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  #1  
Old 08-03-2017, 03:33 PM
jonbutcheraxis jonbutcheraxis is offline
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Default What's your cureent fave acoustic pu system ?

Am looking to pick up a Martin GC-MMV, wondering what currently made acoustic pu systems get the most love in terms of reproducing the sound of the guitar. I understand well the down sides of piezo pickups, am hoping to come across some new knowledge.
What are you using - K&K, LR Baggs or... ?
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  #2  
Old 08-03-2017, 03:40 PM
Tico Tico is offline
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The DPA VO-4099G, made in Denmark.
It's a professional-level minature condenser shotgun supercardioid that clips on to your guitar.
I reinforce the clip with a bit of gaffer tape.

It sounds exactly like the acoustic guitar.
Exactly.

Pricey @ $619, and you have to plug into something that supplies +48v phantom power.

Best guitar pick up I know of, it is widely used in high-end classical venues that can afford any gear they want.
With other $35 clips it attaches it to a zillion other instruments.

Truly studio quality ... which saves money when it's time to buy a fine mic for recording.
Takes 10 seconds to move it to your other guitars.
Got 4 guitars? buy 1 PU instead of 4 ... also saves money.

EQ and suppress feedback by simply changing its angle or position on the tiny gooseneck. No need to reach down to a pedal to turn knobs.

https://www.sweetwater.com/store/det...iABEgJRsPD_BwE

If you insist on something permanently installed into your guitar (can't imagine why) I like my LR Baggs Lyric which I bought before I found out about the DPA.
It has none of that hideous piezo quack because it is also a condenser mic that gets glued to the bridge plate.
Very natural sound, and the phantom power comes from a 9v battery.
Only $199.

The DPA is over 3 times the price but IMO way worth the investment.
I use it everywhere, even for busking.

You get the sonic benefit of a high-end studio mic on a stand without being handcuffed to a mic stand.

Last edited by Tico; 08-03-2017 at 04:18 PM.
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Old 08-03-2017, 04:15 PM
ChrisE ChrisE is offline
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I've been using the LR Baggs Lyric and it sounds great. I even installed it myself in my D-18 and I'm not really known as a handyman (just ask my wife).
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Old 08-03-2017, 04:18 PM
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martingitdave martingitdave is offline
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Default What's your cureent fave acoustic pu system ?



Here are my thoughts in a very abbreviated format.
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Last edited by martingitdave; 08-04-2017 at 09:19 AM.
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Old 08-03-2017, 04:28 PM
Tico Tico is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by martingitdave View Post


Here are my thoughts in a very abbreviated format.
No bass for LR Baggs Lyric?
Nonsense!

Nearly all under-saddle piezo PUs boost the bass to unnaturally high levels.
Everyone has gotten used to that.
The natural frequency response of the unamplified acoustic guitar is long-forgotten or ignored.

The Lyric is relatively accurate so people miss that artificially-boosted bass they've become accustomed to.

It is common for people, who finally hear truly flat mics or speakers, to say "Dude, that sounds like crap. Uh, man, it doesn't kick me in the chest with thundering bass like my $39 gear does. What a rip off."
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Old 08-03-2017, 04:30 PM
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martingitdave martingitdave is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tico View Post
No bass for LR Baggs Lyric?
Nonsense!

Nearly all under-saddle piezo PUs boost the bass to unnaturally high levels.
Everyone has gotten used to that.
The natural frequency response of the unamplified acoustic guitar is long-forgotten or ignored.

The Lyric is relatively accurate so people miss that artificially-boosted bass they've become accustomed to.

It is common for people, when finally hear truly flat mics, to say "Dude, that sounds like crap. Uh, man, it doesn't kick me in the chest with thundering bass like my $39 mic does. What a rip off."
It's just an opinion. But, yes, the Lyric rolls off everything under 160 Hz to prevent howling feedback. No bass. :-) I did make a few errors in my chart with respect to Lyric installation. Didn't mean to copy from above.
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Old 08-03-2017, 04:34 PM
lt20dbl lt20dbl is offline
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I've used bridgeplate pickups (K&k or Mcintyre)with a Fishman pro eq II Preamp for years. Happy with the sound. Don't care if it's the best.
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Old 08-03-2017, 04:35 PM
merlin666 merlin666 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by martingitdave View Post
Here are my thoughts in a very abbreviated format.
That is a very nice table. Though I prefer a pure unamplified acoustic tone, I also have Ovation and Adamas A/E guitars that I could plug in if needed - I wonder how they would fit into these criteria.
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Old 08-03-2017, 04:42 PM
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martingitdave martingitdave is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by merlin666 View Post
That is a very nice table. Though I prefer a pure unamplified acoustic tone, I also have Ovation and Adamas A/E guitars that I could plug in if needed - I wonder how they would fit into these criteria.
A few fellow AGFers asked to add to my table. So, I'm sharing the spreadsheet with them. We will probably make a new thread and share the details. That way we can subject ourselves to hurling insults and rotten fruit. Fun!
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Old 08-03-2017, 04:43 PM
Tico Tico is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by martingitdave View Post
It's just an opinion. But, yes, the Lyric rolls off everything under 160 Hz to prevent howling feedback. No bass. ... .
I'm a left brain guy, more thinking and analytic than feeling and emotional.
That's why I question your statement, "the Lyric rolls off everything under 160 Hz ".

That is not what a spec sheet would say.
It would state the frequency response is X dB down at Y frequency, then Z dB down at Y/2 frequency.


What's your source for your claim, "the Lyric rolls off everything under 160 Hz"?
I didn't find that on LR Bagg's website.
I confess my source for claiming people have just gotten used to piezos boosting bass is personal experience/opinion.
I've done zero research.

Last edited by Tico; 08-03-2017 at 04:56 PM.
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Old 08-03-2017, 04:43 PM
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martingitdave martingitdave is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by lt20dbl View Post
I've used bridgeplate pickups (K&k or Mcintyre)with a Fishman pro eq II Preamp for years. Happy with the sound. Don't care if it's the best.
Many would agree. K.I.S.S. principle applies. Also, the 80/20 rule. The K&K systems get you about 80% of the tone with about 20% of the gobbledygook inside your guitar. :-)
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  #12  
Old 08-03-2017, 04:58 PM
Tico Tico is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by martingitdave View Post
Many would agree. K.I.S.S. principle applies. Also, the 80/20 rule. The K&K systems get you about 80% of the tone with about 20% of the gobbledygook inside your guitar. :-)
That said, I'd judge the DPA to follow a 99/0 rule.
99% of the best tone possible from any transducer with 0% of the gobbleygook inside your guitar since the DPA is all external and clips on.

As to the K.I.S.S. part.
5 seconds to clip on is much more simple than installing anything in side of a guitar.
No comment about the stupid part.
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Old 08-03-2017, 05:00 PM
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martingitdave martingitdave is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tico View Post
I'm a left brain guy, more thinking and analytic than feeling and emotional.
That's why I question your statement, "the Lyric rolls off everything under 160 Hz ".

That is not what a spec sheet would say.
It would state the frequency response is X dB down at Y frequency, then Z dB down at Y/2 frequency.


What's your source for your claim, "the Lyric rolls off everything under 160 Hz"?
I didn't find that on LR Bagg's website.
I'll look it up. I believe it was a video of a discussion with one of the endorsers. There are many posts on AGF of people complaining about the Lyric's lack of bass (and mid range honk) compared to pickups and other microphones. You can hear it in their demo videos when they use large diaphragm mics and the Lyric in an A/B. Still it's a great product for some guitars.

I recognize we might all be wrong, and the Lyric might be the most accurate reproduction. But, it didn't meet my expectations - or, evidently the expectations of others. You can't EQ frequencies that aren't there. I actually bought it twice and tried installing in 4 different guitars. The results were the same in 3 (disappointing) and good in another. None of this is absolute fact. I couched it as my opinion in the heading.

But, these opinions are based on my own time, effort, money, and experience. I didn't include anything I didn't personally install and/or test. I'm a tragically left brained engineer as well.
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  #14  
Old 08-03-2017, 05:19 PM
Goodallboy Goodallboy is offline
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Baggs Lyric here and the no bass comment is not my experience. It has adequate bass response and more importantly, a far better than average acoustic sound.
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  #15  
Old 08-03-2017, 05:20 PM
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martingitdave martingitdave is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tico View Post
That said, I'd judge the DPA to follow a 99/0 rule.
99% of the best tone possible from any transducer with 0% of the gobbleygook inside your guitar since the DPA is all external and clips on.

As to the K.I.S.S. part.
5 seconds to clip on is much more simple than installing anything in side of a guitar.
No comment about the stupid part.

No disagreement there. That DPA mic is excellent. It is not, however, a pickup. LOL
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C.F. Martin Spruce/Rosewood Dreadnoughts (6 and 12 Strings)
Fishman and K&K Pickups
Mackie and HK Audio Amplification

"Lift your head and smile at trouble." "You'll find happiness someday."
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