Does your classical have a compensated saddle?

[Dru Edwards]

Hey everyone, does your classical have a compensated saddle? I was reading a book on the back deck last week-end and it stated that classical guitars usually don't have a compensated saddle. I looked at my La Patrie Etude and sure enough, no compensation.

How about yours? Any reason why they're not compensated?

[WaddyT]

Production guitars don't have them because it takes time to compensate a saddle, and the results are small for the time invested. The only note with a major impact is the g, and there are other ways to work around that by adjusting the tuning to make it play within an acceptable range.

Most luthier built guitars willl have compensation as the investment in time is small compared to the overall construction time. Also, most of us are looking for every way possible to make our guitars better. Not the mind-set of the manufacturer.

[mc1]

i think in general the saddle on a classical is compensated equally across all strings something like 2 mm.

because the strings are much closer in size (mass?) between the trebles and basses, classical guitars don't require compensation in the same way that steel strings do. as waddyt mentions, it's really only the G string that may need a different compensation from the others.

that is my layperson's understanding.

[DeliciousBass]

Originally Posted by Dru Edwards

How about yours? Any reason why they're not compensated?

I think most are compensated on the G. At least, my very low end Yamaha c40 is. My understanding is that compensation intends to account for varying string thickness... Nylon string being more uniform in thickness, require less compensation than steel.

[fitness1]

I've compensated all of mine for the last few years......just use a half round needle file and take material away on a 45 degree (or so) angle. If you take the time (and can actually hear correctly - a big part of it!) you can experience big returns.

Here's the Ramirez I did most recently - It was pretty good "out of the box" but some require fine tuning on almost every string.



and in contrast, here's my Cordoba C9....



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[Dru Edwards]

Originally Posted by mc1

i think in general the saddle on a classical is compensated equally across all strings something like 2 mm.

because the strings are much closer in size (mass?) between the trebles and basses, classical guitars don't require compensation in the same way that steel strings do. as waddyt mentions, it's really only the G string that may need a different compensation from the others.

that is my layperson's understanding.

That's what the book said too, that the strings are much closer in size, not sure if that meant width or mass.

Originally Posted by fitness1

I've compensated all of mine for the last few years......just use a half round needle file and take material away on a 45 degree (or so) angle. If you take the time (and can actually hear correctly - a big part of it!) you can experience big returns.

Here's the Ramirez I did most recently - It was pretty good "out of the box" but some require fine tuning on almost every string.

<<snippet>>

Todd - great pics! Thanks for the visual examples. How much time do you spend playing classical compared to acoustic?

[fitness1]

Originally Posted by Dru Edwards

That's what the book said too, that the strings are much closer in size, not sure if that meant width or mass.



Todd - great pics! Thanks for the visual examples. How much time do you spend playing classical compared to acoustic?

Probably 20% of my time on the classical these days.

Regarding what was said above about classicals not requiring compensation as much, that is provided the bridge and saddle slot were placed correctly in the first place.

Many times they aren't. 1mm off one way or the other is problematic.

[Paikon]

@ fitness1
Which Ramirez is this? thanks

[fitness1]

Originally Posted by Paikon

@ fitness1
Which Ramirez is this? thanks

125 Anos spruce I have for sale in the classifieds.

[Dru Edwards]

Originally Posted by fitness1

Probably 20% of my time on the classical these days.

Regarding what was said above about classicals not requiring compensation as much, that is provided the bridge and saddle slot were placed correctly in the first place.

Many times they aren't. 1mm off one way or the other is problematic.

LOL, yep, I'm assuming correct placement.

[Garthman]

My old Yamaha G-231II has a compensated saddle (G string is compensated).

[Fire&Rain]

My inexpensive Alvarez classical also has a compensated (G string) saddle.

[Paikon]

Microtuning is great but musicians must have a good ear and knowledge of their instruments because they can go flat or sharp at any time...

[american sinner]

Originally Posted by mc1

i think in general the saddle on a classical is compensated equally across all strings something like 2 mm.

because the strings are much closer in size (mass?) between the trebles and basses, classical guitars don't require compensation in the same way that steel strings do. as waddyt mentions, it's really only the G string that may need a different compensation from the others.

that is my layperson's understanding.

That's what I always thought too. What I know with more confidence is that I've seen many an uncompensated classical with good intonation. Rarely have I seen an uncompensated steel string with good intonation.

[rick-slo]

Nylon strings are not nearly as stiff as steel strings so there is less need for inharmonicity compensation (the angled bridge) as the string gauge increases from 1st to 6th string.