Bose weirdness?

[jjbigfly]

Our trip uses a Bose L-1 classic, and it sounds fine. Wanted to try something else and was advised that what we had wad good, might be best to leave it alone. So we have....
As is normal, we always set it up behind us, dial it in for where we happen to be and go at it. Last time we played out and returned to out practice place we set the Bose up in FRONT of us, about 15 ' away and pointing back back to us. It sounds super, but different. Seems more clear and accurate (if that is the right term). Both the other members agree that it does sound better. For myself, I find that I am singing better as I am hearing little things I have not noticed before. Same with my guitar. I am going to be depressed when we play out again and have to turn it around.....
Any thoughts or advice here?

[Cochese]

I used the original Bose for 5 years and it's a nice system. First off, the human ear by virtue of it's design hears best when we are facing the sound source or it is at our side (like head phones, ear buds etc...)

The problem with the Bose system is that when you use it to simultaneously cover the playing area and use it as a monitor it has some limitations. As I recall the ideal place to be was about 7 feet in front and not directly in front of the tower. At that distance if you need to run it at higher volumes in a bigger room it will be too loud. In some tight spaces you have to be too close to it and that can make the sound less clear and muffled. It's just the physics of speaker placement. Also, Bose recommends every musician should have their own system. I found with that system when I tried to use it with two or more people using it, I found it quite lacking.

I've found that having some distance from any mains system will always sound better. Sometimes this requires bringing a monitor though.

Ours is an L1C, and we did do the behind placement, but room restrictions and weird stage assignments being what they are in some places, we have gone to setting it up to the side, usually at a rough 45 degree angle so we get the FOH sound as well as the audience.

[Cochese]

Part of the reason I sold mine and moved on was there were too many times where space was tight and the Bose form factor worked against the situation. Plus, when performing in a crowded room and I was set up on the floor the system just can't cut through. The singer in my band has 2 of the RCF Evox 8 systems and we use those sometimes for low volume gigs. They are a step up from the Bose but quite pricey.

In the end no matter what system you use, it's always a good idea to have a separate monitor on hand for those times when you can't be situated ideally.

[Stratcat77]

Originally Posted by jjbigfly

I find that I am singing better as I am hearing little things I have not noticed before. Same with my guitar.

I recently bought the LD Maui 11 G2 array system. I've played one gig with it. I'll try it out again this weekend on a gig. I was happy with what it does, but can appreciate your observation. My other system that I've used for years is a pair of Mackie SRM 450s as mains and a JBL EON10 as a monitor. My hearing is not good and having that JBL cranked pointed up at me has been so nice so I can clearly hear exactly what I'm doing. I was hoping that with the new Maui, I can have a much simpler setup with no need for a monitor. We'll see.

Last gig, I had the Maui set up just a couple of feet behind and to the side. So it was plenty loud, but as was mentioned, it's a different sound from behind or the side vs coming straight at you.

[Stratcat77]

Originally Posted by Cochese

In the end no matter what system you use, it's always a good idea to have a separate monitor on hand for those times when you can't be situated ideally.

I'm thinking this will be something I do. Those little JBL EON10s are so small and powerful. I'll just keep one in the Jeep and have it handy if needed!

[Cochese]

Not to dis on the Bose. What happened to me was I realized I needed a monitor and bought a QSC K10 when it first came out to use as a monitor with the Bose system. I was at a gig and didn't need the monitor so I did a set with the Bose and the next set I just stuck the K10 on a table and was running my break music through it. It sounded great so I finished the gig with the K10 and bought another and finally sold the Bose. Most gigs I can get by with one K10 for small rooms and either use the other as a floor wedge or a little Mackie SRM150.

To me the Bose was great in really small venues where you're really close to the patrons. That system doesn't "hurt" if you're close unless it's stupid loud. I get around that with the QSC's by placing them off axis in problematic rooms. I also like the Bose for direct electric guitar. In a perfect world you would probably have a few systems. There is no one system that works for every situation.

[Gutch]

I've been using the Bose L1 system since 2005 -- First the original L1, then moved to the L1 Model II 3 or 4 years ago. I'm primarily a solo singer/songwriter style performer, but occasionally have a buddy sit in with me. Acoustic guitar and vocals, with electric and acoustic guitar when playing as a duo.

With all the talk lately about new systems here, I decided to do a little research with the thought of moving away from the Bose. Checked out a variety of options from several companies -- Powered speakers/mixer, mixer/power amp/passive speakers, Line array style. Brands included QSC, Line 6, Fishman, Mackie, JBL, Crown, etc.

End result -- They all have their pros & cons, but none of them proved to be an overall clear improvement over my Bose L1 Model II w/ two B1 cabs and a T1 mixer. The biggest issue for me with the separate components (taking sound quality out of the equation) was stringing power and signal cables all over the performance area and having to use an additional monitor in front of me to be able to hear myself clearly. The Bose setup requires a single power line to the base and a single ethernet cable from the mixer to the speaker. Clean and simple.

Re: Sound Quality -- Being close to the Bose system's bass cabs does accentuate the low freqs as compared to what the audience hears, but I've adapted to that over the years. There are also times in close quarters when I need to tweak my playing position to minimize feedback issues from the mic. Again, 12 years of experience with the system has helped me know what to do.

After all of this, the decision was made to keep the Bose and appreciate what it does for my style of performance. As is often the case in life, I've found that the grass is no greener on the other side of the fence.

Good luck in your quest!

[jseth]

I've used the Bose rigs for 8 years or so at this point... as anyone who has read my replies on the subject would know, I am a HUGE fan of the Bose L1 systems...

One thing I have noticed is that having the tower fairly near to my playing position negates the "magic" that happens when the system has enough room behind and away from me... for some rooms, it just isn't possible to get the unit 8-12 feet away from my performing spot...

The design of the thing seems to "want" some space for the sound to "bloom" before the line-array aspect kicks in fully.

Funny, I STILL have to remind myself of how full and even the coverage of that PA is; my kneejerk reaction is to place the tower where it's more centered to the "target area" I'm trying to reach... truth is, ANYWHERE in that 180 degree swath will give me the same volume and tone; trusting that lets me forget about much of the knowledge I accrued using "point and shoot" PA systems...

[kramster]

Been using the Bose since they first came out... have a Bose Compact that I use now and also picked up a Center Point Space Station to try out especially for piano/keys.

[mikemo6string]

In regards to the original post... I agree that we evaluate the sound better when we're facing the source. I used the Bose L1 Classic for years, and it certainly performed well over that time. Like all systems, there were situations that showed its limitations. That's true for any portable PA. I eventually went to an amp facing me, and a DI out to the Bose. And I set up the Bose in front (or just to the side) of me.

We can get used to the sound source behind us, of course. And it can sound great. I've used the Bose, Fishman SA220 and the new Fishman SA330x w/sub and expander that way. As an aside, that new Fishman SA330x is great. I borrowed one for a couple of weeks, and it's a brilliant compromise between sound and simplicity. I do prefer, however, to play with a good sounding monitor/amp/something pointed back at me. It just sounds better to me, and, more importantly, I can tweak things for me, to bring out the best performance on stage.

The Bose is designed to be an all-in-one, main and monitor system. It can sound great that way. After years of both traditional PA set-ups, and "mini line arrays," I can work with either. But I'd like to have that nice sounding amp or monitor facing me. And that generally necessitates more gear, more hauling, set up and break down. It doesn't stop me from looking for something better sounding and more portable, though!

[Cochese]

Bose idea that the L1 type system can serve as both a monitor and mains is not well thought out. It can work in low volume situations but in crowded or bigger venues the volume required to satisfy the audience will overwhelm the performer. Also the idea that every musician has their own system is very costly and impractical. Good for Bose though. The cost of 5 systems for a five piece band would buy you a much better system with money to spare.

Plus when the system breaks down (and they do break down) if all you have is that the gig is over. That was the other part of my rationale for getting a QSC K10 as a monitor.