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  #1  
Old 09-19-2017, 12:01 PM
JakeStone JakeStone is offline
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Default OK.. Need some advice hooking up my Gear

Hey all -I need some advice for setting up and connecting my gear for live performance. Hoping to get some clarity.
BTW this is a Small venue 50 seats.
Solo Acoustic singer songwriter sorta thing.

I'd like to keep simple.. Use Guitar and Mic> TCH Perform VG > PA

But when just using my Guitar, Mic, TCH VG and PA ...
Everything "sounds" fine... BUT low volume is an issue!

Seems the line in (on back) of Maui doesn't seem to produce enough volume with just the TC VG alone. I have to nearly max the Maui's controls out. THIS was not the case with my Boss VE-8 or when I use my Yamaha passive mixer.


MY Gear:

PA
Maui 5 Line Array PA w/ 2 XLR Line ins / HiZ and Mic input.

Effect Processor
TC Helicon Perform VG (vocal effects, harmony, guitar effects)
The VG has inputs for both my Acoustic Electric Guitar and standard dynamic mic. but just has 1 combined XLR Output for both

Guitar
Gibson J-45 Guitar with a Highlander "active" under saddle pickup

EXTRA gear If needed
DBX GoRack
Yamaha Mixer
Boss VE-8 Vocal and Effects system

Note - I can use any and all of this gear as needed. But would like to keep this simple as can be and limit gear at venue (space limitation).
That's why I bought the TCH VG unit! To Keep in simple and sound good.

To recap...
Frankly my vocals are much better with the TCH unit over the VE-8..
However, the Guitar is much better with the VE-8.

So I may end up using both...
I can use the Guitar THRU out of the TCH into the VE-8.
Use the VE-8 for just guitar.. Plug it in the XLR on back of Maui.
Which sounds huge with VE-8.

But this still doesn't fix my TCH VG mic volume issue when direct in to Maui XLR.

Maybe someone has the answer.. Or I can utilize the GoRack? ..
Just Need some advice..

Whew... Hope this makes sense.
Thanks for any advice!

HERE are connections -


Last edited by JakeStone; 09-19-2017 at 12:33 PM.
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  #2  
Old 09-19-2017, 12:24 PM
Cuki79 Cuki79 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JakeStone View Post

To recap...
Frankly my vocals are much better with the TCH unit over the VE-8..
However, the Guitar is much better with the VE-8.
Buy a TC Mic Mechanic 1 not 2 (or a second hand voicetone T1).

Look on the left of Mic mechanic 1, you have a white gain pot. On mic mechanic 2 or TC perform VG it sets itself automatically. No control.
However TC perform VG has a "Mic output" so it should be low level and should be plugged into a XLR mic input on the Maui with mic gain.

Buy a BOSS AD-2


Get the best of both world in more compact pedalboard.

If you don't use harmony and looper. Sell the VG and/or the VE-8.

The gain staging issue needs further reflection

Cuki
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Last edited by Cuki79; 09-19-2017 at 12:33 PM.
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  #3  
Old 09-19-2017, 03:09 PM
chris6120 chris6120 is offline
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Hey Jake,

I had the same issue with the Maui 5. It didn't like my guitar into the high Z input. I have a Baggs M80 and it didn't matter if it was passive or active. It only had full gig worthy volume into the 2 XLR's on the back.

I'm sure the answer is likely yes, so this may be a dumb question, but I'm gonna ask it anyway....does the "guitar thru" on the back of the perform VG only output dry guitar with no effects?

In other words, is the only output that passes effected signal, just the single "mic out" on the perform VG?

If the "thru" output is dry (and I assume it is), would something like this female XLR to Dual male XLR adapter let you split your signal from the output of the perform VG dircetly into the XLR inputs on the Maui 5?

https://www.sweetwater.com/store/det...CABEgKvTPD_BwE

If it would, then this would solve your volume problem and seem to be the simplest and cheapest option.
Just a thought...

Chris

Last edited by chris6120; 09-19-2017 at 03:19 PM.
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  #4  
Old 09-19-2017, 03:18 PM
JakeStone JakeStone is offline
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First to answer the question ..

YES the "Thru" passes the guitar signal out Dry. Perfect to send to effects or to an amp. While the XLR output would be just the Mic. Or both of course if not using Thru.

This is one of the cool features that the TC Play Acoustic doesn't have.

As for the sound.... I kinda figured out on my own just now.

Guitar and Mic > TC-VG> GoRack > Maui XLR input on back.

VERY NICE !! .. Loud too!
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  #5  
Old 09-19-2017, 03:22 PM
JakeStone JakeStone is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Cuki79 View Post
Buy a TC Mic Mechanic 1 not 2 (or a second hand voicetone T1).

Look on the left of Mic mechanic 1, you have a white gain pot. On mic mechanic 2 or TC perform VG it sets itself automatically. No control.
However TC perform VG has a "Mic output" so it should be low level and should be plugged into a XLR mic input on the Maui with mic gain.


Get the best of both world in more compact pedalboard.

If you don't use harmony and looper. Sell the VG and/or the VE-8.

The gain staging issue needs further reflection

Cuki
Thanks Cuki!

I'm liking the VG for simplicity ..
Not ready to give up yet and go to individual pedals..

But thanks for the ideas.
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  #6  
Old 09-19-2017, 03:23 PM
chris6120 chris6120 is offline
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Jake,

I just edited my last post above. I think you could actually use the adapter I linked to and bypass the dbx go rack all together if you wanted to keep it super simple.

I have a go rack too, but I can't seem to use it between my little unpowered mixer and the PA without overdriving the inputs on the gorack. I've quadruple checked the gain staging on my play acoustic and the mixer, but it still maxes out and clips the inputs (line or mic) on the gorack.

Sounds like you found a solution that works for you though, so if it aint broke... it don't need fixin... I guess.
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  #7  
Old 09-19-2017, 03:55 PM
chris6120 chris6120 is offline
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Hey Jake,

I just re-read your original post and realized that I completely missed that you were having a mic volume issue going XLR out of the VG, directly into the XLR on the back of the Maui. Thats weird, but now I understand what you were saying (wish I had figured that out before I responded)...

Not trying to hijack your thread, but I have a quick question:

You mentioned that you like what the Boss VE-8 does for your guitar tone a lot better than the body rez in the perform VG...

Do you know if the Boss AD-2 pedal is basically exactly the same as the guitar processing part of the VE-8? (it looks like it is)

What is it about the resonance feature on the Boss unit that you like more than the body rez in the perform VG?

Thanks!
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  #8  
Old 09-19-2017, 04:58 PM
JakeStone JakeStone is offline
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------------------------------
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Old 09-19-2017, 05:18 PM
JakeStone JakeStone is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by chris6120 View Post

You mentioned that you like what the Boss VE-8 does for your guitar tone a lot better than the body rez in the perform VG...

Do you know if the Boss AD-2 pedal is basically exactly the same as the guitar processing part of the VE-8? (it looks like it is)

What is it about the resonance feature on the Boss unit that you like more than the body rez in the perform VG?

Thanks!
Ok.. Thanks for re-reading that helps so I wont reply to the splitter recommendation.
---------

To answer your question on the Boss VE 8.

Yes.. The Boss VE-8 is very robust acoustic guitar pedal and has a ton of features and I/O capabilities.
Much, much more than just the Acoustic Resonance feature!

First off.. To clarify, The Perform VG has only 1 level of Body Rez. Plus it only has effect on/off and a dial to add or take away the effect.

Unlike the Boss that has multi levels of control and several different types of Resonance.
The Boss sounds so much better and warmer. It sounds killer actually. No comparison in the Acoustic Rez department.

Yes I could get AD-2 and it may be similar to the VE8 but I don't know..

The VE8 has so much more.. With a choice of Reverbs and multi level control. Even a tone control for reverb.

Effects.. VE8 has Phaser, Tremolo, Chorus, Delay, Chorus and more. Plus the looper! I can go on and on... The BOSS is robust.

With that said.. I am not satisfied with the Boss's Vocals and Harmonies. It's just not for me.... TCH just kicks azz in this department. Hands down.
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  #10  
Old 09-19-2017, 08:37 PM
martingitdave martingitdave is offline
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Default OK.. Need some advice hooking up my Gear

Perhaps you should use your TC Play Acoustic and increase the gain on each channel and mix with the mixer section of the pedal’s interface? I’m sorry to sound like a defeatist, but I think your making it too difficult with the Perform form factor. I think you need to use the full pedal with that PA system. Can you return the new unit?
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Last edited by martingitdave; 09-19-2017 at 09:43 PM.
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  #11  
Old 09-20-2017, 05:51 AM
JakeStone JakeStone is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by martingitdave View Post
Perhaps you should use your TC Play Acoustic and increase the gain on each channel and mix with the mixer section of the pedal’s interface? I’m sorry to sound like a defeatist, but I think your making it too difficult with the Perform form factor. I think you need to use the full pedal with that PA system. Can you return the new unit?
Yes.. I hear you. I just wanted to try the Perorm VG. So I'm just playing and learning. I have plenty time to return it if it ultimately doesn't work out.

Last night, I connected the Perform VG into the GoRack and this really made my sound come alive.

In addition, my guitar thru the VG and GoRack sounded stellar ... I guess it just need a "boost"!

I don't own the Play Acoustic... I had traded that for the Boss Ve-8.

My point about the VE8 was .. I like the guitar but vocals seem better and easier to dial in on this little VG unit. Who knows .. I may go full circle and return to the trusty Play Acoustic !

As WE all know, most gear has it's quirks and we try to work thru them. Sometimes just need time and trial error.
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  #12  
Old 09-20-2017, 08:56 AM
martingitdave martingitdave is offline
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Default OK.. Need some advice hooking up my Gear

Ah... I see. I didn’t realize that you no longer had the Play Acoustic. Like you, I think the vocals are better with the TC product versus the VE-8. In this case, since you no longer have the pedal, my advice would be to do exactly what you did with the go rack. It has some other benefits with feedback control. It’s just more wires and stuff to remember to bring. But, it should work well.
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  #13  
Old 09-20-2017, 11:08 AM
JakeStone JakeStone is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by martingitdave View Post
Ah... I see. I didn’t realize that you no longer had the Play Acoustic. Like you, I think the vocals are better with the TC product versus the VE-8. In this case, since you no longer have the pedal, my advice would be to do exactly what you did with the go rack. It has some other benefits with feedback control. It’s just more wires and stuff to remember to bring. But, it should work well.

Thanks Dave. Yep..I've been tinkering past couple months. Gearing up for several months of small wine bar and brewery type gigs that I landed..

You bring up a great point... WIRES! I not only need to remember all the stuff. I also don't care for all the clutter (cables, wires, electrical plugs etc) cluttering up my little "stage area".

This was the case I made for the little VG.. But now with added GoRack...plus the Pedal switch .. etc. I still need to re-think. So I haven't given up completely on the Boss or getting another Play Acoustic,
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  #14  
Old 09-22-2019, 08:37 AM
JackB1 JackB1 is offline
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Old thread but why not use a TCH unit solely for vocals and a Boss unit solely for guitar effects? Something like the Boss AD10 + the TCH Harmony Singer 2.
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