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  #16  
Old 03-01-2009, 01:33 PM
D.Kwasnycia D.Kwasnycia is offline
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When talking about with or without the popsicle brace, are you talking about the brace under the finger board?
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  #17  
Old 03-01-2009, 02:23 PM
Twelvefret Twelvefret is offline
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Quote:
When talking about with or without the popsicle brace, are you talking about the brace under the finger board?
Yes, the long flat one that is labeled "top plate".This is from Bryan Kimsey's web site.

http://www.bryankimsey.com/popsicle/top_plate.jpg

Once this is removed, and you have a totally different guitar. Some argue that this compromised the integrity of the top and it certainly will void your warrantee.

charlie
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  #18  
Old 03-01-2009, 02:26 PM
surfoxy surfoxy is offline
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Originally Posted by Charlie Niall View Post
Once this is removed, and you have a totally different guitar.
That is, in my view, a rather strong overstatement.
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  #19  
Old 03-01-2009, 03:49 PM
Glennwillow Glennwillow is offline
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This has been a very interesting thread for me today. I spent quite a bit of time reading through all the links and learning more about scalloped bracing, popsickle braces, maple vs. rosewood bridge plates, etc.

Much to my surprise, all this time I thought my old D-35 was a 1968, maybe because I bought in the spring of 1969. But looking up the serial number I found it was actually built in early 1967. It doesn't have pre-war scalloped bracing but it does have a maple bridge plate, which is supposed to make it sound better.

My D-35 has always sounded very good, but it was good to obtain a little more background on why.

Thanks to all,
Glenn
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  #20  
Old 03-01-2009, 03:59 PM
fingerstyle2 fingerstyle2 is offline
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If you have access to that mammoth thread I started that went to 3000 plus posts circa May of '07, John A posted a photo of how the modern Martin box shape in more tapered at the top than the pre war Martins.
Chuck,

That one was epic! And I do recall the excellent diagram that John A did.

Do you remember the name of the thread (something about D-18GE?)? Also, I've forgotten what username you went by on UMGF. Having those will help me in using the new Yuku search function.

David
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  #21  
Old 03-01-2009, 04:44 PM
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Groberts Groberts is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rmyAddison View Post
Charlie,
Martin calls the bracing on the 'V's

Standard ''X'' Scalloped, Forward Shifted
and on the Marquis and Golden Eras

Standard ''X'' Scalloped (Golden Era Style), Forward Shifted

and on the Authentics

Standard ''X'' Scalloped (Authentic Style), Forward Shifted
So I wonder out loud; Is there a difference between "Golden era style" versus "Authentic Style?" Or are they they same?
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  #22  
Old 03-01-2009, 07:34 PM
Twelvefret Twelvefret is offline
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Quote:
Do you remember the name of the thread (something about D-18GE?)? Also, I've forgotten what username you went by on UMGF. Having those will help me in using the new Yuku search function.
David,

It was something about, is Martin spacing the bottom of the barrel in relation for using those wide grained and ugly tops. Thank you for taking the time to investigate.

Quote:
That is, in my view, a rather strong overstatement.
This was my experiance after having the modification done on my D-18GE. My picking buddy has a guitar that Brian Kimsey modified that is nothing like any other modern D-18 I have heard. So really it is not an overstatement at all. Why do you think the modern Martin sounds like it has a head cold?

charlie

chuck
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  #23  
Old 03-01-2009, 10:33 PM
John Arnold John Arnold is offline
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For example, the popsicle brace has IIRC always been on the OOOs, but not on the dreads.
Not true. All 14-fret Martins (dread, 000, OM, 00, 0) had no popsicle until mid-1939. The 12-fretters (all sizes) have always had popsicles, presumably because of the longer upper bout.
Quote:
Is there a difference between "Golden era style" versus "Authentic Style?" Or are they they same?
The bracing of the GE Series is a 'rough estimate' of a 1930's Martin, while the Authentics are pretty darn close. The GE's have a larger bridgeplate, tall narrow #3 and #4 back braces, butted (not notched) bracing and bridgeplate intersections, an adjustable truss rod with L-shaped neck block, wider #1 cross brace, and the popsicle (1995 D-18GE excepted).
Authentics also use hide glue.
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  #24  
Old 03-02-2009, 06:24 AM
fingerstyle2 fingerstyle2 is offline
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Chuck,

Here's the link to the monster thread from UMGF: http://theunofficialmartinguitarforu...om/topic/34510

In post #629 of the thread, John Arnold posted the photos below with this text:

The two construction details that really stand out [between D-18 Authentics and 1930's D-18's] are the red spuce braces and the spherical arch of the back. 1930's Martins never had a spherical arch, which makes the sides deeper in the waist area.

Here is a comparison of a D-18A (on the left) and a 1930's D-18. Notice the exaggerated back arch of the D-18A.




Another poster observed that he had seen Martins from all eras with the arched-looking back. John's response:

It's a different arch on the old guitars. They did not have the pronounced arching of the sides that is portrayed in my photo.
The distinction is that the old guitars had a different radius for each back brace, which created a smooth arch when mated to the sides. The sides were hand shaped to fit this back, because the lengthwise radius was different from the crosswise radius.
In the early 1990's, Martin started using a radiused sanding disc to shape the curvature of the sides. The braces have the same radius cut into them. This is what I mean by a spherical arch....the radius is the same in all directions. This results in the exaggerated curvature of the back in a lengthwise direction. It is a different back shape from the older Martins, but it is totally machine generated, which reduces the labor.
When I visited Martin in the 1980's, they were still shaping the kerfing by hand using a #102 block plane, the exact same tool that I use.
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  #25  
Old 03-02-2009, 09:18 AM
Twelvefret Twelvefret is offline
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Quote:
Here's the link to the monster thread from UMGF: http://theunofficialmartinguitarforu...om/topic/34510
David,

Thank you so much. Yes this is the photo I was thinking about. It is good for those interested here to see.

Did you notice that under my name it says banned user.

charlie
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  #26  
Old 03-02-2009, 09:35 AM
Eugenius Eugenius is offline
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I have a question, why does Martin up-charge so much for Scalloped bracing (HD-28 is 500+ more than a standard non scallped D-28 braced guitar) and forward shifted (thousands of dollars more for the authentic or GE or Marquis)?

Seems like a little bit of work for a whole lot of moola no? Or maybe it's more labor intensive that it appears to be?
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