature. The basic chords generally tend to move with the rules of root progression (I is often followed by IV or V, sometimes VI, less often II or III, etc). Modes are built off of the major scale in each key. With those few things in hand you can go a long way without knowing much more theory.

Edit: One more thing... Just playing a lot of songs will teach you more theory than you realize. I recall when I walked into college Music Theory, having had NONE before, I saw the professor put stuff on the board and thought to myself "Oh... that's what they call it". I already knew it. I just didn't have a label for it and didn't realize there was an actual rule for it. Because of guitar playing Theory 101 was a breeze.

[1neeto]

I didn’t care about music theory until recently. It really helps when you start to understand how music works.

[Guitar Slim II]

Well, my eyebrows certainly shot up when I read this topic title. I'm a big believer in understanding harmony.

But I think the OP is on the right track, actually. Give it a miss for now, no point "studying" it if you aren't using it. Learn the fretboard first...

It's an advantage guitar has over single-line instruments. It's a full-range, fully functional polyphonic instrument. If you play chords and scales (we all do), you're learning something about harmony just by default. Keep learning how to actually do stuff on the fretboard, and look at how this stuff connects.Harmony is all about seeing the connections.

For example: that one note that changes major to minor; or the chords that always seem to go together or follow each other; or the way certain scale patterns line up with the barre chords of a song...

After you've played for a while and figured out the fretboard a bit, I think studying it in a more formal way will make more sense and pay bigger dividends.

[Mr. Jelly]

I have to wonder why the OP is playing scales. If it is fun for that person and that is all they want to do well then okay. People do learn songs and even entertain without knowing any theory. If they want to play those scales in a type of song or with somebody then knowing the first stages of theory would be the best thing to do. Rudimentary theory is not that hard really. All you need to do is find somebody or sight that just sticks to the basics. Often when people get into theory they go off into rocket science for some reason. It's like asking someone what time it is and they start explaining how to make a watch.

[Big Band Guitar]

I have been playing guitar for over 50 years.

I am currently enrolled in our local community college music program.

The guitar instruction, theory, ear training, sight singing, and piano are kicking open doors in my head I didn't know were there.

I have a long way to go but the more I learn about music the more I want to learn.

Studying music is a lot harder than playing music.

Learning from people who know how to teach it in the right sequence is the way to go.

It is not for everybody but it seems to be working for me.

[mr. beaumont]

Thoughts:

1. All scales are "moveable"

2. What you're doing is "theory," you're just doing it the hard way

[3notes]

Originally Posted by Mr. Jelly

I have to wonder why the OP is playing scales. If it is fun for that person and that is all they want to do well then okay. People do learn songs and even entertain without knowing any theory. If they want to play those scales in a type of song or with somebody then knowing the first stages of theory would be the best thing to do. Rudimentary theory is not that hard really. All you need to do is find somebody or sight that just sticks to the basics. Often when people get into theory they go off into rocket science for some reason. It's like asking someone what time it is and they start explaining how to make a watch.

OP here. With all due respect, your reply is unclear to me. Why does anyone play scales.?? I play them because I find original melody's from them. And, I play them as practice. It gets my fingers moving before I play anything meaningful. And by the way, I have many original melody's. They are music to my ears. I enjoy them. My teacher enjoys them, too.

Just for the record... I've been playing for over 10 years but, I only have basic knowledge of music theory. My goal is to put 2 notes together that are pleasing to the ear. Sometimes, in the end, there are 72 notes(or, pick a number other than 2) put together that are pleasing to the ear. And that my friend becomes a song. Or, a melody.

So, there's your answer as to why I play scales.

Why do you play scales.?? I assume for the same reason. Or, maybe you play lead guitar.?? I sometimes play scales, or parts of them, over rhythm tracks.

Sorry if I offended you. It wasn't my intent. I simply didn't understand the reply.

[tonyo]

It racks my brain.

I can certainly relate to that statement. I've avoided theory (including scales) up till a few months ago. When I did read books on theory, I'd be fascinated by what I was learning which only lasted a couple of pages and then my brain would go to mush.

Attended a 'master guitar workshop' earlier this year. It was well over my head, yet that was the trigger for me to decide to embrace theory (and scales) rather than avoiding them.

As I explained to my wife, when I meet with people who know theory, they have a conversation that I cannot understand or engage in. And I'm loving music so much I want to be able to engage in such a conversation (both musically and verbally).

I'm really having a ball embracing theory and scales and learning so much.

Having said all of that, to anyone who doesn't want to embrace either, and enjoys the playing of songs, I say power to you and don't let anyone try to convince you that you must do anything else.

[SunnyDee]

Originally Posted by 3notes

I just posted this paragraph in another thread but thought it to be a good question. What are your thoughts on this...

I personally don't like learning music theory. It racks my brain. That said, I do enjoy learning scales yet, I know very few. Mostly movable scales. But what keeps it interesting for me is thinking of half steps and whole steps. By doing, or thinking in these terms it has helped me discover, for example, one string solos. So when I hit a note in a scale I know I can move up or down by either a half or a whole step and the note will work. And sometimes you can squeeze in a note that is off by a half step but still make it work, which sort of creates tension that can be resolved.

I hope this makes sense to you all. Is this method logical, for lack of a better term.??

We're all thinking in half steps and whole steps, we just know that all the scales are made of different patterns of half and whole steps and that some combinations of steps have specific names and purposes. Like 3 half steps is a minor 3rd and 4 half steps is a major third and the minor and major 3rd is the difference between a minor and major chord. Stuff like that. I like to know what's going on and what people are talking about, like tonyo, so I learned it. And, yeah, they're all movable because the patterns repeat up and down the fretboard.

[3notes]

Originally Posted by tonyo

I can certainly relate to that statement. I've avoided theory (including scales) up till a few months ago. When I did read books on theory, I'd be fascinated by what I was learning which only lasted a couple of pages and then my brain would go to mush.

Attended a 'master guitar workshop' earlier this year. It was well over my head, yet that was the trigger for me to decide to embrace theory (and scales) rather than avoiding them.

As I explained to my wife, when I meet with people who know theory, they have a conversation that I cannot understand or engage in. And I'm loving music so much I want to be able to engage in such a conversation (both musically and verbally).

I'm really having a ball embracing theory and scales and learning so much.

Having said all of that, to anyone who doesn't want to embrace either, and enjoys the playing of songs, I say power to you and don't let anyone try to convince you that you must do anything else.

Nice post. It seems I'm always considering to embrace it. Good for you in doing so. I think it would be rewarding.

I haven't totally disregarded music theory. I can handle it in small doses. Over the years I have come to understand a portion of it. To me it makes no sense to learn it in lessons. I'd rather learn it by taking a night class or a course.