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Old 11-17-2012, 06:43 PM
gfsark gfsark is offline
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Default MAC or PC?: getting started on home recording

I almost bought a Firewire based preamp for my PC, a Gateway DX4831. I discovered that it only has a Firewire 400 connection, and the device needed 800 (if memory serves me.) Also it only has one PCI ex16 slot which is taken by a graphics processor.

Also, it seems that I should really have a faster processor to manage quality audio recording, without bogging the system down. Another app I use (Dragon Naturally Speaking) is an incredible resource hog, and needs a quad processor for decent performance.

So I may being looking for a new desktop for home recording studio. It seems that Apple has the edge for musicians, but I don't have much experience, this is theoretical for me right now. Would you strongly recommend Apple or will a beefed up PC be just fine?

Thanks for your help.
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Old 11-17-2012, 07:35 PM
sachi sachi is offline
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Dragon is an outlier. I don't record but from what I've read, any plain old Mac or PC can handle the CPU needs of recording.

That said, if you're looking at a desktop, on the Mac side you could look at the Mac Mini. They can be quite powerful, particularly if you max out the RAM. With the Mini you'd be able to use your current monitor and keyboard as well. I can't advise on a good PC desktop, I'm afraid; my only PC is an older laptop.
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Old 11-17-2012, 08:42 PM
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Firewire 800 is backwards compatible. Firewire 400 already has all the speed and bandwidth you will ever need. Your computer is also fast enough for recording.
If you get a new computer a Mac or PC will work fine. Make sure it will be quiet. I prefer a PC myself, but that is for other reasons besides recording issues.
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Old 11-18-2012, 08:46 AM
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As stated above all you would need for your current computer would be a 400 to 800 firewire cable, with a 400 conector one end and an 800 conector on the other

If you are dead set on a new computer and for a slight bit more (future proof,) you might want to get one with a built in Thunderbolt connection also.

If your going to use it for music only or primarily I prefer Mac ,for three reasons.
One: the OS generally takes 1 to 2 less steps to navigate around in.

Two: Macs are almost never prone to malware and virus problems, also the mac automatically defragging (by the way in which it archives files). Which is one reason they can run a bit lower bus speed and still perform at the same level. Because when archiving and then retrieving a file, the Mac goes to only one location on the drive, as opposed to a PC slotting multiple pieces of a file in multiple locations that then all have gone to in order to retrieve a file.

Three:This I suspect is also why in general all things being equal macs are also less prone to lock ups or crashes. Which does happen but in my experience some 70% to 90% less often.
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Old 11-18-2012, 11:26 AM
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You don't need a lot of CPU power for audio unless you plan to use lots of digital effects plugins, software synths, samplers, etc. A simple setup with a reverb bus and some EQ won't tax the system. If that's all you need, almost any CPU, old or new, is up to the task of recording multi-track audio.

Check the RAM requirements of the software you plan to use. Again, you need more if you plan to load big sample libraries.

Mac and Apogee Duet is a great combination. The Duet is has very good pres - only two channels though.

I'd choose Mac over PC any day although, myself, I'm a linux guy. JACK gives you a solid, low-latency platform for audio work and there's a very good linux DAW: Ardour/Mixbus. Main drawback on linux is that you don't have so much choice for low to mid range interfaces. The M-Audio Delta cards work very well, as does the RME Multiface. If you're looking for something high-end, the RME AES card is supported.

If you're planning to do a lot of complicated (hardware) audio routing, RME monitoring mixer software, Totalmix, is maybe the best on offer on any platform.
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Old 11-18-2012, 07:38 PM
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This may be of help to ya....

http://tweakheadz.com/Mac_vs_Pc_DAWS.htm
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Old 11-18-2012, 08:32 PM
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Let me raise an issue which is tangential to what you asked, but really relevant.....

You might actually be happier with a stand alone recording device rather than recording directly to your computer using a computer interface.

I started out with a Presonus Firebox that I hooked up to a Mac laptop running GarageBand. I found this cumbersome and annoying in a variety of ways:
- My computer was loud (the fan would kick in - fan noise was getting to be a BIG deal in our recording attempts).
- I'd have to shut down other software before recording to guard against gaps in my recordings (here is an example of what can happen - note how the recording sort of skips at 20 seconds: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xe7WxFURuQU ).
- Fiddling with menus and such in software to start things up and control the recording process was awkward.
- Also, unless you have a computer dedicated to recording you have to hook things up to your computer each time you sit down to record.

When I decided that we needed more than 2 microphone inputs and needed to upgrade I decided to go with a stand alone device and take the laptop out of the recording process. There are a variety of options. I chose the Zoom R24, mostly because it supplies phantom power to a large number of microphones at once (6 microphones), but you may not need anything this fancy. The Zoom is great. You can create a new project by pressing just a few buttons, and then you can start and stop your recording, review what you recorded, etc with simple clicks of buttons. The Zoom records on a standard SD card (and will accept up to a 32 GB card), and transfer of your files to a computer for processing is a snap (either use a USB cable or pop the card into a card reader - on my Mac laptop there is actually an SD card slot built in).

This being said, there are plenty of people who use computer interfaces and record directly to computers. And some deal with the fan noise issue by putting the computer in an adjacent room and using long cables - they start up the recording and then go into the recording space in the adjacent room and record (perhaps with a door closed between them and their computer). I found these issues to be big hassles that kept me from recording as much as I otherwise would have, but not everyone is as bothered by these issues as much as I am. You may or may not be bothered by these things, but these are definitely things to think about before committing to recording hardware of a particular sort.
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Old 11-18-2012, 08:40 PM
wcap wcap is offline
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Another nice thing about stand alone recording devices is that they tend to be more portable than a computer+interface system (especially if you are using a desktop computer). I've taken our Zoom to church to record there, for example.
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Old 11-19-2012, 08:08 AM
theotigno theotigno is offline
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I have done recordings on both. I started on Macs a long time ago as a graphic designer / illustrator so I'm really familiar with it. The last two computers I purchased are Windows machines.

The one thing that I am curious to see is how the release of Windows 8 is going to affect recording programs / hardware compatibility / etc. From that end, I would lean toward the Mac.

Another reason I'd lean toward the Mac is that it has a built-in analog to digital converter that is pretty decent. I had one on my iMac from a long time ago ...



A friend of mine who was a recording engineer listened to what I was getting from my stereo preamp into the mini-pin input and he thought it sounded fine (usable but not phenomenal). If you're looking at "usable" results, you can just get a Mac Mini without getting any input hardware.

One other case for the Mac is that it comes with Garageband standard which is a decent program if you're not doing anything too intense. I used Pro Tools at work and Cubase at home, but when I got a newer Mac at the time that came with Garageband, I thought I'd give it a shot. There were some limitations, but the newer versions have addressed that and it's a fairly decent program. Once again, the program comes free with the computer so no extra cost needed.

If those things aren't a factor and you wanted multiple inputs, etc., I would still lean toward the Mac mainly because of the questions on the new Windows 8 and hardware integration between those who are building the computers.
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Old 11-19-2012, 08:54 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by gfsark View Post
...Also, it seems that I should really have a faster processor to manage quality audio recording, without bogging the system down.
Hi gfsark...

I operated a studio on a single 550mhz processor with firewire 400 and recorded as many as 12 channels simultaneously, and played back 28 for mixing down tracks once without a hitch.

The bulk of our recording over the 8 years was done 1 or 2 tracks at a time, with only an occasional use of a 3rd or 4th mic/input. I could easily limit myself to 2 tracks at a time. You will not likely not overextend any current computer or interface, even if only using USB 2 or 3.

Today's computers are easily able to manage audio recording without a hitch, and keep the latency down to imperceptible levels.

I'm another Mac guy (since 1988) but have seen/heard great work done on PCs as well.

Hope this helps...

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Old 11-20-2012, 10:26 AM
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I'll be another guy who picks none of the above. I run a Yamaha 12 channel USB mixer into my desktop running Linux, using Audacity to record with. Once I got everything playing nice, I get some pretty good results. Linux is a rather lean OS, so I have a lot of reserve computing power. I want to upgrade to an actual firewire audio interface so I can multitrack for recording drums, but that's a 'someday' thing. Interfaces that can handle at least 7 XLR inputs get expensive real fast.
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Old 11-20-2012, 11:43 AM
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A second-hand Multiface I (older model) can often be picked up cheap on ebay. No pres but otherwise it's a versatile little box with 8 analogue I/O, ADAT and SPDIF. Works flawlessly in linux.
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Old 11-20-2012, 11:58 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by gfsark View Post
I may being looking for a new desktop for home recording studio. It seems that Apple has the edge for musicians, but I don't have much experience, this is theoretical for me right now. Would you strongly recommend Apple or will a beefed up PC be just fine?
Something to think about...will you be recording in the same room as the computer? If so, find something without noisy fans.

My solution was to replace a very loud PC with a Mac Mini...it's relatively cheap considering you can use the monitor, keyboard, mouse and external devices you already have, and is absolutely silent. If you're not wanting to change operating systems then you can dual boot (or use VirtualBox or a commercial virtualizer) to use whatever OS you want...

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Old 11-20-2012, 12:27 PM
sachi sachi is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by clintj View Post
I'll be another guy who picks none of the above. I run a Yamaha 12 channel USB mixer into my desktop running Linux, using Audacity to record with.
Which distribution are you using? I have been trying out Ubuntu and Mint for a few years. Mint is more functional (it's designed to be, of course) but I'm very impressed with the clean GUI of the most recent Ubuntu.
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Old 11-20-2012, 05:27 PM
gfsark gfsark is offline
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And an oft mentioned problem with the Firewire interface on a typical PC is that the Firewire chipset needs to be a TI (Texas Instrument) chipset or you get all kinds of weird problems coming in. My desktop uses some other chipset (VLI), and I don't have a suitable slot to add a PCI card, so that pretty much settles that.

It appears that the USB 2.0 is about as fast as Firewire 400, so I think that this should work. I'd rather make do with the computer that I have, and get the recording side set up. As far as what that should be, will be the subject of a couple more posts. Thanks to you all.
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