1966? Guild F212XL

MLW781 · #1 10-22-2017, 01:15 PM

I have a Guild F212XL S/N Begins with AE. Owner thinks it's a 1971 model. A google search brought up page 129 from The Guild Guitar Book. AE prefix applies to 1966 per that reference.
The guitar has the Chesterfield logo and label says Hoboken, NJ.
Guitar was rescued from a pawn shop by the owner's brother to keep it from being sold by the shop.
It's a little rough. Has cracks, some repaired. One large crack down the middle of the lower bout is not repaired. Fretboard takes a dive at the top and frets appear to have been leveled to compensate. Tuners are not original. I took it to a luthier. He didn't think he could fix the sunken top but the guitar might benefit from a neck reset and refret.
It plays ok and sounds really good!
Anybody know anything about the history of this guitar? Is it actually a 1966 model? Owner wants to sell and I have no idea what to offer.
Thanks,
Mike

AZLiberty · #2 10-22-2017, 02:09 PM

I was under the impression that the F-212XL was introduced in 1970.

So, I'm thinking it's either an F-212, or from 71 as the previous owner claims.

Guild Serial numbers are fairly well documented, so it "should be" trivial to look up the year of manufacture. AE is not correlated with either the F-212 or F-212AE though. AE is a prefix used on the songbird and on some of the electrics.

So, how about a pic of the back of the headstock? Maybe we can figure it out.

drive-south · #3 10-22-2017, 02:15 PM

Guild moved out of Hoboken around 67 so chances are its not fton the 70s.

Tico · #4 10-22-2017, 02:43 PM

FWIW I have a Guild F-212 XL, SN 1598XX. (fantastic guitar!!!!)
The date stamped under the soundboard near the sound hole (visible with a mirror and flashlight) is Jan 1977.

It is an XL because the lower bout measures 17".
If you want to know whether yours really is an XL measure the lower bout.
If it is under 17" I'd say it is not an XL.

Is F 212-XL hand written on the label?
It is on mine.

ETA: You may want to post this on another forum.
http://www.letstalkguild.com/ltg/for...ustic-Electric

Hans Moust posts there.
He is recognized as the expert on ancient Guild history.
He wrote a reference book about it.
https://www.amazon.com/Guild-Guitar-.../dp/0634009664
It's now out of print (so a new copy is now going for $874.96 ... I'm so glad it's not $875 because that would be expensive

) but the buzz is there is a revision on its way.

Hans will have the definitive answer to your question.

Athens · #5 10-22-2017, 02:48 PM

Guild did a lot of strange things over the years.

After the move from Hoboken they continued to use the stock of existing labels.

The serial number would be your best bet. There are websites online that can tell you beginning and ending serial numbers for every year.

You might also want to post this on the Let's Talk Guild forum as well.

Lots of real Guild heavy hitters over there.

AZLiberty · #6 10-22-2017, 03:16 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by drive-south

Guild moved out of Hoboken around 67 so chances are its not fton the 70s.

Like many other guitar companies (e.g. Larrivee), Guild kept using old labels with the wrong location till stocks were used up. (not sure how many years though)

AZLiberty · #7 10-22-2017, 04:29 PM

So this is pretty odd.

From 1970 to 1979 Guild did not use letter prefixes, just numbers.
--Example: my 1973 F-212 is serial number 83963

Prefixes were used for various model numbers in the 60's and from October of 79 forward.

AE is the prefix for an Electric Bass (SB201 or SB201) and wasn't used until 1979.

A 1960's F-212 should have a prefix AN.
A 1980's F-212 should have a prefix FF and an F-212 FJ.

And as said before the F-212XL was introduced in 1970.

zombywoof · #8 10-22-2017, 05:29 PM

I have no idea what everybody is talking about. The OP is correct. The F-212XL was introduced in 1966 and had an AE prefix in the serial number.

MLW781 · #9 10-22-2017, 05:41 PM

I've posted on the Guild forum as suggested. I have pictures but will have to upload them later.
The serial number stamped on the back of the headstock matches the label inside.
Thanks for the help.

AZLiberty · #10 10-22-2017, 06:16 PM

Serial number list direct from Guild themselves:

http://guildguitars.com/wp-content/u...your_guild.pdf

Br1ck · #11 10-22-2017, 07:59 PM

Anything on a guitar can be fixed. Weather you want to pay for it is another matter. Find a more competent luthier. I'd talk to a guy on the Let's talk Guild forum called Mr. Fixit. THE Guild repair guy by many accounts. Probably worth the freight both ways as he is reasonable as well as good.

As for labels, my Guild D 35 from 1970 has a Hoboken label though decidedly not made there.

Brucebubs · #12 10-22-2017, 08:20 PM

I have a 11th Edition Blue Book and it lists the 1st version of the F-212XL as made in 1966 - 1986 and a 2nd version was made in 1998 -2000.

The F-212XL has 17" lower bout and 5" body depth.

The smaller F-212 was made 1964-1985 and has a 16" lower bout and 4.875" body depth.

H165 · #13 10-22-2017, 09:26 PM

Quote:

AE is the prefix for an Electric Bass (SB201 or SB201) and wasn't used until 1979.

AE was used in the '60s. One of the "centerfold" 12 strings in Hans' book is AE-176; a '60s F-412Spec.

AZLiberty · #14 10-23-2017, 12:49 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by H165

AE was used in the '60s. One of the "centerfold" 12 strings in Hans' book is AE-176; a '60s F-412Spec.

That Hans knows far more than Guild's official info surprises me not one bit.

Really looking forward to the rumored 2nd edition, I can't afford the collector prices the 1st edition is garnering.

zombywoof · #15 10-23-2017, 05:23 AM

I have had a guitar with collapsed tops repaired so yeah, it can be done. The downside was with the sunken top the guitar played perfectly. When repaired it needed a neck reset.