Soundboard transducer for a parlor guitar

[Truckjohn]

Hey guys.

I am finishing up a small guitar build and I want to put a pickup in it.

I haven't really fooled with electronics... So I don't know much about what's out there other than hearing names in passing.

This is a guitar with a tailpiece and floating bridge - so I can't use a UST... I need something to stick to the underside of the soundboard.

I would prefer something that doesn't need a preamp...

Thanks

[leew3]

I suspect you'll get a lot of recommendations for the K & K minis. I have them in my mandolin and they produce a clean and relatively hot signal. I run it through an outboard preamp to tweak the sound a bit but have played it straight into a powered speaker on occasion and it still sounds good.

[C.F. Angee]

Originally Posted by Truckjohn

I need something to stick to the underside of the soundboard.

I would prefer something that doesn't need a preamp...

K&K Minis are highly respected here.

I just had a JJB Prestige 330 installed in my Martin dread. It's mechanically identical to a K&K. Going passive to my amp it sounds warm and full and natural.

I like the idea that if I ever decide I want a preamp it can sit outside of my guitar and be easily liftable as technology and my needs change.

[Truckjohn]

Yep. I would rather have an outboard preamp...

While I understand the convenience of having knobs and levers to diddle with right there on the side of the guitar - my issue is that these setups go obsolete about every year or 2... Lots of folks with older onboard preamp systems now can't get parts and have to contend with a big ugly hole that doesn't fit the new model unit.

But where are you guys at? Sound board transducer? Internal soundhole mounted mic? Etc.

[kaos]

Something to consider ... the size of the transducer has an effect on bass. I have heard the K&Ks are 12mm. The JJBs are 15mm or 20mm. Having dreadnaughts (with plenty of bass), I have always ordered the 15mm.

Just something to consider for your parlor guitar. Of course this is all subject to how much space you have on the sound board behind the bridge pins. I have had a few guitars where there was not a lot of space to mount them.

[Truckjohn]

This has a floating bridge with a tailpiece. Think old Stella.

There are no bridge pins or pin holes to contend with.

[kaos]

Originally Posted by Truckjohn

This has a floating bridge with a tailpiece. Think old Stella.

There are no bridge pins or pin holes to contend with.

Great ... so you should be able to use any size of your choosing!

[Vancebo]

Consider the handmade Dazzo. Occasionally, people get a bad install on the K and K and are in need of a better placement. The K and K are nearly impossible to pop off and remove without causing damage to them and rendering at least one of the three useless. The Dazzos sound even more acoustic to my ear and are easily removable if needed.

[ljguitar]

Originally Posted by kaos

Something to consider ... the size of the transducer has an effect on bass. I have heard the K&Ks are 12mm. The JJBs are 15mm or 20mm. Having dreadnaughts (with plenty of bass), I have always ordered the 15mm.

Hi kaos
It's critical with parlor guitars and other small bridge-plated instruments.

And the K&K are hot enough to work well without a preamp, though I think they sound even better with one. They are actually the hottest output signal I've ever worked with from passive pickups.

The K&K Pure Mini individual 'pods' are 12.5mm (vs 15mm for JJB) which is a lot of extra real estate when you realize it gives you 5mm of extra play in that confined area over 15mm. My experience is 15mm and beyond sensors (the old K&K Pure Western) are way too bassy.

I know on my Bashkin OM, there would not be enough room under the bridge plate for 20mm sensors, and the 12.5 of the K&K gave the luthier a tiny bit of wiggle room over even 15mm sensors when installing them to get proper alignment. I actually have them in two OM sized guitars, a Dreadnought, and mini-Jumbo and they sound and work great in all of them.

[Marshall]

Originally Posted by Truckjohn

Yep. I would rather have an outboard preamp...

While I understand the convenience of having knobs and levers to diddle with right there on the side of the guitar - my issue is that these setups go obsolete about every year or 2... Lots of folks with older onboard preamp systems now can't get parts and have to contend with a big ugly hole that doesn't fit the new model unit.

But where are you guys at? Sound board transducer? Internal soundhole mounted mic? Etc.

The Schatten HFN is an excellent soundboard transducer. And it doesn't get glued in place, so it can be replaced later with no effect. And if you go for the internal preamp with soundhole thumb wheel V&T controls, it has everything right there with no cosmetic change to the guitar.

Or you can go with the plain un-preamped HFN and use an outboard belt clip preamp. Schatten's Mini-Pre works great for that. I have both systems installed in 4 guitars. I love them. And I do the install myself with no tools, no glue, and no problems.

And it's all reversible at some later date if something "better" comes along.




It looks like the old LR Baggs iBeam. But it's much better.

[emmsone]

I'm definitely going to add my recommendation for the Dazzo.

I just recently installed one in my self-made guitar. Its a 12 fret guitar and my original inspiration was the Taylor GC shape, my shape is similar but with a slightly wider and squarer (relatively) lower bout. So its basically a parlour but slightly beefier.

I went with the Dazzo + mi-si endpin preamp option and I am absolutely loving it, its fantastic. I wouldn't say its 'easier' to install than the k&k/JJB pickups as theres nothing complicated there, but it certainly isn't harder. Its just a slightly different technique and the fact that The Dazzo install doesn't use superglue just gives you less stress and panic about initial perfect placement.

Just one word of warning though. My initial test straight after the install I put it through my little mini Roland Mobile Cube practice amp (3" speakers) it didn't sound quite right and wasn't sounding at all like I expected or what I wanted, but the next day I put it through a borrowed JBL 12" powered speaker and suddenly it came alive!!! Teddy told me afterwards that the Dazzos are designed to be used with larger speakers/systems and its definitely the case.

Amusingly several times i've plugged it in and wondered if it was on mute until the volume was later turned up significantly because of how close the amplified sound is to the guitars actual sound. Its a weird sensation and i'm not used to it yet.

I've found it needs significantly less EQing than my JJB equipped dread. although thats not really a fair comparison, having 2 different pickups in 2 different sized guitars. What I can say though is that now i'd definitely put another Dazzo in another guitar, the JJB does its job and does its job decently well, but I from what I hear, I think the Dazzo is at least a noticeable level above.

David