Why my guitar gently weeps - The slow, secret death of the six-string electric guitar

[Watt]

Originally Posted by rogthefrog

Jack White
Ed Sheeran
John Mayer
Taylor Swift
Julian Lage
Guthrie Govan
Tosin Abasi
Andy McKee
Synyster Gates
Claudio Sanchez
Derek Trucks
Calum Graham
Joe Bonamassa

Gruhn just isn't paying attention. Not knowing them doesn't mean they don't exist and inspire millions to pick up the guitar, just like Clapton and Page did.

The main difference is they're not dominating TV and radio like they did in the 70s, because TV and radio don't matter anymore. And they don't wear tight leather or spandex pants.

But these are absolutely guitar gods to the listening public.

I don't disagree, though I think that there is also a definitional problem here. Swift, Sheeran, and Mayer are immensely popular and are therefore influencing multitudes, just as Eric Clanton and others did in the 60s and 70s. Still, I would hesitate to call them "guitar gods". It's not a question of their proficiency; they are singers who accompany themselves on guitar. And because of their popularity, lots of kids are taking up guitar. In that sense, I suppose you could give them the label. Now to me, someone like Julian Lage is a guitar god. But what he possesses in skill (and inspiration to me) he lacks in influence on the market. Millions of kids aren't running out to buy guitars because of Julian.

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[Watt]

Adding to my last comment, my 20 year old daughter is heavily influenced by modern fingerstyle players like Sungha Jung. The 18 year old draws inspiration from Elliot Smith and other guitar-playing singer-songwriters. So I'd agree that the problems with the guitar business can't be attributed to the lack of inspiring performers.

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[KevWind]

Originally Posted by rogthefrog

Jack White
Ed Sheeran
John Mayer
Taylor Swift
Julian Lage
Guthrie Govan
Tosin Abasi
Andy McKee
Synyster Gates
Claudio Sanchez
Derek Trucks
Calum Graham
Joe Bonamassa

Gruhn just isn't paying attention. Not knowing them doesn't mean they don't exist and inspire millions to pick up the guitar, just like Clapton and Page did.

The main difference is they're not dominating TV and radio like they did in the 70s, because TV and radio don't matter anymore. And they don't wear tight leather or spandex pants.

But these are absolutely guitar gods to the listening public.

Except of course Gruhn most assuredly does know of them . And to clarify your extolling them as "guitar gods" is simply your opinion and does not convert to what Gruhn is talking about in influencing the relationship to sales . They are exceptionally talented but they do not command the kind of overwhelming universal national attention that leads to a boom in guitar sales. If they did guitar sales would be increasing not flat.

Your observation about distribution of music no longer being dominated by the radio and tv is absolutely correct and exactly why they are not the "Guitar Hero's" Gruhn is talking about " they do not command the legions of followers that go out and buy a guitar.... If they did GUITAR SALES WOULD BE EXPANDING..... NOT STATIC FOR OVER 12 YEARS

[F512]

I believe it's a cyclical thing. Rock n' roll always had an element of danger and excitement, but popular guitar-based music has not been that way for awhile now. People like John Mayer or Ed Sheeran are about as edgy as Kenny G. Actually, I'm pretty sure they are 'less edgy' than Kenny G at this point.

Kids will always want something different than what their parents are into and what was once 'rebellious and different' eventually becomes music for advertisements. Right now hip hop is dominating commercial radio. It too will become old-fashioned at some point as other genres/styles come to the fore. It certainly has not helped that Clear Channel has essentially replaced radio's role in introducing new music to the masses with a set playlist of songs that are twenty and thirty years old.

Guitar playing is way too fun and satisfying in a tactile sense and in a way that can't be achieved with drum machines or typing some beats up in Ableton. It will have it's resurgences as long as music is a facet of popular culture. We just have to wait out the dry spells.

[Scotso]

I will touch the 3rd rail. Rock, in all its forms, is dead and buried. Personally I am waiting for something new and interesting to come along. I doubt it is rock and I am probably too old to appreciate it when it hits. But we need something that makes an entire generation go crazy.

[M19]

For the first (and only) time ever, my wife and I watched the final few episodes of "The Voice" because local guy Jesse was on it (and being hyped by the local NBC affiliate's news program). Jesse was the only "real" musician on the slate, and played a pretty good electric. He came in fourth of 4.

[rogthefrog]

Originally Posted by Scotso

I will touch the 3rd rail. Rock, in all its forms, is dead and buried. Personally I am waiting for something new and interesting to come along. I doubt it is rock and I am probably too old to appreciate it when it hits. But we need something that makes an entire generation go crazy.

Except it's not. Neither dead nor buried. Just look on YouTube some time and follow a trail of "recommended" or "similar" videos.

Led Zeppelin style rock? Sure, that's been dead and buried for 35 years now. But things change. Rock has changed. I listen to new "rock" music all the time.

[Scotso]

Never said there was not rock music but rock does not inspire the younger gens like it once did

http://www.billboard.com/charts/hot-100

no rock anywhere in the top 10..week after week..pop, hip hop, rap, even country. Even Coldplay sounds pop ballady. Rock is a non event as a driving force in popular music. It is a rare event to see rock in the top 10- unlike any previous decade since the 50s.

[Marley]

Sales have been static since 2005. Possibly like many other items, ebay has a hand in it. How many guitars do you think have been sold on ebay since 2005? I know I've bought at least 5 and have sold 3 others. If the sales at the big stores has been the same for the past 12 year and you include all of the ebay sales, amazon.com and other non-traditional places, maybe the electric guitar is selling pretty well. Lord knows that they've built enough of them in the past 20 years.
Come to think of it, the last guitar I bought at a guitar store was my PRS and that was in 1997. I haven't bought one from a guitar store since but somehow I've acquired about 15 more guitars in the past 20 years.

[RussL30]

Originally Posted by rogthefrog

Except it's not. Neither dead nor buried. Just look on YouTube some time and follow a trail of "recommended" or "similar" videos.

Led Zeppelin style rock? Sure, that's been dead and buried for 35 years now. But things change. Rock has changed. I listen to new "rock" music all the time.

Not saying your wrong, but can you give some examples of this new "rock" music you listen to?

[Yamaha Man]

I like playing "If It Makes You Happy" by Sheryl Crow. That's a fun and easy song to play on the guitar.

Just because new guitar sales are down, doesn't mean people aren't buying guitars...there seems to be a very active market on eBay and Reverb.com of used guitars...I know I have more guitars now than I've ever had, and that's a good thing.....

[FrankHudson]

Originally Posted by Scotso

Never said there was not rock music but rock does not inspire the younger gens like it once did

http://www.billboard.com/charts/hot-100

no rock anywhere in the top 10..week after week..pop, hip hop, rap, even country. Even Coldplay sounds pop ballady. Rock is a non event as a driving force in popular music. It is a rare event to see rock in the top 10- unlike any previous decade since the 50s.

Rock'n'Roll always was a hybrid set of forms, just as its super-set "popular music" in America has always been. The modern difference is that compared to the later 20th Century there are many more artists, distributing their work through many more channels, to an audience that is more fragmented in what they listen too, and for whom (as a whole) music is not as assured to be their predominant entertainment source.

Assuming you are (like most here from what we know) are somewhere in the "Boomer" demographic, think about that Top 40 radio of your youth. Was it all "rock"?

Moving on to the "guitar gods" issue.

The issue for "guitar gods" or "rock stars" is that we now have many more artists chasing a smaller audience that is much more siloed in what they listen too. Let's take Jack White for example, as he lead off one list already given of modern "guitar gods".

He should be on such a list. He had hit records (to the degree we still have hits like we did in the 20th Century, which is relative). He pioneered a style. I can hear something in a blindfold test and say "that sounds like Jack White." He even helped revive an obsolete guitar model. He has every check mark a "guitar hero, god, rock star" etc needs to be on such a list.

First off, he gets helped by having his first record issued in the 20th Century when things we still in transition. But still, who listens to his work and looks forward to his next project to drop? As many as listened to Peter Frampton or James Taylor in the 70s? As many who listened to Cream or the Beatles in the 60's? As many listened to Kurt Cobain or Pearl Jam in the 90s? As many who listened to Van Halen or the Police in the 80s?

And as to the interest in what's about to drop? How many projects did any of the above artists or drop per decade? As singles artists, the Beatles are the only group you would have to take your shoes off to count, because by the 70s we measured things in album-sized chunks where maybe 5 records a decade was par. Does anyone but a Jack White-obsessed super fan know how many projects Jack White has dropped in the last 10 years? The market is casual, novelty driven, and based on listening not owning.

And who even listens? Every person interested in popular music (which would be the overwhelming majority of many late 20th century youth cohorts)? Of course not. Hell, indie rock fans don't even all listen, some thinking him inauthentic. And guitar geeks don't all listen (too sloppy a player, or none of his styles match their own favorite sub-styles). If you were to split hairs, not everyone thought even the Beatles were 100% cool, and each of the above decade-representing acts had their detractors, but it's more fractured now, and here's the kicker: if you don't want to hear Jack White, you can structure your music listening life so that you won't hear Jack White. Just hit that "don't like" button or avoid any playlists that sully your listening with Jack White.

I know this rambled a bit, sorry 'bout that.

[s2y]

I've always thought of Jack White as the guitar anti-hero. His pitchy guitar bends, pawn shop guitar sounds, and squeaky vocals reminded me of a lot of bad amateur auditions ~20 years ago. I was baffled that his style caught on. He made 90's grunge rock sound over processed.

[KevWind]

Originally Posted by Marley

Sales have been static since 2005. Possibly like many other items, ebay has a hand in it. How many guitars do you think have been sold on ebay since 2005? I know I've bought at least 5 and have sold 3 others. If the sales at the big stores has been the same for the past 12 year and you include all of the ebay sales, amazon.com and other non-traditional places, maybe the electric guitar is selling pretty well. Lord knows that they've built enough of them in the past 20 years.
Come to think of it, the last guitar I bought at a guitar store was my PRS and that was in 1997. I haven't bought one from a guitar store since but somehow I've acquired about 15 more guitars in the past 20 years.

There seem to some confusion as what the OP and the article was about . The article was about What was going on at the NAMM trade show . And the declining sales of new electric guitars. And the fact that sales of new guitars in general have been flat since 2005

While no doubt the expanded access to used via ebay may be taking away from sales of new , trying to factor that into the new sales figures would be nye impossible to do accurately So in this case used guitars sales do not factor into the market concerns for guitar manufactures or retailers, any more than enhanced access to used car sales factor into the market concerns for auto mfg's or dealerships. There has always been a big market in used but that is a different discussion

I think we are probably safe to assume that sales of any new guitars on ebay and Amazon is included in the overall sales figures.

[Laughingboy68]

Originally Posted by rogthefrog

Jack White
Ed Sheeran
John Mayer
Taylor Swift
Julian Lage
Guthrie Govan
Tosin Abasi
Andy McKee
Synyster Gates
Claudio Sanchez
Derek Trucks
Calum Graham
Joe Bonamassa

Gruhn just isn't paying attention. Not knowing them doesn't mean they don't exist and inspire millions to pick up the guitar, just like Clapton and Page did.

The main difference is they're not dominating TV and radio like they did in the 70s, because TV and radio don't matter anymore. And they don't wear tight leather or spandex pants.

But these are absolutely guitar gods to the listening public.

George Gruhn has owned a guitar store in Nashville for almost 50 years. He has his ear to the ground in one of the most musical cities in the world. Trust that he has a pretty good idea about the state of the industry.