Why do you feel that American made guitars are the best?

[Tony Burns]

unfortunately it is a hard question to answer .
High end and Quality instruments can and do come from all countries in the world .This is a hard cold fact .
sad to say -when a company( from your country )goes to a poor nation country and states that they want to buy less costly guitars to resell -their are alot of small foreign companies that are willing to meet that need - If were willing to pay more from these countries, we get better instruments .
In other words you get what you pay for . look at China , you can buy guitars from Eastman, bluridge and Guild -of good quality and then you can buy a 50 dollar guitar wall hanger from these same countries . ( again you get what you pay for - most of the time ) i believe that many of these people in third world countries are basically slaves -youtube video is very abundant with these videos -which is sad and true --I stay away from these companies -for human rights reasons - like Cort guitars in Korea ( i believe they also make low cost Fender acoustics and electrics )
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=80-OTYLX2dA

[Rmz76]

Originally Posted by Riverwolf

(oops, I hit post before I was finished but basically I did not want a poll. Just your reasons, not for why you buy American, but for believing that they are the best guitars.)

I am seriously perplexed by the continuous ongoing banter of the American Vs. foreign acoustic guitar builders threads.

Do you feel that only American factories are capable of building quality guitars?

Nope. My all solid wood Blueridge reminds me of that every day.

Do you feel that foreign country (yes, we are mostly talking Asian) builders are simply not capable, not as skilled as the American factories and workers?

Building a quality product isn't just about a single skill. It's about skill in a variety of techniques, using premium grade materials and processes. When you find Asian builders going through all those riguous steps and using the quality materials you end up with a guitar like the Eastman E20SS. I doubt anyone here would argue with you, it's a great guitar. It also has a street price of around $1200 USD new. Much less expensive than it's American Gibson J-45 Custom counterpart, but in the end it's a bit misplaced in the market. Coming out of the American Gibson Montana factory it's nearest competitor is the J-15 priced at $1499. The J-15 has a less expensive Sitka Spruce top and less expensive Walnut back and sides but it does come with a quality LR Baggs pickup system. To add the same pickup to the Eastman E20SS (with labor) will bring the price up to about the same.

So how are these two doing in the market? Gibson sells a lot more J-15s than Eastman sells E20SS guitars. Brand name is worth something. I've owned both of these guitars and ended up selling both of them, but I can tell you I think the Eastman has a better voice... No one cares. The focus is it's not a Gibson. The Eastman wasn't built with their historic molds and techniques.

With acoustics, tradition is actually worth something to a lot of people for different reasons. Some subjective, I would argue some not so subjective but the bottom line is the history associated with certain brands and certain models is something you just can't replicate anywhere. If C.F. Martin wanted to build D28s in China, Martin could start a factory there. Martin could send some of their best folks to get processes going. They could build the same D28 and sell it for less but it wouldn't be a $200 guitar or even a $800 guitar it would still cost you quite a bit. Moving it overseas would take away some of the magic because a lot of buyers are aware of the companies rich history rooted in Americana and when people shell out money for a product the amount they are willing to pay is usually tied to a feeling.

Do you feel that the foreign builders basically dummy their skills down to capture the lower market?

Used this example in another thread, but compare the Indonesian built Epiphone Hummingbird ($329 USD) to the USA built Gibson Hummingbird Pro ($2799 USD). The Epiphone workers building their model Hummingbird have a different check list, different set of materials to work with, etc... They purposely building an inferior product that does not have the same quality woods, hardware, finish, inlaywork, etc... Less attention is put into the bracing/voicing of the guitar. They are built cheap and quick because they have to be in order to pump them out at a certain build cost. It's not built to compete with the USA built Hummingbird Pro, it's built to be a loss cost replica that appeals to someone with around $300 USD to spend.

It's hard to say if the builders are "dummying down" their skills. If work in other factories building quality guitars using more demanding techniques and more riguous Quality standards then yes they are not utilizing their potential as workers, they are simply doing their assembly line job as the builder demands they do it to get the product out

Why is it that a bottom level American guitar can be considered so great and an import only "bang for the buck", or above it's paygrade?

See the long paragraph under the second quote... It's all about the lure certain iconic builders have and certain brands having a reputation. There is sort of a mysticism to it. But I think plenty of working musicians are opting for quality Asian build guitars. I've seen more pro players playing Epiphone Masterbuilt acoustics than I have J-15s. Takamine still has a following and several endorsers (Bruce Springsteen and Garth Brooks aren't small fries).

So it's not a universal thing. There's a spirit of anti-nationalism that's bubbled up. I take strong issue with someone who says "No you can't have pride in a product being built locally". It's perfectly alright to have that pride in products built in your local community or by your country. You can have that pride and also feel quality guitars are built in Asia. My Chinese built all solid wood Blueridge gets the same respect from me as my Gibson and it gets even more play time than my Martin.

[Basalt Beach]

I own guitars which my ears and hands select and not my eyes on where the label says the guitar is made. I do not have any of the feelings you describe towards overseas guitar makers.

[pickinray]

Originally Posted by Riverwolf

And the vast majority of forum members at least the "older folk" do think this way. It is all too obvious by the threads.

I find this remark to be somewhat "ageist" in nature.

[frankmcr]

For playing bluegrass, blues, general US traditional music, I'd prefer a guitar made in the US.

If I wanted to play flamenco, I'd prefer a guitar made in Spain.

Classical guitar - still Spain by a little, but other parts of Europe, and Japan, would also be very much in the running.

Just because of all the accumulated knowledge that's been passed down, and the study that's been devoted, in different parts of the world to different instruments.

There isn't any great mystery about it, is there?

If I wanted a balalaika I'd try & seek out a Russian one.

[220volt]

American economy and ability for an entrepreneur with a good idea to create a successful business fast, was a major attraction for many European luthiers and violin makers in 1800 and 1900's. So everyone who was ever serious about building guitars immigrated to the US, cementing a foundation on what's to become the greatest guitar market in the world. C.F. Martin was probably the best example of this.
Once things took off here, other countries simply did not have the resources or time for R&D required to get anything as serious and quality going, leaving a big gap in market share and quality as well. However, with technology and new innovations in guitar making that gap is closing fast, for sure. Especially Asian market.

I am assuming you are talking about steel string guitars. Classical guitar is a totally different beast, where Europeans were superior for a long time, and the US now is closing the gap. Just as the Europe and Asia are closing the gap on steel strings market.

When technology levels out the playing field, there will come time, where country of origin will not matter. We're not there yet in my opinion.

[rwmct]

Originally Posted by Rmz76

With acoustics, tradition is actually worth something to a lot of people for different reasons. Some subjective, I would argue some not so subjective but the bottom line is the history associated with certain brands and certain models is something you just can't replicate anywhere.

This ^

And that does not mean that I won't buy a foreign made guitar. I am not rich. I have to make compromises here and there. But my "good" guitar is a Guild made about ten miles from my house, and the guitars on my "wish list" are Guilds, Gibsons and Martins. It is not just the tone and playability. It is a cultural thing, too.

If two guitars are of the same quality and sound, and one is a Guild, Gibson or Martin, and the other is something else, I want the Guild, Gibson or Martin, if I can afford to buy it. When I think of an acoustic guitar, those are the brands I think of.

[rwmct]

Originally Posted by pickinray

I find this remark to be ageist and offensive. It's getting ugly.

I disagree, and I very much recognize myself in the words you quoted. It is not "ageist" to recognize that many older posters, by and large, have differing views on some things than many younger posters, by and large.

I don't get offended when somebody points this out, just like I don't get offended when the ads or images for a particular store or the music on a particular radio station indicate that they no longer are aiming at my business. (An example comes to mind is "Abercrombie & Fitch" which was kind of a preppy store with rep ties, jackets, button down shirts, etc. I have a leather jacket I bought there almost thirty years ago, still in decent shape. They changed their focus completely, kicked their prior customers to the curb. Worked for a while .)

Its just how things go, IMO.

[handers]

Originally Posted by alnico5

I like to support my own country. Is that hard to understand?

That's laudable but not what the OP asked.

Steel string guitars have a much greater prominence and higher build numbers in US. Martin, Gibson, Fender and others.

But if u look at the classical guitar builders, most of the most sought after guitars are not American. Historically there were two schools, Spanish and German. New builder schools have grown in Australia and Scandinavia with great builders in US also. Building a great classical is said to be more difficult than a great steel string. I think much of the differences in countries has to do with history and commerce, not regional abilities

Hans

[BoneDigger]

Although I have gravitated more toward American made Guild and Martin guitars recently, I have a soft spot for Blueridge guitars, which are made in China. I played a Blueridge BR180A at the local shop the other day that was absolutely PHENOMENAL in terms of tone and fit/finish. It is just a great guitar. The price also was only $1100, which is much less than comparable American made guitars.

The real issue with Asian guitars (aside from maybe Yairi) is the big hit you take if you resale them later. They simply do not hold their value as well as an American guitar. But, by the same token. I would still lose less money on a $1100 Blueridge than I would on a $3000 Martin, so it's kind of a toss up.

I just happen to be a big fan of Guild guitars and I like Martin as well.

[gitarro]

You have a good point in that companies like martin and Gibson have got a long history of building guitars with the tone that fits well with American style guitar music. In fact martin and Gibson have not only made guitars for American music but their guitars have actually influenced the development and shape and sound of American music itself. That is also why small shop builders in Europe such as Lowden, mcilroy and Avalon and solo luthiers like sobell have different sound profiles altogether which they do best.

Having said that, luthiers such as Ralph Bown in the UK and Blazer and Henkes in Germany and Bagnasco & casati in Italy and per marklund in sweden are said to be able to build a traditional Martin or Gibson sound just as well as American luthiers.

Originally Posted by frankmcr

For playing bluegrass, blues, general US traditional music, I'd prefer a guitar made in the US.

If I wanted to play flamenco, I'd prefer a guitar made in Spain.

Classical guitar - still Spain by a little, but other parts of Europe, and Japan, would also be very much in the running.

Just because of all the accumulated knowledge that's been passed down, and the study that's been devoted, in different parts of the world to different instruments.

There isn't any great mystery about it, is there?

If I wanted a balalaika I'd try & seek out a Russian one.

[TBman]

Well ...

Gibson - USA
Martin D-16GT - USA
Guild D-55 - USA
Larrivee - Canada
Seagull - Canada
Alvarez - China
Republic Tricone - Asia

They are all made well. I never bothered to find out where the Alvarez or Republic were made until now. They both look and play fine.

[Highway_61]

I find all of this thinly veiled political banter very disturbing, and I am even more disturbed that the moderators/owners won't curtail it.
This is supposed to be a place to talk about guitars--that which, very clearly, we all have in common--it's not supposed be a place that puts a klieg light glow on those things that separate us.

I think the problem started when a sponsor started that--whether intentional or not--pernicious "35% thread," and not wanting to offend a sponsor that thread was allowed to continue until it metastasized in to all these other similar threads.

I'll probably get banned, so I will be proactive and just quit the forum.

AGF was a place where I could escape the pervasiveness of political idiocy, and now that bit of escape has been compromised, perhaps destroyed.

It was great while it lasted. Thank you for all of the guitar-related insight I gained here.
Adieu.

[BoneDigger]

Originally Posted by Highway_61

I find all of this thinly veiled political banter very disturbing, and I am even more disturbed that the moderators/owners won't curtail it.
This is supposed to be a place to talk about guitars--that which, very clearly, we all have in common--it's not supposed be a place that puts a klieg light glow on those things that separate us.

I think the problem started when a sponsor started that--whether intentional or not--pernicious "35% thread," and not wanting to offend a sponsor that thread was allowed to continue until it metastasized in to all these other similar threads.

I'll probably get banned, so I will be proactive and just quit the forum.

AGF was a place where I could escape the pervasiveness of political idiocy, and now that bit of escape has been compromised, perhaps destroyed.

It was great while it lasted. Thank you for all of the guitar-related insight I gained here.
Adieu.

Or, you could just not read those threads.

Todd

[AgentKooper]

Since the OP mainly seems to be talking about US-made versus Asian-made guitars, and since I own a Martin and a couple Blueridges, I'll weigh in. I'm a US citizen, but I have no inherent bias toward American products. I'll buy any quality product from anywhere. I like my Blueridges a lot. So why did I eventually decide to buy a Martin? Partly because it's an iconic brand and set the standard for acoustic guitar design over the past century. Partly because I really admire the idea of a family business that can stay at the top of the game for 5 generations. I don't necessarily care that it happens to be an American family business (though started by immigrants, it should be noted). I just don't know of any, for example, Chinese families that have been making top quality guitars for 150 years. Not saying such a family doesn't or couldn't exist - I just don't know about them.

Partly I just wanted to see what the fuss was about.

I do have to the say that my Martin outshines my Blueridges. Tone is subjective, but I prefer my Martin's tone, mainly for its comparative richness and sustain. That's not to say my Blueridges don't sound good too.

Build quality is more objective. The Blueridges are definitely well-made, but the Martin is a clear step above, from the wood selection to the build quality to the finish. (Except for the fact that Martin still apparently can't be bothered to make the end pin and bridge pins fit right from the factory -- what's up with that??)

So from my very limited sample size, my US-made guitar is better than my Asian-made guitars. Not because people who work in the Martin factory have any inherent superior ability, but because that particular factory has been in operation for generations, which would seem likely to produce a greater institutional ability to produce finer guitars. That, plus the fact that I don't think most Asian manufacturers are even trying to produce the equivalent of a standard series Martin -- their goal seems to be to produce an affordable alternative for good value, which they are succeeding quite well at, with some difference in overall quality to be expected as a tradeoff.