Great guitar or great player

[Big Band Guitar]

It is my opinion that 90% of the sound of a instrument is determined by the player.

I an referring to the "tone" of the instrument only. not the type of music or the style of playing although that is also a big factor.

I have heard what is considered a low quality instrument sound great by a great player. I have also heard a high quality instrument sound like crap by a less than stellar player.

I have heard the same instrument played by 2 different players sound very different.

So in conclusion polish your technique first until your getting the best tone out of your instrument that you can. Then go for improvements on your instrument. Finally seek out the instrument that will bring out all the hard work you put into technique. This could take years but the journey would be worth it.

This applies to any instrument.

[fazool]

I'm not even remotely in the same league as a great player but I've observed something as well:

There can be a connection between a guitar player and their particular guitar. Now, some even more great players can elicit great tone from any guitar they pick up.

I am quite pleased with the tone and control I have with my "main" guitar. I play this one about 90% of the time and I feel like I know it so well, I can get all sorts of subtleties out of the sound. When I go to one of my "other" guitars, the tone is meh.....ok. And it's very clear to me that it's my lack of intimacy with that guitar. I know this because one of the guitars USED to be my main guitar and I used to have that connection with that guitar, but it has evaporated over years of not playing it daily - now we are like strangers bumping into each other when I try to play it with those subtleties and nuances.

I doubt myself and feel bad about my tone.

Then I go back to my "main guitar" and everything is right with the world again.

[Mr. Paul]

Originally Posted by Big Band Guitar

...
So in conclusion polish your technique first until your getting the best tone out of your instrument that you can. Then go for improvements on your instrument. Finally seek out the instrument that will bring out all the hard work you put into technique. This could take years but the journey would be worth it.

.

Or, get an instrument that inspires you to play and enjoy the journey.

I thoroughly disagree.

There is only so much "tone" in any instrument. It's the sum of design, materials, and craftsmanship - not necessarily in that order. A skilled player can bring more of that tone out than a mediocre player, but a poor quality instrument will never sound like anything else. I'd rather hear a great player on a mediocre instrument than the reverse, but a great player and great instrument is a much better combination.

[varmonter]

I agree.
I think a good guitar player can make a cheap
guitar sound good but they can make a better
guitar sound even better. A less experienced
player can only benefit from a nicer instrument.

[Woodstock School Of Music]

Originally Posted by Big Band Guitar

I have heard what is considered a low quality instrument sound great by a great player. I have also heard a high quality instrument sound like crap by a less than stellar player.

I have heard the same instrument played by 2 different players sound very different.

I worked in a music store and I can't tell you how many times I heard someone playing and thought "wow that guitar sounds really good" thinking it must be a high end model only to find out it was one of the cheaper guitars played by a really good player. On the opposite side of the spectrum I've heard mediocre players make a $3k guitar sound bad. The difference is night and day

That's not to say any guitar will do with a great player but so much of the tone comes from the player and I think some people underestimate that

[BFD]

Originally Posted by Big Band Guitar

It is my opinion that 90% of the sound of a instrument is determined by the player....

Originally Posted by Todd Yates

I thoroughly disagree...There is only so much "tone" in any instrument....a poor quality instrument will never sound like anything else. I'd rather hear a great player on a mediocre instrument than the reverse, but a great player and great instrument is a much better combination.

I share Todd's opinion that a well played great guitar will sound more than 10% better that a well played piece of crap (tho tone is subjective...). However I think a agree with both and really appreciate a player who can compensate with knowledge and technique for what they may lack in equipment.

[redir]

Tone is a word I reserve for the instrument itself not the playing technique. A great player will not be able to pull a good responsive tone out of a cheap guitar. It just ain't gonna happen. But the fact of the matter is the audience wont care anyway. The tone is more important in the recording studio or very small intimate settings anyway. The technique is important everywhere.

Further, cheap guitars are much better today then they have ever been. But even as much as a decade ago student guitars were terrible for students not so much because they sounded like junk but because they were set up terribly and often times could never be made to play well. So many students would start on a guitar that was difficult to play and simply give up.

[taylorgtr]

Originally Posted by Todd Yates

I thoroughly disagree.

There is only so much "tone" in any instrument. It's the sum of design, materials, and craftsmanship - not necessarily in that order. A skilled player can bring more of that tone out than a mediocre player, but a poor quality instrument will never sound like anything else. I'd rather hear a great player on a mediocre instrument than the reverse, but a great player and great instrument is a much better combination.

There may only be so much tone in an instrument, but in the past 10-15 years, instrument quality has become MUCH more consistent, even across lower-end brands and models.

When I started playing in the '70s, Japanese guitars (outside of Yamaha's better models) were pretty much crap. I know, I had one. Then it was Korean guitars are crap, Mexican guitars, then Chinese and Indonesian guitars.....

What's happened is that manufacturers learned how to standardize their tooling assembly and setup so that it's actually hard to find a 'bad' guitar. Sure, there are better, prettier, more exotic ones, and fully custom guitars can play and sound amazing, but if you had Tommy Emmanuel play an Eastman E8OM and his $3K Maton signature model, most people wouldn't be able to pick out the 'better' guitar - at a minimum, they wouldn't say 'that's a crappy guitar'.

On the other hand, If you hand me a brand new Taylor V-series 914, I doubt it would sound much better than me playing my 20-year old 514ce.

[rmgjsps]

The difference between a great player and a mediocre to good player is that the great player can get all that there is to get out of an instrument -- regardless of the quality of the instrument. But even a great player cannot get more than the guitar has in it intrinsically. A merely good player can't get it all, and a poor to mediocre player doesn't have any real sense of what possibilities lie within the instrument in their hands.

I think that it comes down to the difference between playing music and being a musician. I'm in the former category, but I strive every day to learn a little more and become just that much better.

[rick-slo]

Topic comes up about every five seconds.

Potential range of tone is inherent in the guitar itself. Different players may bring out different areas of that range. Different players may be capable of different
levels of "musicality" (as determined at least in part by the listener's specific music background and ears) but that should not subsume the topic of tone.

[Rmz76]

Originally Posted by rick-slo

Topic comes up about every five seconds.

Potential range of tone is inherent in the guitar itself. Different players may bring out different areas of that range. Different players may be capable of different
levels of "musicality" (as determined at least in part by the listener's specific music background and ears) but that should not subsume the topic of tone.

I agree with Derek. Great players find the right tool to complement their playing, or the right tool to inspire them. People who make this argument that lesser quality instruments can be just as good in the right hands, like to point to players like Ed Sheeran. In all cases like Ed Sheeran's if you look at what they are doing with the inexpensive guitar you find it has properties that give it some advantage. His $400 all laminate Little Martin for example delivers exactly what his looper need for percussive playing. When he wants to put the looper away he usually pulls out a custom Martin 00-28vs which I'd guessing would retail between $5000-$6000.

You see videos sometimes of great players using cheap guitars for the novelty of it. The execution is there so the song comes through, played better than most of us could play it, but tone is always compromised. That is to say that it could sound much better on a higher quality instrument.

[Cap'n Spanky]

Originally Posted by Todd Yates

I thoroughly disagree.

There is only so much "tone" in any instrument. It's the sum of design, materials, and craftsmanship - not necessarily in that order. A skilled player can bring more of that tone out than a mediocre player, but a poor quality instrument will never sound like anything else. I'd rather hear a great player on a mediocre instrument than the reverse, but a great player and great instrument is a much better combination.

Hmm. Gotta respectfully say I thoroughly disagree with you. Different guitars will have different timbres, dynamics, and overtones. More expensive guitars will often have a more refined and balanced set of timbres, dynamics, and overtones.

But 95% of what a guitar is going to sound like depends on the player. A great player knows how to make almost any guitar sound amazing. The differences between an expensive guitar and a medium priced guitar in the hands of a great player will be subtle.

[L20A]

Interesting topic.
My first thought was that it's a 50/50 partnership between the guitar and the player.
Then as I read some of the posts I have to agree that the instrument is only as good as the player.

The best example that I can think of would be David Rawlings and his old Epiphone.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PyWTzAoZhzE

[varmonter]

if a guitar is set up in a playable fashion like
sheerans . then it can sound great amplified.
But the sound is more the electronics then the
guitar itself. i am sure ed sheeran has a crew
of techs to insure this. And he is of course an excellent
player.