Decision time - Traditional PA or Bose L1

[Normonster]

Hey Everyone!

I have a decision to make. I've searched all over and read some good discussion on this, but thought I'd solicit fresh replies before I make a purchase.

I'm doing the standard acoustic/bass/vocal type thing right now, but I like the idea of being able to extend my system or use it for other purposes in the future, so that is why I am focusing on PAs instead of acoustic combo amps.

It is really down to 2 choices:
Bose L1 Compact
Two Mackie SRM 350V3 speakers and speaker stands (I have mixers)

The only downside to the Mackie route that I can figure is the lack of a bass module, but my bass player has a system of his own and I can always add one later. Well, that and the extra setup and the weight of all of it. The plus side seems pretty obvious with huge SPL levels vs. the L1.

Anyone have any input?

[alohachris]

Aloha Normonster,

I've survived over 10,000+ mainly solo gigs over 53 years, playing through every imaginable venue, condition, challenge, audience, & type of amplification, including the Bose L1 & all types (crappy, lousy & great) PA systems.

I highly recommend choosing a good PA over the Bose L1 System w/ one subwoofer & the T-2 Tonematch mixer - especially if more than one player is playing through it - for the following reasons: (NOTE: I'm not talking about the Bose Compact here):

- A two-speaker quality (like the Mackie - but also check out the QSC "K" Series)) PA allows you to be heard & sound good in every situation, whether solo or with a band

- A PA provides more room coverage, a larger soundstage & penetration in larger, close crowds, or in oddly shaped rooms,

- Some gear, like compressors, limiters, loopers & stereo FX, etc. works better with a two-source PA,

- A PA will enable you to generate more different types of gigs (indoor & outdoor) than an amp or L1 System - especially with a band,

- If a gig suddenly gets crowded & loud, a PA will serve you better much better than the L1 System - which tends to disappear,

- A PA gives you more MUCH MORE COMPLETE SOUND outdoors & in larger venues,

- A PA works much better if other musicians sit-in with you than the L1 System,

- A PA gives you the option of only taking one speaker to small gigs,

I love the Bose L1 System I or II for smaller, mellower gigs like high-end restaurants, concerts (two in stereo is best) or house concerts & have used them many times. Very nice live acoustic sound.

However, I also had to use an LI Model 1 (w/ a single sub & T-2 Tonematch mixer) for three years (club owner's decree) in a very loud wine/cheese bar with tons of loud cackling drunken hens very close to the stage. It NEVER worked. No one could hear anything, let alone me & my partner - even after we'd built a raised stage for the L1. No coverage. No crowd penetration. It was as if the L1 disappeared in those conditions (which many live gigs are).

Never had those issues with the JBL EON15G2 two-source PA I used for many years or, NEVER with the high-end Pendulum SPS-1/Daedalus 803 PA rig I've used for every gig in the last 12 years.

If you play a wide variety of gigs & venues, my experience has been that a PA will win out every time. No matter how nice the Bose LI System is in quieter settings, a PA is more practical for a gigger who plays all over the place. Go for a PA, Normonstah! A PA is simply more flexible for different types of gigs.

Good Luck, Normonster

alohachris

PS: I'm not talking about forceful, high volumes here, or slamming an audience with volume. I'm talking about being able to provide high quality reinforcement that meets my ears' demanding requirements for the best, balanced live acoustic sound & room control I can achieve in every gigging situation. There is a big difference. - alohachris-

[buzzardwhiskey]

Size and weight are not bad reasons for choosing Bose, but they're the only ones that I can hear.

[Cochese]

I used the original L1 when it first came out for 5 years and hundreds of gigs. It's a nice sounding system and works well when you are on top of people in a small situation. It does not work well in a crowded room, if you're on the floor and sometimes you are against the wall which makes it really tough to monitor yourself with it. You should be a few feet in front of it. It is also not the most dependable system and when it breaks you're kind of stuck. Plus it has limited flexibility and too costly for the cheap piece of Chinese plastic that it is.

If you want that type of format go with RCF EVOX but they are pricey. I replaced my Bose system about 5-6 years ago with a pair of QSC K10's and don't miss the Bose at all.

[Normonster]

Originally Posted by Cochese

.... a pair of QSC K10's...

Yep. I think I need a pair as well. They are expensive though!! OMG. I think I'll start with just one...lol.

Thank you everybody for your replies.

[lschwart]

Originally Posted by Normonster

Yep. I think I need to grow a pair as well. Those b@stards are expensive as hell though!! OMG. I think I'll start with just one...lol.

Thank you everybody for your replies.

Also look at the Yamaha DBR and DXR and the RCF Art 300 ranges for other high quality choices at price-points below the QSC K's.

Louis

[Goat Mick]

The comments on the Bose L1 system in this thread so far are completely opposite of what I've experienced. It really sounds like these comments are in reference to the Bose L1 Compact system. I've got one of those and they're awesome for a solo singer / songwriter playing to 200 people or less. I've played a bunch of gigs with mine and it has never failed me. I can't recommend it enough for its intended purpose.

I have played several times through my friend's Bose L1 system with the dual subwoofers and it is a very impressive unit. I've opened for him several times at large outdoor gigs with his band. Over 500 people. And with acoustic guitar, vocals and drums going through the Bose and electric guitar and bass being carried by their amps there was more than enough clean headroom for more than enough volume for the gigs.

[krisls]

I did a similar weigh up some time back and was closely looking at the Sa220. Ultimately went with a pair of K10's and mixer to suit the varied places I play. The Fishman or Bose units are great depending what you are doing. But for me the pair of speakers was a better option.

As has been mentioned the closest competitors to the Ks are probably the Yam DXR's , slightly more hi fi to my ears than the K's which may be nicer for some. Also not far behind are the lower cost the Yam DBR's. RCF,s are nice too.

Kris

[myersbw]

Originally Posted by Normonster

Yep. I think I need to grow a pair as well. Those b@stards are expensive as hell though!! OMG. I think I'll start with just one...lol.

Thank you everybody for your replies.

'monster, there are quite a few overly-expensive systems out there (camping on reputation). If you're handy with a few tools and/or refurbishing, just keep in mind you can build one heck of a system that rivals everything you mentioned. I've done the Bose cloning route...it's not difficult, fun to achieve and still save yourself a good chunk of money. (Duratex makes a fine durable finish you can roll on)...just sayin!

[The Bard Rocks]

I have a set of Mackie 450s and the Bose Compact. I rarely play outdoors or in larger venues. When I do, I use the Mackies and use the Bose as a monitor of sorts. But the rest of the time, it's the Bose, even for Farmer's markets, any place where LOUD is not needed. It does surprisingly well. In my situation it covers well, sounds great, and is easily heard. But I don't play loud, no drums, no electric bass. It sets up quicker, weighs one fourth of the Mackies with stands, and takes up lots less space in the car.

But the Mackies do sound a bit better, not much, but a discernible fraction better. They ought to, given their price and size. Both have enough bass to suit me well. I am happy with both.

[hotroad]

Without knowing how much you plan to spend, and after doing thousands of shows over the fifty years of performing, I have settled now on two (2) separate Shertler Unico amps. These are combo amps of the highest quality with a ton of Bass if needed. They are four channel with some great eq once you figure them out. I have mine on poles and run them in stereo using the direct out from one to the other but also separate inputs for guitar and vocals. Its amazing what one can do with two high end amps like this. And if its a small gig, one is sufficient for a audience up to 100 people or a restaurant or bar. There is plenty of headroom, volume, eq, tone shaping, notch, and they look awesome in wood. They are not the lightest things but not too bad, nothing like Mackie's or many others. I would suggest you avoid the sub unless you plan to do dances or DJ at weddings etc. You don't need the sub if you have good speakers and the amp to drive them. The Unico's have built in amps of course so I don't have to carry a separate amp and run the cords. Its a fairly clean and top notch set up. The Shertler Unico's run about $1200 each on the street, new. Good luck with it all.

[Paultergeist]

What alohachris said.......that.......me too.

[The Blood]

I've owned the vaunted QSC's and Mackie 450's and others and played hundreds of gigs in all situations, and none of those spread the sound through a space like the Bose compact.

I recently did a trio gig in a large wooden room in which I've played many times with conventional speakers and in the past the sound turned to mush once the room got full. Invariably. Last week I set the compact up and warned my players that we were going to jam on simple forms when it got noisy, if you know what I mean. But the crowd was grooving on the tunes and the sound was apparently getting out there, mysteriously enough and unexpectedly, really.

I've read the many testaments about the QSC's and other conventional outfits and it is completely at odds with my in the field experience. I have other examples of the same thing: where people are hearing the music in rooms where it was not reaching with my prior systems. For me its a lesson in how contradictory information can be on the internet, and how important it is to actually try the equipment out and draw your own conclusions.

[Normonster]

Man, I so appreciate all of your replies, gentlemen. Very cool. Back in the day when I was completely consumed by music there was no such thing as forums like these (or youtube videos that literally show you how to play entire songs). The world is a beautiful place.

My backstory is a decade plus of metal (vocals only) and a hundred gigs or so and then 10 years of inactivity, during which I sold my whole PA (dual 15" EV Elimnator II's, Cerwin Vega subs, Mackie 3,600 watt AMP, Alesis rack mixer, BBE, etc). I was competing with two full stacks + dual 15" subs under each and the loudest drummer you have ever (not) heard (but you can... www.soundcloud.com/normonster - Reverse Order was the name of that band).

Lugging all that stuff around was horrid and I made up my mind that if I ever came back around to it I'd be getting some powered speakers and not having a giant rack.

Now, I have learned how to play guitar to some degree and have some songs worked out and a bass player and I intend to do some acoustic gigs and see where it goes. The main reason I am going the PA route instead of the combo route is that I am (in my own humble opinion) a much better singer than player, especially when I combine the two, and my musical preference is wide ranging now, so I am liable to just join a band as a front man, maybe switch up to metal again, possibly go country if I find the right people...etc....flexible and expandable, I guess, are the keys to what I need in terms of gear. I might even end up DJing, or if all else fails, I'll use this gear as a stereo in the man cave.

I ended up taking the leap of faith and buying the lower cost JBL (two for the price of one QSC with similar SPLs and ratings, from what I could tell). I just ordered one to test it out and if I like it I'll get another one. My most pressing need is just to amp for practice, so that need will be met. If I end up with the whole JBL EON system I figure the quality will be above average and if the day comes I can just get a modeling processor for an electric and use the PA as my guitar rig also. I would have gone Mackie from my experience, but just got a Mackie mixer and it looks like the quality of their gear has gone down hill and the reviews of the SRMs are not so great (plus they don't put the word Mackie on anything anymore, which bothers me)..

Thanks again for all the help. I'll resurrect this thread if I have anything to say about the EON.

[SpruceTop]

I auditioned a JBL EON ONE for the first time, yesterday, at my local Guitar Center. I plugged-in a new, just-arrived Taylor 614ce, and was thoroughly impressed with the JBL EON ONE and the Taylor! JBL has a WINNER with the new JBL EON ONE! I want one!