Stereo Acoustic guitar recording

[azbluesplayer]

Good day Bob,
Think I,m starting to understand. Like seeing these microphone shoot out with untreated rooms, doors open, yet they sound awesome. Would have to say it's from manipulation of the music I suppose if it,s so critical to have your room acoustically sound, yet seeing a lot of microphone shoot outs and the room is untreated, doors open, etc. Yet their recordings sound awesome! Think finally get it, took a few weeks of reading, checking videos, checking specs from manufacturers. Think I will just stay with my shure beta,s 57/58a,s concentrate on the room for now.
Cheers,

sounds great not looking very treated the room, hmmmm

Here's one that sounds good not a shoot out but showing off the Mic's for Mojave
You think wow if they can sound so good outside, that's what you and Fran and others have been trying to tell me about these shoot out videos, software manipulation.
Thx think I got it now!
Cheers,

[Bob Womack]

Originally Posted by Bob Womack

You know, one sleepless night I thought about this and came up with this solution:
...pic..
I turned the array on its side. Think about it: The mic doesn't care which way it is oriented. As it turns out, I wasn't the first to come up with this mic'ing scheme and I'm not all that surprised. I understand that one of my old engineering influences, George Massenburg, is credited with first using a vertical mic array on guitars. You don't suppose some mention of this from a magazine article was floating around in my brain and came out, do you? -snip-
Bob

Originally Posted by Ty Ford

Good for you! George Massenburg thought of that some years ago. -snip-

Darn that fine print!

Bob

[rick-slo]

Originally Posted by azbluesplayer

Good day Bob,
Think I,m starting to understand. Like seeing these microphone shoot out with untreated rooms, doors open, yet they sound awesome. Would have to say it's from manipulation of the music I suppose if it,s so critical to have your room acoustically sound, yet seeing a lot of microphone shoot outs and the room is untreated, doors open, etc. Yet their recordings sound awesome! Think finally get it, took a few weeks of reading, checking videos, checking specs from manufacturers. Think I will just stay with my shure beta,s 57/58a,s concentrate on the room for now.
Cheers,

sounds great not looking very treated the room, hmmmm

Here's one that sounds good not a shoot out but showing off the Mic's for Mojave
You think wow if they can sound so good outside, that's what you and Fran and others have been trying to tell me about these shoot out videos, software manipulation.
Thx think I got it now!
Cheers,

Neither of those youtubes are great examples. On the first the guitar was doubled and panned. The second has a nice outdoor visual but the recording was not done there.

For a good sound do use some condenser mike(s) on the guitar (not dynamic mikes).

[azbluesplayer]

Rick would you say it,s better to mic the guitar with a condenser mic vs playing the acoustic through a amp and put two mic,s on the cab? I know since being disabled due to my back cannot hold or play my guitar since June! So to keep my sanity picked up playing the harp. I have played the harp with guitar as fills since in my teens.

Would a condenser mic or ribbon mic be better for the harp as well Rick? Was hoping to buy a good large condenser mic and a ribbon mic to record with both. Currently still using my work horses shure beta 57/58a which are dynamics and use them only to mic the 2x12 cab. I do use both the dynamic Mic's on the harmonica as well at times.

Thx Rick for the info, thats kind of why I,m looking for a good mic for recording my harmonica for studio, have mic,s for playing live already for the harp, JT-30cm, shaker dynamic, shaker retro. A lot of music chains, forums were suggesting a ribbon mic. After getting some other comments concerning buying a high dollar ribbon or condenser mic won,t make much of a difference that a cheap mic will record just as good. The main thing that needs to be done first is treating the space.

So have given up on buying a mic, figure its like throwing money out the window I,m being told until this is done. So, started on planning to get what I need, oh my god, running into the very same issue I just did with Mic,s!!! Being told you have to use fiberglass to absorb, no that won,t work you have to use pyramid foam no that won,t work you have to buy the London sound adsorption kits that will work, enough to make your head spin!!
I was excited when someone turned me on to this foam but being told this will not work need fiberglass instead or London kits more $$$ I see other studios with this foam, was told with the foam it will kill the highs n lows where fiberglass won,t. Bummed!

http://www.ebay.com/itm/111319097927

So at this point I,m not buying anything or doing anything. Will invest the next weeks to month reading all the opinions and videos to decide for myself. To get the most correct solution. Seems listening to videos do zero good I,m finding when everyone manipulates the videos. Only way I would know to test better is hands on. To be like some of you lucky folks that get Mic's somehow to test hands on free?

So more reading, asking, trial n errors are surely ahead. Feeling pretty frustrated but will never give up, just another learning lesson in life. Live and learn and appreciate what you have, you never know when you could lose it.

[rick-slo]

I have never sent an acoustic through an amp and then miked the amp, so I have no advice on that.

Room acoustics first and then recording gear, or recording gear and then room acoustics. It is somewhat a circular thing since judging each involves the other. Regarding recording gear, there is lots of previous threads on good reasonably priced choices. Regarding room treatment, I chose to use panels from ATS Acoustics.

[azbluesplayer]

Thx Rick cool will keep on living n learning until the journey is over

[Rhode123]

You should deffo try ORTF as well, one of the other techniques I like.

[Fran Guidry]

Originally Posted by Fretz1

Hi guys i've got a question

When using the XY (or other true stereo techniques such as ORFT not in the same position however) technique to mic up an acoustic guitar I roughly place them around 7 inches from the 12th fret but the problem is one mic is louder than the other. I'm just following what people generally say on the internet how they mic using XY. So i'm wondering what is the correct way to balance the mics properly?

My mics are Oktava mk012 matched pair into Steinberg mr816x recording onto 2 mono tracks so I can adjust it if I want to later.

1. Do you just boost the quieter mic (Seemed to sound a little unnatural? when done in cubase with clip gain)
2. or do you move the microphones around to balance levels naturally? (Move both microphones on a stereo bar together around)
3. or do you turn up the preamp till it's balanced? (adds a little more preamp noise to one side which also seems to sound little odd)

Thanks
...

I use option 2. Use a pair of closed back headphones, crank the level, and rotate the XY (or other) array to get the left/right balance you prefer.

But don't get stuck on "inches off the 12th fret" - when I was first introduced to that placement it was intended for strummed acoustic rhythm, not solo fingerstyle. It seems to have become the universal recommendation for miking acoustic guitars by the process of internet memerization. There are a very large number of possible placements, and somewhere out there in front of the guitar your magic sound is waiting.

Fran

Originally Posted by Bob Womack

You know, one sleepless night I thought about this and came up with this solution:



I turned the array on its side. Think about it: The mic doesn't care which way it is oriented. As it turns out, I wasn't the first to come up with this mic'ing scheme and I'm not all that surprised. I understand that one of my old engineering influences, George Massenburg, is credited with first using a vertical mic array on guitars. You don't suppose some mention of this from a magazine article was floating around in my brain and came out, do you?

I use a 7" spaced pair config and aim it at the neck/body joint from about 01-14" and it sounds marvelous, offering a wide soundstage, a strong center image, and no phase issues. The technical term for this is a "near-coincident array."

Bob

That exactly what my engineering friend did when he recorded me playing solo acoustic guitar at his studio. Turned out nice. I do use mid-side when I record at home though.